Need Advice- How do I start a Bachelor flock?

[z3lda3]

This is so true. Just about the time you say "my chickens never..." There they go just 'nevering' like a pro.

I have to laugh, cause I too, have a production red - she went broody and lays a GREEN egg!

what a coincidence! My chickens never like a pro too lol.
Wow! A green egg? That’s crazy. And perfectly normal in chicken world, because it is crazy. (Besides when my sons were toddles) I’ve never said “that makes no sense” so much in my life since having chickens.

 

[SuspiciousChick]

I know zippo about this, but as you mention that you've never raised roos before, I'm linking @Shadrach's rooster article:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/understanding-your-rooster.75056/

Thank you for the resource!

 

[SuspiciousChick]

You are dealing with living animals. You do not get guarantees with behaviors or much of anything else. Each chicken (male and female) has its own individual personality. Each flock has its own dynamic. That dynamic can change if you add or subtract members. Individual personalities and flock dynamic can change as the members mature. Even if you do exactly the same thing in the same facilities with two different batches you can get entirely different results. You need to stay flexible.


I assume you are talking about the boys fighting each other, not human aggression. Each flock, even a bachelor flock, has a pecking order. One will be dominant and the others will be ranked by dominance. Sometimes that is determined by fighting, sometimes by intimidation, often by a bit of both. These fights can be a fight to the death or it may not take long for one to realize he is better off by running away.

If they don't have enough room to run away and get away it is more likely to be a fight to the death. So I'll discuss room here. Many people on this forum ask "how many chickens can I shoehorn into this space". Or what is the minimum size needed for a certain number. There are formulas on here that can work for a lot of people but I'm more in favor of how much room above those formulas can you reasonably provide. Most bachelor flocks will do fine in the standard 4 sq ft in the coop and 10 sq ft in the run that you often see on here for regular flocks but some need more. Think about it like this. If you have 4 chickens, a 4ft x 10ft run does not give them any room to run away and get away. Do they need to be able to run away and get away? It depends on the individuals but until the pecking order/flock dominance is set they are likely to need it. Once the pecking order is established they can usually get by with less space. Your most dangerous time is while they are still immature and growing. This applies to a regular flock, not just a bachelor pad.

That leads to "once the pecking order is established don't mess with it". Some people can move a rooster back and forth with the other flock without problems, say for breeding purposes. Having more than the minimum room helps with this but it really depends more on individual personalities. You can experiment with this if you wish, it might work, it might not.

Some people do OK when the roosters in the bachelor pad can see the girls. Others don't. I sometimes isolate my cockerels where the entire flock can see them and they can see the flock. Most years that works fine. One time I had the flock master with the hens' flock fighting a cockerel through the fence.


Build a separate coop and run so they can't get out and rejoin the flock.

Good luck!

Thank you SO much for all of that wonderful information! My dad is in charge of building so I will stress to him that more space = less issues. I don’t plan on changing around the flock as all of the babies are growing up together.

 

[SuspiciousChick]

The thing with cockerels, is they are a crap shoot. What you really need is a couple of plans. Because sometimes bachelor pens work well, sometimes they work for a while, and for some birds they won't work, no matter what you do.

As Ridgerunner states start with 4 ft sq for the coop and 10 ft sq for the run. Of course, more is better. Adding roosts, hideout, wind protection and multiple feed bowls situated so that birds can't see other birds eating somewhere else can be helpful.

Right now they are approaching the darling stage. They are brave and curious, and readily approach people. It is hard to imagine them not being darlings. But sometimes they change, and once they change, they do not go back.

I have kept a bachelor pen. Mine is not a forever pen. I would suggest putting the cockerels in there as soon as you know they are a cockerel, and do not want this bird for breeding. The bird you want for breeding should be raised in the flock.

Sometimes bachelor pads are tooted as a perfect solution for people that are very sensitive and cannot cull an animal. Sometimes they work for that, sometimes they don't. They don't call it cockfighting for nothing. Do have a 5 ft fish net, gloves, and at least a dog crate for plan B, set up and ready to go so that you can separate a fighting pair. Once they are truly fighting, I would not expect them to go back together well.

Mrs K

Thank you so much for the information! They definitely are complete sweethearts now, they love snuggles and climbing on my shoulder I know they won’t be that way forever but I still have my hopes up

The thing with cockerels, is they are a crap shoot. What you really need is a couple of plans. Because sometimes bachelor pens work well, sometimes they work for a while, and for some birds they won't work, no matter what you do.

