New flock - vaccinate or not?

[realsis]

I would really consider giving the Mareks vaccine. I know you have concerns about being all organic but I wanted to give you a word of warning to try and be helpful.Mareks is EVERY Where!! And although Mareks vaccine is not 100% it is still or best defense against this horrific disease. From what I've read I believe it to be about 90% . If given correctly. There is still that chance it will not be effective but there is a higher chance it will. Mareks can wipe out entire flocks. Also just so you know the truth with the Mareks vaccine you are NOT giving them the Mareks virus!!! Do your research and you will see that is is a derivative of a turkey virus and NOT Mareks itself!!! I repeat it is NOT giving them the Mareks virus!!! It really is the best thing to do for your birds.mareks is a highly contagious AIRBORNE virus that can travel miles in the wind and live on land for years. I can't urge you enough to get this vaccine to protect your flock! ! Because once they get the virus the whole flock that's been exposed can be carriers of the virus and Mareks is a heart breaking disease. I would personally be afraid to take my chances with it. But you have to do what you feel is best. Just beware this virus is everywhere and their is no cure once they have it sadly. Before you make your decision do some research on the Mareks virus. Then make a educated choice from that point. I do hope this is helpful and do wish you the very best and success with your flock.

 

[mom2mnem]

Thanks everyone. It's all been extremely helpful. I have decided to do the vaccines. While we do hope to eventually get to the point of selling eggs and want to keep them organic, these chickens will definitely be treated as pets as well. We are very much animal people and would be devastated at a loss due to something we could have prevented without risking our organic status.

Once we have our own chicks hatching, we'll have to cross that bridge then about getting them vaccinated as well. Lots to learn in the meantime!

chickwhispers - that link did eventually work - thanks! There is another much larger document here for anyone else that may be interested: http://www.ams.usda.gov/AMSv1.0/getfile?dDocName=STELPRDC5101543

 

[Ridgerunner]

[If you know you have a bad strain of Marek’s in your flock, you need to manage them for that. You need to understand what the vaccine does and how Marek’s spreads. There are different strains, by the way, some that are more deadly than others and some affect different parts of the body. One strain might affect wings and legs, another the neck, another internal organs. The damage is done by lesions that form. Sort of look at it as a cancer spread by virus.

I have not had a case of Marek’s since I moved here in 2007. As I said in my other post, there had been one case of Marek’s reported in this county in the previous two years when I started. I know not all cases are reported, but I can only use the information available to make a decision. I keep a closed flock so mine are not that exposed. That means I don’t bring in other chickens or take mine to shows or swaps. I either hatch my own eggs, get chicks from a major hatchery, or get hatching eggs. I try to manage mine in a way to limit their exposure to any chicken disease, not just Marek’s, without relying on any medications, organic or otherwise.

Growing up in the ridges of East Tennessee, we had a flock of totally free ranging chickens. We never had a case of Marek’s then either. Marek’s can be anywhere. It is easily spread. But not all flocks are wiped out by Marek’s if they are not vaccinated.

I see nothing wrong with vaccinating chicks for Marek’s. It’s not going to hurt anything, even if you later hatch chicks from them. If your model is to only bring in new chicks for a hatchery, it makes perfect sense. Even if Marek’s is in your flock, you should never know it. But the OP talked about hatching chicks. That’s a different model. It still won’t hurt to vaccine the chicks from the hatchery.

The Marek’s vaccine does not prevent Marek’s. It prevents the lesions that cause the damage. Yes even that is not 100% effective but it is a big help. It is possible for chickens that have been vaccinated to catch Marek’s and be carriers. Dander spreads it, blowing on the wind. Once Marek’s is in your flock, it is there forever.

Not all chickens that catch Marek’s are going to show any symptoms or suffer any damage. Some are more resistant than others. I don’t know how much or that is a stronger immune system due to lifestyle or how much of that is inherited, probably a bit of both.

The chicks need to be vaccinated about a week before they are exposed to chicken Marek’s for the vaccine to have an effect. That means you can’t have a broody hen hatch chicks. She would expose them to Marek’s as soon as they are hatched. It’s too late to vaccinate them then. Your incubator and the brooder need to be where airborne virus can’t get to them.

I’m not trying to downplay how serious Marek’s can be if it is in your flock. Some flocks are hardly affected but some are practically wiped out. That doesn’t matter if they are livestock or pets. The death or suffering of an animal is bad in either case. Some livestock owners work just as hard as some pet owners in keeping their animals healthy and often do a lot of research in learning what is required to achieve that. Some pet owners, like some livestock owners, don’t.

Mom2mnem, If you chat with your local “organic” certifying agency, you might want to ask them if Amprolium is an accepted treatment for Coccidiosis. The medicated ingredient in medicated feed is almost certainly Amprolium, in a low preventive level dosage. It’s not an antibiotic, it’s a thiamin blocker that restricts the reproduction of the coccidiosis protozoa in the guts of the chicken. That’s how it controls the numbers of the Coccidiosis. You can’t treat Coccidiosis with medicated feed however. The dosage is not strong enough. In a much higher dosage, like in Corid, Amprolium can be used to treat Coccidiosis. Since it targets the reproductive ability of Coccidiosis, it does not wipe out the probiotics in the chicks guts the way an antibiotic would. I’ve never had a problem with Coccidiosis by keeping the brooder dry, the water clean, and helping them develop flock immunities at a very young age, but if you have one of those virulent strains, it might be good to have an effective allowed treatment in the back of your head.

Something else with coccidiosis. Your chickens can develop an immunity to the strains in your soil, but it is always possible a mockingbird can fly over you run and drop a nutrient rich semi-digested packet in your run that also contains a new strain your chickens are not immune to. That’s not likely but possible. Or if you introduce outside chickens to yours, it’s always possible one flock could give the other a strain that they don’t have immunity to. I don’t stress about Coccidiosis but I do know the signs.