Those are all just beautiful! Thanks for sharing them.
New Color Varieties of Ameraucana......pictures from breeding projects
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Quote:
The standard defines the breed. If a bird does not meet the minimum standard it is disqualified. The females from the cross may meet the brown red standard therefore they may be brown red and some may or may not. The males on the other hand will not meet the standard for a red brown or a silver, therefore they are disqualified from winning at a show. You can not sell the male birds as silver or brown reds- if this is so what are they. They have to be something else because they have been disqualified. I would call them easter eggers because they do not qualify as an ameraucana variety.
Tim
The point I was trying to bring out is this
A non standard color Orpington is still what breed of chicken? It's an Orpington, it would be disqualified sure but it's still an Orpington.
A non standard color Ameraucana isn't an Ameraucana.
I have read about them not breeding true, according to the APA they only have to breed true 50% of the time.
Steve in NC
The standard defines the breed. If a bird does not meet the minimum standard it is disqualified. The females from the cross may meet the brown red standard therefore they may be brown red and some may or may not. The males on the other hand will not meet the standard for a red brown or a silver, therefore they are disqualified from winning at a show. You can not sell the male birds as silver or brown reds- if this is so what are they. They have to be something else because they have been disqualified. I would call them easter eggers because they do not qualify as an ameraucana variety.
Tim
The point I was trying to bring out is this
A non standard color Orpington is still what breed of chicken? It's an Orpington, it would be disqualified sure but it's still an Orpington.
A non standard color Ameraucana isn't an Ameraucana.
I have read about them not breeding true, according to the APA they only have to breed true 50% of the time.
Steve in NC
Quote:
The standard defines the breed. If a bird does not meet the minimum standard it is disqualified. The females from the cross may meet the brown red standard therefore they may be brown red and some may or may not. The males on the other hand will not meet the standard for a red brown or a silver, therefore they are disqualified from winning at a show. You can not sell the male birds as silver or brown reds- if this is so what are they. They have to be something else because they have been disqualified. I would call them easter eggers because they do not qualify as an ameraucana variety.
Tim
The point I was trying to bring out is this
A non standard color Orpington is still what breed of chicken? It's an Orpington, it would be disqualified sure but it's still an Orpington.
A non standard color Ameraucana isn't an Ameraucana.
I have read about them not breeding true, according to the APA they only have to breed true 50% of the time.
Steve in NC
The problem with Ameraucana is that the hatcheries sell EE as Ameraucana or Araucana , therefore the absolute interpretation of the standard. The hatcheries are the problem. Every time you turn around, people are jawing about this subject. I say stick with the absolute interpretation, if the bird does not fit the minimum standard; it is an EE.
Tim
The standard defines the breed. If a bird does not meet the minimum standard it is disqualified. The females from the cross may meet the brown red standard therefore they may be brown red and some may or may not. The males on the other hand will not meet the standard for a red brown or a silver, therefore they are disqualified from winning at a show. You can not sell the male birds as silver or brown reds- if this is so what are they. They have to be something else because they have been disqualified. I would call them easter eggers because they do not qualify as an ameraucana variety.
Tim
The point I was trying to bring out is this
A non standard color Orpington is still what breed of chicken? It's an Orpington, it would be disqualified sure but it's still an Orpington.
A non standard color Ameraucana isn't an Ameraucana.
I have read about them not breeding true, according to the APA they only have to breed true 50% of the time.
Steve in NC
The problem with Ameraucana is that the hatcheries sell EE as Ameraucana or Araucana , therefore the absolute interpretation of the standard. The hatcheries are the problem. Every time you turn around, people are jawing about this subject. I say stick with the absolute interpretation, if the bird does not fit the minimum standard; it is an EE.
Tim
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A non standard color Orpington is still what breed of chicken? It's an Orpington, it would be disqualified sure but it's still an Orpington.
I'm pretty sure a non-standard colored Orp would not be dq'd - it would have to be shown as AOV. This is how new colors get introduced and accepted by the APA.
I'm pretty sure a non-standard colored Orp would not be dq'd - it would have to be shown as AOV. This is how new colors get introduced and accepted by the APA.
A non standard color Ameraucana isn't an Ameraucana.
I don't understand why this is any different than the Orp example above (aside from the hatchery sales). If you breed an Ameraucana to an Ameraucana, it is still an Ameraucana. It is a non-standard color, which could also be shown as AOV (I believe Tootsie posted about her AOV bird winning at a show). Just because the club doesn't like different colored Ameraucana doesn't mean they are not Ameraucana, according to the APA.
I don't understand why this is any different than the Orp example above (aside from the hatchery sales). If you breed an Ameraucana to an Ameraucana, it is still an Ameraucana. It is a non-standard color, which could also be shown as AOV (I believe Tootsie posted about her AOV bird winning at a show). Just because the club doesn't like different colored Ameraucana doesn't mean they are not Ameraucana, according to the APA.
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So, do you think this will affect how the farms name their birds? Seems to me, with your suggestion, we'd end up with the farms selling easter eggers as ameraucanas and and ameraucana breeders selling ameraucanas as easter eggers. Any one but me seeing this as more than a little bit odd?