As Ridgerunner states start with 4 ft sq for the coop and 10 ft sq for the run. Of course, more is better. Adding roosts, hideout, wind protection and multiple feed bowls situated so that birds can't see other birds eating somewhere else can be helpful.

Right now they are approaching the darling stage. They are brave and curious, and readily approach people. It is hard to imagine them not being darlings. But sometimes they change, and once they change, they do not go back.

I have kept a bachelor pen. Mine is not a forever pen. I would suggest putting the cockerels in there as soon as you know they are a cockerel, and do not want this bird for breeding. The bird you want for breeding should be raised in the flock.

Sometimes bachelor pads are tooted as a perfect solution for people that are very sensitive and cannot cull an animal. Sometimes they work for that, sometimes they don't. They don't call it cockfighting for nothing. Do have a 5 ft fish net, gloves, and at least a dog crate for plan B, set up and ready to go so that you can separate a fighting pair. Once they are truly fighting, I would not expect them to go back together well.

Mrs K

Step 1: Get too many roosters.
Step 2: Get sick of their sh*t.
When you’re one inch away from making rooster stew, make them their separate coop.
I’ve got 5 roosters, and 13 hens and 8 pullets. Way too many boys for my girls. But they’re good boys, I didn’t have the heart to cull them. So I put them in a separate coop, about 7x7x20, their own fenced in yard and run. 15x30 yard and about 15x30 run. I’ve got 4 of my boys there, and my primary rooster with the girls. Other than a few squabbles I’ve had no problems with fighting..so far. IF my primary and one of the other boys see each other they fence fight, so I had to put up a privacy wall. I have literally 2 flocks. It’s a little more work, but I’m willing to do that to keep my chickens safe, healthy and I hope happy.
I had 2 roosters in my main flock for a while, actually they all were, but once those hormones kick in..it was a nightmare. Not just for me, but my girls were stressed out, my primary was stressed out. They were miserable. So far now everyone seems happy.
An interesting note: only 2 of my roosters crow now. My primary crows, and my other “head” rooster crows. It’s quieter now that I have them separated. Weird huh?

Very interesting! And thank you for sharing your experience, it gives me hope that it could all work out. I'm dreading the hormonal angst stage

 

[SuspiciousChick]

The thing with cockerels, is they are a crap shoot. What you really need is a couple of plans. Because sometimes bachelor pens work well, sometimes they work for a while, and for some birds they won't work, no matter what you do.

As Ridgerunner states start with 4 ft sq for the coop and 10 ft sq for the run. Of course, more is better. Adding roosts, hideout, wind protection and multiple feed bowls situated so that birds can't see other birds eating somewhere else can be helpful.

Right now they are approaching the darling stage. They are brave and curious, and readily approach people. It is hard to imagine them not being darlings. But sometimes they change, and once they change, they do not go back.

I have kept a bachelor pen. Mine is not a forever pen. I would suggest putting the cockerels in there as soon as you know they are a cockerel, and do not want this bird for breeding. The bird you want for breeding should be raised in the flock.

Sometimes bachelor pads are tooted as a perfect solution for people that are very sensitive and cannot cull an animal. Sometimes they work for that, sometimes they don't. They don't call it cockfighting for nothing. Do have a 5 ft fish net, gloves, and at least a dog crate for plan B, set up and ready to go so that you can separate a fighting pair. Once they are truly fighting, I would not expect them to go back together well.

Mrs K

Thank you so much for the information! They definitely are complete sweethearts now, they love snuggles and climbing on my shoulder I know they won’t be that way forever but I still have my hopes up

How old are they? Cause I have had crowing contests! Insanely noisy.

Do note zelda3 has a lot of space. More space drastically increases success.

My boys are around/close to 4 weeks old! No crowing yet but they will run at each other and will stare for a few seconds. Sparring/challenging behavior already?

 

[SuspiciousChick]

Two of my roosters are pushing 2 years old, and the cockerels are 7 months old. Before I had them in their own area they most certainly had crowing contests. Why that stopped after separation, I have no idea. Unless the younger ones don’t have to crow because the older ones are?? Chickens are so unique, just because mine got quieter does NOT mean someone else’s will too. @Mrs. K is 100% correct, it’s a crap shoot. (I’ve got a RSL who goes broody often, and is a great mother. But everything I read said red-sex links aren’t prone to being broody). You just never know.
I do have plenty of space, is it necessary? No. But my thinking is, if my boys decide to fight it out, they need space to run away. And it’s compensation for not having hens. But it seems to work. So far.
Your precious babies will change. Hormones will kick in. My primary went through about 5-6 weeks of orneriness. He was rotten! He’d bite me, treated the hens like “toys”. But after a month+ he calmed down and became the best rooster. I can pick him up, bathe him when needed, and he treats the hens like gold. He’s always on guard, and stops any hen squabbles. My other “dominant” rooster never went through that buttface stage. He was grumpy when he was born and he’s grumpy now. He’s not aggressive, just serious.
You just have to trial and error a chicken situation especially roosters.
But I wish you all the luck!! And this community is great for helping you out with advice!

