Need input - would this mix + Kalmbach work?

[NatJ]

and correction, I found Fertrell's "Poultry Show and Breeder Supplement" It has added Ca, definitely not good for your breeding Roos, a bunch of added Met (more than the standard, see above re: legal limits) and twice as much Lys as Met. The differences matter, but its similar enough to the standard Fertrell "Nutribooster" I thought was intended that the general thrust of my comments/views remain unchanged.

The calcium in that supplment has me thoroughly puzzled. Why bother to put 4% or 5% calcium in it, when the supplement is used in such small amounts? (My best guesses: either to make it sound like it's got more nutrients, or for a reason having to do with texture or how the ingredients mix together or something like that.)

For the small amount used, I doubt the calcium makes much difference either way. 5% calcium in a supplement that is less than 2% of the total ration (1.25 pounds in 75 pounds of mixed ration) is adding less than a tenth of a percent calcium to the overall ration.

I would say the calcium in the layer crumbles would be a bigger concern, given that it's about two thirds of the whole ration.

 

[NanaK]

My goal is to use readily available Kalmbach feeds as the base of the feed ration but increase the fat, fiber, vitamins and amino acids to better support the needs of a large fowl breeder flock.

The mix I am considering is this:

Mix:
50# Kalmbach 17% nonGMO layer crumbles
15# Kalmbach 20% nonGMO Flock Maker
3# Alfalfa meal
1.25# Fertrell Breeder Supplement
0.02# methionine
0.10# Lysine
1# corn oil
2# scratch grains
2# Sunflower meal
+ vitamin E oil - TBD

Total batch weight = 74.37 pounds

Mix value is in the front, recommended ranges pulled from the Poultry Breeder Nutrition facebook page in parenthesis.
17.8% protein (17% to 18%)
6.1% fat (5% to 7%)
5.3% fiber (5% to 7%)
1.15% Lysine (1% to 1.2%)
0.50% Methionine (0.45% to 0.55%)
75 IU/lb Vitamin E (80 to 120)

Any thoughts or concerns on this mix?

I have never had silkies so I didn't really look closely but noticed this at the feed store. Would this be helpful?
https://nutrenaworld.com/products/naturewise-silkie-and-ornamental-layer-feed/

Guaranteed Analysis
Crude Protein, minimum22.0%
Lysine, minimum1.2%
Methionine, minimum0.45%
Crude Fat, minimum4.5%
Crude Fiber, maximum5.0%
Calcium, minimum2.6%
Calcium, maximum3.6%
Phosphorus, minimum0.60%
Salt, minimum0.2%
Salt, maximum0.7%
Sodium, minimum0.1%
Sodium, maximum0.4%
Manganese, minimum80 ppm
Selenium, minimum0.3 ppm
Vitamin A, minimum4,500 IU/lb
Vitamin D3, minimum1,550 IU/lb
Vitamin E, minimum10 IU/lb
Thiamine, minimum1.1 mg/lb
Lactobacillus acidophilus, minimum5.1 mil CFU/lb
Lactobacillus casei, minimum5.1 mil CFU/lb
Bifidobacterium thermophilum, minimum5.1 mil CFU/lb
Enterococcus faecium, minimum5.1 mil CFU/lb
Contains a source of live (viable) natural occurring microorganisms.

 

[2ndTink]

The calcium in that supplment has me thoroughly puzzled. Why bother to put 4% or 5% calcium in it, when the supplement is used in such small amounts? (My best guesses: either to make it sound like it's got more nutrients, or for a reason having to do with texture or how the ingredients mix together or something like that.)

For the small amount used, I doubt the calcium makes much difference either way. 5% calcium in a supplement that is less than 2% of the total ration (1.25 pounds in 75 pounds of mixed ration) is adding less than a tenth of a percent calcium to the overall ration.

I would say the calcium in the layer crumbles would be a bigger concern, given that it's about two thirds of the whole ration.

I was thinking the calcium is coming from the fish meal in that stuff?

 

[Mother of Chaos]

I was thinking the calcium is coming from the fish meal in that stuff?

I think fish meal is generally used as a source of animal protein, but I can see how some calcium might piggyback along with it if the fish had not been boned.

 

[Debbie292d]

I have never had silkies so I didn't really look closely but noticed this at the feed store. Would this be helpful?
https://nutrenaworld.com/products/naturewise-silkie-and-ornamental-layer-feed/

Guaranteed Analysis
Crude Protein, minimum22.0%
Lysine, minimum1.2%
Methionine, minimum0.45%
Crude Fat, minimum4.5%
Crude Fiber, maximum5.0%
Calcium, minimum2.6%
Calcium, maximum3.6%
Phosphorus, minimum0.60%
Salt, minimum0.2%
Salt, maximum0.7%
Sodium, minimum0.1%
Sodium, maximum0.4%
Manganese, minimum80 ppm
Selenium, minimum0.3 ppm
Vitamin A, minimum4,500 IU/lb
Vitamin D3, minimum1,550 IU/lb
Vitamin E, minimum10 IU/lb
Thiamine, minimum1.1 mg/lb
Lactobacillus acidophilus, minimum5.1 mil CFU/lb
Lactobacillus casei, minimum5.1 mil CFU/lb
Bifidobacterium thermophilum, minimum5.1 mil CFU/lb
Enterococcus faecium, minimum5.1 mil CFU/lb
Contains a source of live (viable) natural occurring microorganisms.

I had looked at this for my silkies, then changed my mind on switching from Kalmbach's Flock Maker, as the price is $2 higher for 20 fewer lbs. The only noticeable gain I noted was just 2% more protein. I would switch if I thought it was better for them in any other ways, but I don't. They also get 1/4 dose of rooster booster granules added to it as well as CS/B and a little probiotics.

Kalmbach's

 

[NatJ]

I was thinking the calcium is coming from the fish meal in that stuff?

I was assuming it came from the "calcium carbonate" on the ingredients list.

 

[2ndTink]

I was assuming it came from the "calcium carbonate" on the ingredients list.

Oh oops

 

[U_Stormcrow]

and this whole page is why I like more time when I post.

@NatJ Good catches! Yes, not sure why they are bothering to add Ca, given the low rate of inclusion in normal use, unless they intend it to be added to a "layer-type" formulation, where the "extra" CA, at normal inclusion rates, just mean the person mixing doesn't need to reformulate to hit a roughly 4-5% +/- Ca number. But even without, necessary adjustments would be quite minor.

 

[FrostRanger]

Kalmbach flock maker is a good feed, I would just stick with that and not bother with the mixing. Been feeding it to my flock for 2 years and they've done wonderfully on it