Necropsy results: Fatty Liver

[ChicNmom]

I had one less than a year old die from fatty liver hemorrhage.

I feel like it's hard to get a hen to lose weight once it's on.

My husband was stuffing them full of grain. Then I had to be away a lot for a year when my mom had pancreatic cancer. While I was gone he stuffed them full of fruit and white bread.

I put a stop to most of it but I know he still gives them grain because he puts down so much they can't eat it all when I'm not home.
The 5 hens I've tried to slim down are still about the same size.
Maybe a few ounces off but not noticeably thinner and I've been working at it for the past year. They aren't that active. They camp out by the door hoping for food to come out.

He has been forbidden to do that with our new girls.

I've been buying the occasional head of lettuce from the store or some cabbage as treats. They also get extra cucumbers or zucchini from the garden.

I have also done as suggested giving them a mash of feed and water. They think it's a treat and it was a big hit when it was extremely hot.

Do you have things for them to get on in their coop/run? Like logs or higher perches to encourage them to move around? Or you could throw in some leaves or something for them to dig through to get them moving since you can't let them out.


Mine have feed available all the time. I don't think they over eat feed in general.

 

[Bawkbok]

I'm sorry that happened to you. It doesn't sound like you did anything wrong based on reading this thread. Any loss is devastating.

After reading this I have some questions:

1. I didn't realize bugs and grass were fatty. How does one know if your hen is eating too many bugs or too much grass and other greens while free ranging?
Our new pullets here only a week now are 15-20 weeks old, are not ranging yet as they are too small and I'm afraid I won't be able to get them back to the coop - too many options for perching elsewhere. That said, I pluck grass and greens from the yard every day and give it to them in the run. They attack it like a kid does pizza. Is doing this a bad thing? I thought they needed grass daily in their diet to keep them healthy...?

2. What is considered high energy food? I provide no human food or table scraps but they do get live (and sometimes freeze dried) meal worms about 4x a week or some "organic" seeds from TSC. I'll be eliminating these based on this content. It is less than 10% of their diet and it is how I am training them to come to the shaker cup so I can get them back when I do free range them.

3. I provide no scratch - whatever that is. I do occasionally take some of their food and put it in a dish with some water. They initially take to this like bees to honey but then walk away after a few bites. Does adding water to the feed change the composition in any way?

4. How do you know if they are gaining weight too quickly while growing? Based on breed? Are there physical characteristics to watch for?

We are feeding 18% medicated starter. Of course, the 7 month old is also eating this. No one is laying yet.

Sorry to tag onto this thread but hoping my questions might also help someone else. Feed is a very confusing topic when it comes to chickens.

 

[Sally PB]

My chickens' favorite "treat" is their regular feed, wetted into a mash. It's also a great way to use up the fine bits that fall to the bottom of the bowl.

If it's hot, I make it with cold water. In the winter, I make it with warm water.

 

[Dynamissa]

I had one less than a year old die from fatty liver hemorrhage.

I feel like it's hard to get a hen to lose weight once it's on.

My husband was stuffing them full of grain. Then I had to be away a lot for a year when my mom had pancreatic cancer. While I was gone he stuffed them full of fruit and white bread.

I put a stop to most of it but I know he still gives them grain because he puts down so much they can't eat it all when I'm not home.
The 5 hens I've tried to slim down are still about the same size.
Maybe a few ounces off but not noticeably thinner and I've been working at it for the past year. They aren't that active. They camp out by the door hoping for food to come out.

He has been forbidden to do that with our new girls.

I've been buying the occasional head of lettuce from the store or some cabbage as treats. They also get extra cucumbers or zucchini from the garden.

I have also done as suggested giving them a mash of feed and water. They think it's a treat and it was a big hit when it was extremely hot.

Do you have things for them to get on in their coop/run? Like logs or higher perches to encourage them to move around? Or you could throw in some leaves or something for them to dig through to get them moving since you can't let them out.


Mine have feed available all the time. I don't think they over eat feed in general.

