Thought I would start a new thread, in the hopes that maybe someone else could use the info I am gaining on my own birds. I noticed one of my birds gaping, than another and possibly one more. They had liquid dark brown, runny poop. I started researching worms and came across a lot of info on gapeworm. Well at first I was certain it was gapeworm, even though it's really rare in chickens, now, well it could be SOME kind of worm, although I have not seen any worms come out of them. I did the standard treatment of 2 days of safeguard, 3ml per gallon of water, and intended to retreat in the ten days. The one bird I first noticed, started gaping again after 2-4 days of stopping the first treatment. Their poop had started to look a bit better, a little less runny, more firm with small runny poop with it, but rapidly went right back to all runny. I looked and looked, on here, on Google, and could not find any answers, then stumbled on a thread on here, that talked about worming and found that gape, like tapeworm, is hard to eradicate. This was in the middle of retreating them with the meds in the water. Also read that treating orally, for any worms, and with valbazen, is much better. I am now on day 5 of treating with the safeguard in the water, as I can't find info on whether I can switch, mid treatment, to the oral treatment. There poop is ALMOST back to normal now. Still a few with partial runny poops, and no, it is not cecal poo's. I did a deep clean, again, as we had cocci back last summer, yesterday. I really cleaned it too. EVERYTHING got scrubbed with ammonia..all I had on hand and hosed down for a long long time, and dried really well. Have dumped all the bedding to burn tonight in a pile on the gravel drive. This is the second time I have had to burn a ton of bedding..sigh. I really don't know if we have gapeworm, or some other worm, but it seems funny that they would start to show improvement after the first treatment, then get worse, then after starting retreatment, at night of day 6, from stopping first treatment, and they again are showing a lot of improvement. Poop is better, each day I see improvement. Overall behavior better and more active. They look like they are putting weight on, instead of eating tons and losing weight. I guess the proof is in the pudding...we had some kind of worm problem. I think it is gapeworm and if I see signs again, I will get a fecal float done to see. I am going to keep treating them, in the water I guess, since it is working. Then after they stop the runny poo's totally for two days, stop. I hope that will be by day 7. I have read also, and please correct me if I am wrong, that I can treat them for 14 days straight with no lasting ill affects? I am also going to treat this as the first treatment, as I also read that gapeworm will detect the meds in the blood and stop feeding for 1-2 days, so the 2 day treatment, was of no use at all. I also read, that with gape, I should have been treating orally, 3 times in 10 days. If we have this issue again, I will try that method, but mid stride here, I am not sure if I should switch! I hope this helps others that are in the same shoes as I am. That is my intention, in writing this whole mess out! I will update when I stop treatment and if I have to retreat, which I do think I will...but will wait and see as the time comes for it. I think it's possible, that by making the chickens insides not "right" for any worms for an extended time, I can eradicate this if it is gapeworm. I will build them back up with eggs and buttermilk in between treating, as I did the first time. Thank you all, for all you have shared and written on here, as it has helped so much, in my decision process and my birds health!!! I still don't know how I am going to "fix" my run, as earthworms are the primary vector for gapeworm.