Nutrient deficiency I can’t figure out

[Annabellaa]

All my hens seem to have a massive nutrient imbalance.

I have had an issue with birds getting sick all from things that point to a calcium deficiency. Or at least some kind of mineral deficiency that I cannot figure out. I have been giving calcium in multiple different ways and it doesn’t seem to be doing anything??? The issues range from laying eggs with no shells, to internally laying, I have one hen who has been half bald for like 2 years and she won’t molt or grow her feathers back. I’ve had 2 chickens break toes doing seemingly nothing. So is there another nutrient I’m missing that makes their ability to digest calcium better? Am I not giving enough calcium? Does it have nothing to do with calcium all together? I have lost 2 hens to internally laying/ eggs breaking inside due to poor shell quality.

Recently my hen popcorn (who has laid shell-less eggs in the past) prolapsed. I was able to fix the prolapse and she has not re prolapsed. But her comb fell over and shrivelled and turned black when this happened. The colour returned to red and I’ve been giving her poultry cell and she seems to have perked up a bit but still not back to normal. Her comb has come back a lot but not fully. And she is still very thin

What am I missing? What are they missing from their diet ? Is it the feed? Is there things I can add to the feed? They have been treated for virtually everything else the only thing I can think of is they are seriously lacking in something diet wise. I am worried that I will lose popcorn to another prolapse/ soft shell. Or my other hen (nugget) if she doesn’t start growing feathers

 

[Annabellaa]

All my hens seem to have a massive nutrient imbalance.

I have had an issue with birds getting sick all from things that point to a calcium deficiency. Or at least some kind of mineral deficiency that I cannot figure out. I have been giving calcium in multiple different ways and it doesn’t seem to be doing anything??? The issues range from laying eggs with no shells, to internally laying, I have one hen who has been half bald for like 2 years and she won’t molt or grow her feathers back. I’ve had 2 chickens break toes doing seemingly nothing. So is there another nutrient I’m missing that makes their ability to digest calcium better? Am I not giving enough calcium? Does it have nothing to do with calcium all together? I have lost 2 hens to internally laying/ eggs breaking inside due to poor shell quality.

Recently my hen popcorn (who has laid shell-less eggs in the past) prolapsed. I was able to fix the prolapse and she has not re prolapsed. But her comb fell over and shrivelled and turned black when this happened. The colour returned to red and I’ve been giving her poultry cell and she seems to have perked up a bit but still not back to normal. Her comb has come back a lot but not fully. And she is still very thin

What am I missing? What are they missing from their diet ? Is it the feed? Is there things I can add to the feed? They have been treated for virtually everything else the only thing I can think of is they are seriously lacking in something diet wise. I am worried that I will lose popcorn to another prolapse/ soft shell. Or my other hen (nugget) if she doesn’t start growing feathers

I realize that maybe I posted this in the wrong place. I figured it was better here than in the disease section since it is about food. But let me know if I should repost the thread there and I will delete and do so

 

[Mother of Chaos]

All my hens seem to have a massive nutrient imbalance.

I have had an issue with birds getting sick all from things that point to a calcium deficiency. Or at least some kind of mineral deficiency that I cannot figure out. I have been giving calcium in multiple different ways and it doesn’t seem to be doing anything??? The issues range from laying eggs with no shells, to internally laying, I have one hen who has been half bald for like 2 years and she won’t molt or grow her feathers back. I’ve had 2 chickens break toes doing seemingly nothing. So is there another nutrient I’m missing that makes their ability to digest calcium better? Am I not giving enough calcium? Does it have nothing to do with calcium all together? I have lost 2 hens to internally laying/ eggs breaking inside due to poor shell quality.

Recently my hen popcorn (who has laid shell-less eggs in the past) prolapsed. I was able to fix the prolapse and she has not re prolapsed. But her comb fell over and shrivelled and turned black when this happened. The colour returned to red and I’ve been giving her poultry cell and she seems to have perked up a bit but still not back to normal. Her comb has come back a lot but not fully. And she is still very thin

What am I missing? What are they missing from their diet ? Is it the feed? Is there things I can add to the feed? They have been treated for virtually everything else the only thing I can think of is they are seriously lacking in something diet wise. I am worried that I will lose popcorn to another prolapse/ soft shell. Or my other hen (nugget) if she doesn’t start growing feathers

One thing that I can think of is that we vertebrates, both humans and chickens, need an adequate amount of vitamin D in order for the body to actually absorb the calcium and put it to use.

I don't know if there are standards for vitamin D for chickens. I would think that it's added to commercial chicken feed in high enough quantities for chickens with normal metabolisms. But perhaps for chickens where something has gone awry, low vitamin D might be the culprit? Also, if they get out and about in the sunshine, their bodies will metabolize vitamin D from the sun. I know you've tried different calcium sources. Have you tried human calcium tablets, and if so, do they also have vitamin D?

What breeds are your girls, and how old are they? Sometimes with the chicken breeds created for high production and general commercial use, their bodies just can't keep up with the demand to create and lay daily extra-large eggs, and their reproductive systems become damaged.

 

[Mother of Chaos]

I realize that maybe I posted this in the wrong place. I figured it was better here than in the disease section since it is about food. But let me know if I should repost the thread there and I will delete and do so

I think that it is a perfectly good place! Many people with the same problem might assuming that it's a dietary deficiency and start looking on this subforum.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Let's start w/ What are you feeding your birds, and how old are they?

Nothing in Nature uses Calcium to exclusion. Yes, Calcium imbalances can cause a lot of problems. Calcium uptake is affected by acidity, its se in in conjunction w/ Phosphorus (the Ca : P ratio is VERY important) and certain vitamins are used to regulate, D3 primarily. A few micronutrients you can't balance on your own.