Thank you for your uplifting words I'm definitely soaking in their sweetness while I can. The story of your roo having an ornery stage and eventually leveling out has given me hope. I know it will impact me emotionally when the babies start getting their hormones in, but I understand it is their nature and they have the chance of calming down later. I will definitely stress to my father (in charge of building) that they need lots of space to lessen the likelihood of issues. Thank you so much for your help

 

[Ridgerunner]

My boys are around/close to 4 weeks old! No crowing yet but they will run at each other and will stare for a few seconds. Sparring/challenging behavior already?

Yes, they are setting the pecking order. At that age the girls can also be involved.

Instead of thinking of them as mature hens and roosters, think more of pre-K kids. Don't expect them to have all of their social interactions perfected.

 

[Mrs. K]

When one considers cockerels there are three areas where keeping them becomes difficult or dangerous.

• Harassment of the pullets - they rapidly out grow the pullets and can bully them.
• Cock-fighting - they can live together perfectly fine, and then for no apparent reason, have a throw down. Sometimes living together in a bachelor flock will help with this, sometimes it does not.
• Human aggression - there is a theory that handling male chicks
  • will keep them pet like - this does work sometimes
  • or remove their fear of humans, and that leads to human aggression. Which seems counter intuitive, but this board is filled with posts where the darling becomes the nightmare in a second.

Which leads me back to my original statement - cockerels are a crap shoot, but always BE AWARE of them.
Mrs K

 

[z3lda3]

Thank you for your uplifting words I'm definitely soaking in their sweetness while I can. The story of your roo having an ornery stage and eventually leveling out has given me hope. I know it will impact me emotionally when the babies start getting their hormones in, but I understand it is their nature and they have the chance of calming down later. I will definitely stress to my father (in charge of building) that they need lots of space to lessen the likelihood of issues. Thank you so much for your help

@SuspiciousChick keep in mind, I am a huge fan of roosters. I have 5, and it’s looking like I’ll have 6 soon. I could not cull them or rehome them. I’m too soft. (I wish my heart would let me, I’d have broiler birds!) everybody’s experience is different. We can give advice and suggestions but ultimately it’s your decision. Maybe your boys will get those hormones in high gear, and be just fine, still little sweethearts. But in MY experience that hasn’t been the case. But again in my experience, my boys mellowed out, and they’re not the little sweethearts they were, but are great roosters. Even if your boys turn out to be little terrors, and you decide to keep them, we’ll still help you anyway we can. In this community it’s been my experience for every person that says you need to cull them, there will be 2 people with alternative suggestions.
My point is always have hope, because you never know what YOUR experience will be.

 

[z3lda3]

When one considers cockerels there are three areas where keeping them becomes difficult or dangerous.

• Harassment of the pullets - they rapidly out grow the pullets and can bully them.
• Cock-fighting - they can live together perfectly fine, and then for no apparent reason, have a throw down. Sometimes living together in a bachelor flock will help with this, sometimes it does not.
• Human aggression - there is a theory that handling male chicks
  • will keep them pet like - this does work sometimes
  • or remove their fear of humans, and that leads to human aggression. Which seems counter intuitive, but this board is filled with posts where the darling becomes the nightmare in a second.

Which leads me back to my original statement - cockerels are a crap shoot, but always BE AWARE of them.
Mrs K

Agreed! And I’ve had ALL those things happen. The reason One of my roosters are in a bachelor flock is because he doesn’t treat the hens well. I know what a good rooster does, my primary waits for the hen to squat, he dances or tidbits and gets the greenlight. So when this other boy was “assaulting” them repeatedly off to the bachelor flock. I had a couple try to fight my primary, off to the bachelor flock. And I’m very hands on with all my chickens. And once those cockerel hormones kicked in, it didn’t seem to matter.
Off to the bachelor flock.
My bachelors have a “pecking order” established and it’s working much much better than when hens were involved. For now.