new research debunks trad views on nutrition

[BDutch]

How do you judge whether your birds "like" a feed?

My experience is that when I have to get an emergency bag of cheap, 16% layer for reasons of availability or access the birds eat more of that feed than they do of their normal 18-22% All-Flock (my local farm store's parent chain has changed brands and types available several times over the past year so I can't always get what I'd prefer).

I believe that they are eating more of the layer in order to make up for the lesser quality of the nutrition rather than because they "like" it.

I mixed 50% organic with 50% circular. The chickens ate the organic and left the recycled in the bowl.

I do switch more often. But this time the difference in appetite was very significant.

 

[BDutch]

Yes it is in the UK.

Strange authorities you have.
On the other hand … The Belgian government had a campaign several years ago to buy a few BY chickens and give waste food (not rotten or bad) to your chickens.

 

[Shadrach]

Strange authorities you have.
On the other hand … The Belgian government had a campaign several years ago to buy a few BY chickens and give waste food (not rotten or bad) to your chickens.

Mad cow disease is the tone of the reasoning behind the ban.

 

[BDutch]

I don't think most people believe you must feed commercial feed. I'd think it's more that a lot of people don't want to or can't spend the time, effort and money involved in feeding a specialized diet. Some people just don't have time for all that, they've got full time jobs, children at home and/or lots of different types of fowl and animals to feed. They like the assurance a formulated feed provides in making sure their chickens get everything they need. It seems like a lot people do feed extras, scraps and treats in addition to pellets, so they do understand that fresh food is good for them as well.

There are people on a chicken forum in NL and BYC on that swear you should feed your chickens max 10% - 25% other feed than industrial feed.

 

[3KillerBs]

I mixed 50% organic with 50% circular. The chickens ate the organic and left the recycled in the bowl.

That's pretty definitive.

 

[Perris]

Can you feed waste food to meal worms and then feed them the meal worms?

black soldier fly larvae are the ones for food waste - they even thrive in moist conditions. Mealworms probably could eat dry food waste, but their main substrate is wheat bran, and they get their moisture from veg waste like veg peels, carrot tops, cauli leaves, outer leaves or discards of any green veg etc. They cause anything aromatic to smell while they're chomping through, so it's obvious when they're eating leek top n tails, for example

 

[Perris]

Strange authorities you have.
On the other hand … The Belgian government had a campaign several years ago to buy a few BY chickens and give waste food (not rotten or bad) to your chickens.

Actually this legislation was passed in 2014 when we were in the EU, so I'm surprised it's different in the Netherlands

The official guidance on the relevant legislation is as follows:

"ABPs you cannot use​

You must never use catering waste as farm animal feed, regardless of whether it’s vegetable or meat based or whether it comes from restaurants, households, or other sites.

You must never use:

• scraps and catering waste from any restaurant or commercial kitchen (including vegan kitchens)
• scraps and kitchen waste (including from vegan households)
• raw meat and fish (including shellfish) or any ABPs containing them
• fully or partially cooked meat, fish and shellfish or any ABPs containing them
• any unprocessed egg and egg products, milk and milk products or any other unprocessed products of animal origin
• collagen and gelatine from ruminants or any products containing it
• unwanted food products, meant for humans, that are decomposing, mouldy, or toxic

You cannot make or supply farm animal feed using processed animal protein (PAP) unless:

• it comes from non-ruminant animals and you’re feeding it to farmed fish
• it’s fishmeal and you’re feeding to non-ruminant animals "

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/supplyi...ducts-as-farm-animal-feed#abps-you-cannot-use

ABP = animal by-products. Mealworms are not specifically mentioned in any of the legislation; dried mealworms are classified as PAP so fall under the last bit of the guidance. Live mealworms are not classified as either so are fine.

BSE was created by including sheep brains in cattle concentrate. Some of those sheep had scrapie, a degenerative disease of the nervous system. Foot and mouth and some swine diseases have also been linked with feeding the affected animals feeds made using other animal parts. I think the gross details, once they became known to legislators, and the tendency of the feed industry to find and exploit loopholes, caused an over-reaction essentially to ban all animal products from animal feed.

I think it is now widely regarded as overkill and has massively fuelled food loss and waste, and we can now make our own rules about it, so an overhaul is on the cards.

A few companies have acquired licences to experiment with these rules. In particular when it involves feeding ruminant-origin substances to non-ruminants, and vice versa. Insects, as an entirely different kind of animal, are already allowed for fish; I expect they'll be OK'd for mammals and birds in due course.

 

[Perris]

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/0304113176900084

No wonder some feed companies don't list the ingredients on the bag! Corn, barley, ...Chicken poo and feathers...

Edited to add, this study https://doi.org/10.1017/S1751731118001143 concluded that "This study demonstrated a clear preference of laying hens for feeding and foraging on substrate free of excreta." No shit Sherlock.

 

[BDutch]

Mad cow disease is the tone of the reasoning behind the ban.

In the Netherlands the cow disease led to changes in feed too. Adding meat ( or animal by products like brains) in feed for livestock got prohibited.

PS insects and mealworms in feed for animals meant for consumption are allowed.

 

[3KillerBs]

any unprocessed egg and egg products, milk and milk products or any other unprocessed products of animal origin

So if I were there I couldn't do what I always do with an egg that was cracked in the nest or dropped in the run and got dirtier than I wish to wash -- smash it against some hard surface in the coop or run for the chickens to eat.

And I'd have to bake the eggshells instead of just drying them?