So, do you think this will affect how the farms name their birds? Seems to me, with your suggestion, we'd end up with the farms selling easter eggers as ameraucanas and and ameraucana breeders selling ameraucanas as easter eggers. Any one but me seeing this as more than a little bit odd?
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I think this is a key point. Why should any of us non-club members follow the rules of that club? The APA does not disqualify ameraucanas because of color. It doesn't even state they must have a blue egg (no disqualification). In fact, no ameraucana has a true blue egg. The shade is somewhere between blue and green on all of them. Look at the border on this page. That is blue. Look at the bluest of eggs and they are far less blue than even that of a robin's egg. A few people get together, form a club, make some rules and we're all expected to follow them? Sorry, it doesn't work that way.
I think this is a key point. Why should any of us non-club members follow the rules of that club? The APA does not disqualify ameraucanas because of color. It doesn't even state they must have a blue egg (no disqualification). In fact, no ameraucana has a true blue egg. The shade is somewhere between blue and green on all of them. Look at the border on this page. That is blue. Look at the bluest of eggs and they are far less blue than even that of a robin's egg. A few people get together, form a club, make some rules and we're all expected to follow them? Sorry, it doesn't work that way.
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Are you serious?
I have both pure Ameraucanas and also some non-standard colored birds that I'm working on. I call the latter project birds, not trying to be fancy, or make rules as I see fit, or say my birds are better than anyone elses, just that they are MY PROJECT. Project birds are breed with a goal in mind, not all EE's are, but until that goal is reached, you can call them whatever you want....it's of absolutely no consequence to me what anyone else calls them. I sell the culls as EE's, so I sleep just fine at night.
Are you serious?
I have both pure Ameraucanas and also some non-standard colored birds that I'm working on. I call the latter project birds, not trying to be fancy, or make rules as I see fit, or say my birds are better than anyone elses, just that they are MY PROJECT. Project birds are breed with a goal in mind, not all EE's are, but until that goal is reached, you can call them whatever you want....it's of absolutely no consequence to me what anyone else calls them. I sell the culls as EE's, so I sleep just fine at night.
Quote:
Are you serious?
I have both pure Ameraucanas and also some non-standard colored birds that I'm working on. I call the latter project birds, not trying to be fancy, or make rules as I see fit, or say my birds are better than anyone elses, just that they are MY PROJECT. Project birds are breed with a goal in mind, not all EE's are, but until that goal is reached, you can call them whatever you want....it's of absolutely no consequence to me what anyone else calls them. I sell the culls as EE's, so I sleep just fine at night.
Other Ameraucana breeders don't share your view, they are calling their project birds Ameraucana's. Where did the name EE come from?
Steve in NC
Are you serious?
I have both pure Ameraucanas and also some non-standard colored birds that I'm working on. I call the latter project birds, not trying to be fancy, or make rules as I see fit, or say my birds are better than anyone elses, just that they are MY PROJECT. Project birds are breed with a goal in mind, not all EE's are, but until that goal is reached, you can call them whatever you want....it's of absolutely no consequence to me what anyone else calls them. I sell the culls as EE's, so I sleep just fine at night.
Other Ameraucana breeders don't share your view, they are calling their project birds Ameraucana's. Where did the name EE come from?
Steve in NC
I think this is a key point. Why should any of us non-club members follow the rules of that club? The APA does not disqualify ameraucanas because of color. It doesn't even state they must have a blue egg (no disqualification). In fact, no ameraucana has a true blue egg. The shade is somewhere between blue and green on all of them. Look at the border on this page. That is blue. Look at the bluest of eggs and they are far less blue than even that of a robin's egg. A few people get together, form a club, make some rules and we're all expected to follow them? Sorry, it doesn't work that way.
It does work that way.
Any bird that does not conform to the written APA color standard for that variety should be disqualified according to the rules set forth. If you check your APA Standard of Perfection there is a page that goes over DQ's for foreign color.
The term AOV does not include any old bird that does not conform to the accepted colors written in the standard. It is to allow for new colors that are being developed. Like lavender, splash or maybe even partridge. It is not a "catch all" for odd colored birds.
You can have your opinion and members of the Ameraucana Breeders Club have theirs too. Remember the club members are the people who developed this bird and worked so hard many years ago to get it recognized with the APA. When questions arise about changing standards, the APA is going to poll the Ameraucana Breeders Club about their suggestions, not anyone else. They alone will have final decision on what an ameraucana is or isn't.
It does work that way.
Any bird that does not conform to the written APA color standard for that variety should be disqualified according to the rules set forth. If you check your APA Standard of Perfection there is a page that goes over DQ's for foreign color.
The term AOV does not include any old bird that does not conform to the accepted colors written in the standard. It is to allow for new colors that are being developed. Like lavender, splash or maybe even partridge. It is not a "catch all" for odd colored birds.
You can have your opinion and members of the Ameraucana Breeders Club have theirs too. Remember the club members are the people who developed this bird and worked so hard many years ago to get it recognized with the APA. When questions arise about changing standards, the APA is going to poll the Ameraucana Breeders Club about their suggestions, not anyone else. They alone will have final decision on what an ameraucana is or isn't.
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