I throw some straw in there and they enjoy scratching around in that, or the loose soil for dust baths. They like to jump Up on the nest boxes as well as our Coop is on stilts in the run so they have floor Space underneath but it’s tight maneuvering because the damn thing is a a half circle instead of a square (paid for a crappy run from wayfair and ended up building off it for what we could with wood)… I’ve been looking for some things to stick in there without having to do limbo when I go inside.

I was thinking about adding a Chunnel to a less
Fortified little space for some pseudo foraging but we’re under red maples
Which I’ve read are toxic.

They like to run around and chase each other and flap all over the place but I know it’s way more ideal
To free range.

Ugh I just.. I’m just so worried for the rest of them.

 

[Dynamissa]

I'm sorry that happened to you. It doesn't sound like you did anything wrong based on reading this thread. Any loss is devastating.

After reading this I have some questions:

1. I didn't realize bugs and grass were fatty. How does one know if your hen is eating too many bugs or too much grass and other greens while free ranging?
Our new pullets here only a week now are 15-20 weeks old, are not ranging yet as they are too small and I'm afraid I won't be able to get them back to the coop - too many options for perching elsewhere. That said, I pluck grass and greens from the yard every day and give it to them in the run. They attack it like a kid does pizza. Is doing this a bad thing? I thought they needed grass daily in their diet to keep them healthy...?

2. What is considered high energy food? I provide no human food or table scraps but they do get live (and sometimes freeze dried) meal worms about 4x a week or some "organic" seeds from TSC. I'll be eliminating these based on this content. It is less than 10% of their diet and it is how I am training them to come to the shaker cup so I can get them back when I do free range them.

3. I provide no scratch - whatever that is. I do occasionally take some of their food and put it in a dish with some water. They initially take to this like bees to honey but then walk away after a few bites. Does adding water to the feed change the composition in any way?

4. How do you know if they are gaining weight too quickly while growing? Based on breed? Are there physical characteristics to watch for?

We are feeding 18% medicated starter. Of course, the 7 month old is also eating this. No one is laying yet.

Sorry to tag onto this thread but hoping my questions might also help someone else. Feed is a very confusing topic when it comes to chickens.

These are good questions.

I’ve lost any confidence in what I was doing after this. I already had anxiety but it’s through the roof at this point after all this.

 

[Bawkbok]

Chopped wood stumps or supportive tree limbs make good perches. We even put an old teak shower seat in there along with a ceramic flower pot and filled it with dirt. They use all the items and it gives them a variety. It junks up the run but they have points of interest and they get their exercise by jumping up and down and climbing on things since they are not ranging right now.

 

[FrostRanger]

I wouldn't worry about the red maple, chickens are pretty good about not eating toxic plants as long as they have a choice. The pullet you lost was likely just due to bad luck but reducing treats is probably still a good idea. Your other birds will probably be fine. Grieve your loss, dust yourself off, improve what can be improved upon and understand bad luck happens to everyone, some things are bound to happen no matter what you do or don't do. All we do is manage as best we can with what we have and what we know

For the record I am also of the opinion that the extra protein had nothing to do with this, your girl probably had some genetic issues going on unfortunately

 

[Bawkbok]

I know what you mean, Dynamissa. I feel I'm failing my girls with too much food stuff and now I'm a bit worried. Only feed - that's it for a week here. I'll feel like I'm starving them and they so love the special treats. I won't be providing grass for them anymore either.
I know it's better to under feed our dogs, to keep them slender. It sounds like doing the same for chickens is the right thing...

 

[Debbie292d]

Any opinions on whether or not to free feed or should I be controlling that somehow?

We have always had food out 24/7.

They are on all-flock 20%, oyster shells on the side, and treats are Kalmbach's Henhouse Reserve, kale, or scrambled eggs. Never any added corn or scratch. Sometimes for a rare treat, a bit of fruit/vegetables from the garden.

These are silkies and all very healthy.

 

[My Very First 6 Chickens]

Personally I think free feeding isn't the issue. If it was my flock, I wouldn't change the feed but I would cut out the treats.

and find a way to get them some exercise! swing those hips girls!!