Too much Ca can be as bad as too little (though generally, birds are decent at self-regulating Ca intake, given the option), and young birds, male birds, tend to be the most severely affected by Ca excess.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

One thing that I can think of is that we vertebrates, both humans and chickens, need an adequate amount of vitamin D in order for the body to actually absorb the calcium and put it to use.

I don't know if there are standards for vitamin D for chickens. I would think that it's added to commercial chicken feed in high enough quantities for chickens with normal metabolisms. But perhaps for chickens where something has gone awry, low vitamin D might be the culprit? Also, if they get out and about in the sunshine, their bodies will metabolize vitamin D from the sun. I know you've tried different calcium sources. Have you tried human calcium tablets, and if so, do they also have vitamin D?

What breeds are your girls, and how old are they? Sometimes with the chicken breeds created for high production and general commercial use, their bodies just can't keep up with the demand to create and lay daily extra-large eggs, and their reproductive systems become damaged.

these are the right questions, and the right thoughts to get started. Yes, chickens and other mammals metabolize D vitamins w/ the input of sunlight. However, production chicken breeds in their prime years probably can't make enough D3 - the D vitamin specific to Ca absorption and metabolism to support their egg laying potential - which is why it is usually supplemented in commercial feed.

 

[Annabellaa]

One thing that I can think of is that we vertebrates, both humans and chickens, need an adequate amount of vitamin D in order for the body to actually absorb the calcium and put it to use.

I don't know if there are standards for vitamin D for chickens. I would think that it's added to commercial chicken feed in high enough quantities for chickens with normal metabolisms. But perhaps for chickens where something has gone awry, low vitamin D might be the culprit? Also, if they get out and about in the sunshine, their bodies will metabolize vitamin D from the sun. I know you've tried different calcium sources. Have you tried human calcium tablets, and if so, do they also have vitamin D?

What breeds are your girls, and how old are they? Sometimes with the chicken breeds created for high production and general commercial use, their bodies just can't keep up with the demand to create and lay daily extra-large eggs, and their reproductive systems become damaged.

I will attach images with some of the things I have tried that I still have. These aren’t consecutive as they have had large breaks in between and I only tend to use them when I’m noticing an Active problem. I try not to overload them. I only use things for the recommended length of time. The one with blue writing is an electrolyte not necessarily a calcium supplement. That’s used on rlly hot/ cold days. Or when they need a boost. Some of these are water soluble some are food additives, at one point I had some calcium bicarbonate that I syringed directly into their mouths.They also have free choice of oyster shells (which they absolutely despise) I also occasionally feed them their own eggs and shells back as well. They are all 5 years old and I have 2 azure blue, 1 leghorn, 1plymouth, and 2 African greys. My two girls that passed was a black copper maran (at 2 years old) and a road island red (5years old). Actually one of my azure blues decided to grow spurs about 4 months ago so now she’s a rooster that pops an egg out occasionally so I rlly don’t know what’s going on. My leghorn is the bald one, and the other azure blue is the one that prolapsed

 

[Annabellaa]

these are the right questions, and the right thoughts to get started. Yes, chickens and other mammals metabolize D vitamins w/ the input of sunlight. However, production chicken breeds in their prime years probably can't make enough D3 - the D vitamin specific to Ca absorption and metabolism to support their egg laying potential - which is why it is usually supplemented in commercial feed.

They are just fed a normal 18% layer crumble I don’t have the label with me but in theory is should have enough vit D in it?

 

[Annabellaa]

Let's start w/ What are you feeding your birds, and how old are they?

Nothing in Nature uses Calcium to exclusion. Yes, Calcium imbalances can cause a lot of problems. Calcium uptake is affected by acidity, its se in in conjunction w/ Phosphorus (the Ca : P ratio is VERY important) and certain vitamins are used to regulate, D3 primarily. A few micronutrients you can't balance on your own.

Too much Ca can be as bad as too little (though generally, birds are decent at self-regulating Ca intake, given the option), and young birds, male birds, tend to be the most severely affected by Ca excess.

Actually I was reading about that today. How important phosphorus and potassium is for chickens but I had a hard time finding any supplements for them in my search locally that seemed to have sufficient amounts if any at all. Is there a way I can supplement that for them? Are there certain foods or human options that are safe for them?

 

[Annabellaa]

Actually I was reading about that today. How important phosphorus and potassium is for chickens but I had a hard time finding any supplements for them in my search locally that seemed to have sufficient amounts if any at all. Is there a way I can supplement that for them? Are there certain foods or human options that are safe for them?

Let's start w/ What are yo feeding your birds, and how old are they?

Nothing in Nature uses Calcium to exclusion. Yes, Calcium imbalances can cause a lot of problems. Calcium uptake is affected by acidity, its se in in conjunction w/ Phosphorus (the Ca : P ratio is VERY important) and certain vitamins are used to regulate, D3 primarily. A few micronutrients you can't balance on your own.

Too much Ca can be as bad as too little (though generally, birds are decent at self-regulating Ca intake, given the option), and young birds, male birds, tend to be the most severely affected by Ca exc

Let's start w/ What are you feeding your birds, and how old are they?

Nothing in Nature uses Calcium to exclusion. Yes, Calcium imbalances can cause a lot of problems. Calcium uptake is affected by acidity, its se in in conjunction w/ Phosphorus (the Ca : P ratio is VERY important) and certain vitamins are used to regulate, D3 primarily. A few micronutrients you can't balance on your own.

Too much Ca can be as bad as too little (though generally, birds are decent at self-regulating Ca intake, given the option), and young birds, male birds, tend to be the most severely affected by Ca excess.

Things are loading oddly for me on my phone right now. If my uploading works. I have a reply to someone above that shows what I’ve been attempting to supplement with. If it didn’t upload I will rewrite it