Over treatment with medication?

[BugStalker]

I just learned that zinc oxide is toxic to chickens.
http://www.poultrydvm.com/condition/zinc-toxicity
One of the human calcium supplements I gave an impacted hen has zinc oxide & zinc gluconate. The total amount of zinc given this bird over the last few weeks is under 100mg. (I think it was about 50mg over what they are supposed to get.) I was wondering why she still has diarrhea, and her appetite wasn't better after the impaction was gone. I tubed out most of her crop contents after I found out, having given about 12mg total zinc recently. Another thread about her is https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/1-5-y-o-buckeye-corid-with-probiotics.1421796
I am thinking of stopping the corid, since it is also eliminated by the kidney, and I never confirmed coccidia. Any advice?

 

[lbgreenfield]

Hi. Sorry to hear about your hen. Just so I understand correctly, your sick hen is currently on Corid (without a cocci diagnosis from a fecal test), calcium supplements (with zinc), and potentially has an impacted crop?

Why are/were you giving your hen with a potentially impacted crop calcium supplements? I've only heard of giving egg bound hens calcium supplements, not impacted crop hens. With the Corid dosing, you are not giving any other supplements containing thiamine correct? (Thiamine will counteract the Corid).

I would discontinue all the meds (Cord, zinc, calcium, etc.) and feed her a bland diet for the next few days (like cooked oatmeal mixed with some of their feed or a few scrambled eggs mixed with their crumble feed) and see how she does. Also offer plain water, no added probiotics or supplements. It seems like you're over-treating your hen and possibly might be over-stressing her, that's just my opinion.

 

[BugStalker]

I gave this magnesium and calcium with zinc and Vitamin D in it after the docusate sodium didn't get her crop moving, (I thought it would be gentler than molasses or Epsom salt flush, ironically,) and again after tubing out the crop. I had other vitamins I gave until the corid (they had thiamine.) Initially, I thought I found oocysts, but now think that was just inexperience.

Finally, I was tired and apparently confused. I had noticed the corid seemed to be making the droppings more wet, so gave ginger, cinnamon, and oregano (just what I would season food with) for upset stomach and mild yeast suppression, and somehow used this stuff again, instead of the usual vitamins.

I should've taken care of myself first, so I could better take care of her.

They're on plain water now, and I put things back to normal as much as possible, including trying no more separating. She went straight for the layer feed. (I had put her on starter when the moult started, but was still feeding layer to those still laying.)

Thanks for replying. I appreciate it.

 

[lbgreenfield]

I gave this magnesium and calcium with zinc and Vitamin D in it after the docusate sodium didn't get her crop moving, (I thought it would be gentler than molasses or Epsom salt flush, ironically,) and again after tubing out the crop. I had other vitamins I gave until the corid (they had thiamine.) Initially, I thought I found oocysts, but now think that was just inexperience.

Finally, I was tired and apparently confused. I had noticed the corid seemed to be making the droppings more wet, so gave ginger, cinnamon, and oregano (just what I would season food with) for upset stomach and mild yeast suppression, and somehow used this stuff again, instead of the usual vitamins.

I should've taken care of myself first, so I could better take care of her.

They're on plain water now, and I put things back to normal as much as possible, including trying no more separating. She went straight for the layer feed. (I had put her on starter when the moult started, but was still feeding layer to those still laying.)

Thanks for replying. I appreciate it.

Ok, lots going on then with you and the hens. It seems like she was overloaded with vitamins, treatments, getting her crop tubed, etc. Let her eat only the feed and plain water for a few days and she how she does. Scrambled eggs and cooked oatmeal are bland foods that can help reset her system. A small amount of plain Greek yogurt will also help get good bacteria back in her gut too after all the vitamins, supplements, etc. just like it would in humans.

As long as she’s acting normal, eating, drinking, pooping, and laying, she should pull through!

 

[BugStalker]

She's moulting, but the feathers don't seem to be growing much. She isn't eating much oatmeal, eggs, or yogurt, but chases down bugs, drinks water and would probably eat some greens. She's kind of bored of feed, was eating some, but now just picks it up and drops it. She was getting picked on a little, but she picked back a little too. She's lost a lot of weight. Her crop has been a little slow, and seems slower, now. She still has stuff in it from yesterday. Her face is starting to look a little pale. Her droppings are mostly liquid, even one that looked like a small cecal. I am thinking of tubing her crop out again, using baking soda. After that, I will consider if something else is needed. I want to make sure I do only what's needed, to minimize her stress.

 

[BugStalker]

I had given her a quiet place to rest and just checked on her. She made a happy noise and out came some solids! They were wet, but her crop is less full. I am still considering tubing or docusate sodium or Cocoanut oil. The eggs were made in Cocoanut oil, so I'll see if she's interested in them, now.

 

[lbgreenfield]

I had given her a quiet place to rest and just checked on her. She made a happy noise and out came some solids! They were wet, but her crop is less full. I am still considering tubing or docusate sodium or Cocoanut oil. The eggs were made in Cocoanut oil, so I'll see if she's interested in them, now.

Aw ok. Seems like the bullying may be hindering her from eating and drinking enough. Also, when my hens molt, they tend to eat less and act off. Molting can sometimes be a slow process, it’s painful for them to grow new feathers and they need a lot of energy to grown them too.

Have you checked her for lice/mites/parasites? They would be very, very small around the vent area. They come out at night to feed. That could also be causing some problems.

 

[BugStalker]

She only wanted to scratch around, then got water and went to roost.

When Ivory started moulting, she was getting bullied out of food, so I try to keep one feeding location per bird going. We have been keeping food in at least half of them at all times, (they tend to go mainly for one until it's gone,) along with one water location per two birds, as well. This buckeye has always been a picky eater, but will often follow the others, eventually. That works better than dipping her beak in it.

I've checked her at night for lice or mites, and kept her vent clean, but will pay extra attention, especially with roost reordering going on... Ivory has been roosting all over. I've kept both moulters in the house on colder or windier nights.

 

[lbgreenfield]

She only wanted to scratch around, then got water and went to roost.

When Ivory started moulting, she was getting bullied out of food, so I try to keep one feeding location per bird going. We have been keeping food in at least half of them at all times, (they tend to go mainly for one until it's gone,) along with one water location per two birds, as well. This buckeye has always been a picky eater, but will often follow the others, eventually. That works better than dipping her beak in it.

I've checked her at night for lice or mites, and kept her vent clean, but will pay extra attention, especially with roost reordering going on... Ivory has been roosting all over. I've kept both moulters in the house on colder or windier nights.

Multiple feed and water locations will help. Hopefully she starts to feel better, seems like a lot going on and then add on top of that she’s starting to molt.
If she’s losing a lot of weight, can you dose her with Nutri-Drench or Rooster Booster? I’m not sure where you are located but if you have that or something similar, you can feed her some of that with a 1cc syringe. That will give her a direct boost of nutrients. Or try giving her some of her absolute favorite foods, mine love soldier fly larvae and canned chicken meat (I know, how ironic). I only give those foods as treats, but both of those are high protein, good for molters.

 

[BugStalker]

She loves live BSFL. We can dip them in something like greek yogurt or the liquid vitamins we were using before the corid. I was using children's vitamins without iron, but will probably order Nutri-Drench or something. I don't have Rooster Booster since it turned green (before these birds.)

I have some freeze-dried mealworms for bird feeders, but don't use them much for chickens.

At one point, she really liked aloe vera leaves, (the inside,) but other times she didn't.