Pastoral Poultry, Traditional Farming For A Modern Era

[bayocum]

Thanks so much for sharing that information...very helpful!

 

[BCMaraniac]

You're welcome. Here are the links to the documents I read as I was learning. They are from the early 1900's.....before Cornish X:

www.ksre.ksu.edu/historicpublications/Pubs/SC027.PDF

http://www.afn.org/~poultry/capon.htm

I found a PDF of an old book from around 1914 that describes castration of a large variety of animals.....even a skunk......that including caponization and poulardizing, but I can't find it.....I will keep looking.

 

[lazy gardener]

Pea Shrub...is it "native" to your area or are you ordering it from somewhere? Sounds interesting. We totally agree about the benefits of caponizing, just hoping to get some good source material or instructions to insure success as much as possible. Our desire would be to minimize loses/injury and maximize the use of our flock.
Thanks for the comments!
-Brice

The Siberian Pea shrub is not a native to U.S. However, it is supposedly not invasive. Latin name: Caragana arborescens. self fertile, grows 15 - 20'. Has compound foliage, silvery bark, yellow flowers followed by small seed pods. adaptable to poor soil, drought, salt. Does well in full sun, native to Siberia and Manchuria. Hardy to Zone 3. I've seen one growing before, and would call it a small tree rather than a shrub. You can PM me if interested in ordering info. I'm not sure if it's ok to post company info on this site. My source in Maine sells them for $11.00 each.

I would love to find someone local who could spend some time mentoring me on the art of caponizing. In my way of thinking, it's a skill worth learning if you intend to grow out cockrels. It would be far more humane to buy SR chicks, or hatch your own, and caponize the non breeding males than it would be to slaughter all of those sexed males at the hatchery, or try growing them out where they brutalize each other when the hormones kick in.

 

[centrarchid]

The Siberian Pea shrub is not a native to U.S. However, it is supposedly not invasive. Latin name: Caragana arborescens. self fertile, grows 15 - 20'. Has compound foliage, silvery bark, yellow flowers followed by small seed pods. adaptable to poor soil, drought, salt. Does well in full sun, native to Siberia and Manchuria. Hardy to Zone 3. I've seen one growing before, and would call it a small tree rather than a shrub. You can PM me if interested in ordering info. I'm not sure if it's ok to post company info on this site. My source in Maine sells them for $11.00 each.

I would love to find someone local who could spend some time mentoring me on the art of caponizing. In my way of thinking, it's a skill worth learning if you intend to grow out cockrels. It would be far more humane to buy SR chicks, or hatch your own, and caponize the non breeding males than it would be to slaughter all of those sexed males at the hatchery, or try growing them out where they brutalize each other when the hormones kick in.

The males do not brutalize each other if properly reared, especially if harvested as broilers where full hormones have not kicked in. Primary advantage of caponization is improved growth performance, not simply suppression of make behavior.

 

[BCMaraniac]

I would love to find someone local who could spend some time mentoring me on the art of caponizing. In my way of thinking, it's a skill worth learning if you intend to grow out cockrels. It would be far more humane to buy SR chicks, or hatch your own, and caponize the non breeding males than it would be to slaughter all of those sexed males at the hatchery, or try growing them out where they brutalize each other when the hormones kick in.

I felt comfortable self-teaching, but I think it is because of my medical background. If you post the question on the caponizing thread that I referenced earlier, you may find someone in your area who will mentor you.

I agree with you about the male chicks. The Humane Society thinks that caponization should be outlawed as it is in the UK, but I guess throwing baby male chicks into a grinder at the hatchery is okay. I don't understand why the hatcheries don't include the males as ride alongs with orders. I guess they would rather kill them than give them away, which is very sad, but I think there are a few smaller hatcheries that will send extra male chicks with their order.

My goal is to hatch and grow out all of the chicken that my family eats, and that includes continuing to caponize the males and poulardize the females when I do not need them for layers. In the early 1900's families were encouraged by college university agriculture departments to caponize their male chicks in order to have a fresh protein source throughout the winter, since the capon could be easily kept much longer without compromising the quality of the meat and it would continue to grow. One of the links in my previous post is to a historical document from Kansas State University that touts the very positive aspects of caponization for the family farm.

If I lived in Maine, I would be happy to show you what I have learned, but I am in TN. I think that would be a little far to drive

 

[bayocum]

I've noticed with the American Bresse that they tend to mature hormonally before they are ready for processing. It usually happens around week 16-17, and processing doesn't happen for another four weeks or so. That said, if the males have room to roam, they tend to not damage each other too much. In the past, we've had to remove 1 of 5 in a flock of about 13, because it was being picked on. The ability to improve the meat and reduce the "tension" is very inviting. Thanks to everyone for sharing.

 

[centrarchid]

Something is not right. I can keep my American Game stags together through about 24 weeks which is a lot older than what any production breed should harvested as a broiler. Either your production cockerels are extremely aggressive or somebody does not have a handle on what actual damage is, Damage for me that is important is simply breaking feathers.

 

[Myrth]

The Siberian Pea shrub is not a native to U.S.  However, it is supposedly not invasive.  Latin name: Caragana arborescens.  self fertile, grows 15 - 20'.  Has compound foliage, silvery bark, yellow flowers followed by small seed pods.  adaptable to poor soil, drought, salt.  Does well in full sun, native to Siberia and Manchuria.  Hardy to Zone 3. I've seen one growing before, and would call it a small tree rather than a shrub.  You can PM me if interested in ordering info.  I'm not sure if it's ok to post company info on this site.  My source in Maine sells them for $11.00 each.

I would love to find someone local who could spend some time mentoring me on the art of caponizing.  In my way of thinking, it's a skill worth learning if you intend to grow out cockrels.   It would be far more humane to buy SR chicks, or hatch your own, and caponize the non breeding males than it would be to slaughter all of those sexed males at the hatchery, or try growing them out where they brutalize each other when the hormones kick in.

I too have been researching the Siberian pea shrub. I need some bushes and trees for the chickens to hide under to avoid hawks. If those plants produce chicken feed as well, so much the better.


So far in my research I have learned that the pea shrub prefers soil on the alkaline side. My soil is on the acidic side so I am looking for information about the full pH range that it will grow in. I have also found references to its being invasive in some environments.


Another shrub of interest to me is the hazelnut. I am looking at some disease resistant hazels that have been developed in the Midwest.

 

[bayocum]

....
Another shrub of interest to me is the hazelnut. I am looking at some disease resistant hazels that have been developed in the Midwest.

I've recently seen the Hazelnut (Filbert) being grown in the northwest. It is a pretty compact tree with a decent canopy. Some of the examples I saw had multiple "suckers" that were allowed to grow to a significant height; not the norm in most agricultural trees. Are you looking at these as a source of food for your chickens. We have a walnut orchard and our birds go crazy for the nuts. I haven't observed them actually cracking the shell, but if one gets cracked underfoot, or after falling from the tree, they go wild for them.

 

[Myrth]

I've recently seen the Hazelnut (Filbert) being grown in the northwest.  It is a pretty compact tree with a decent canopy.  Some of the examples I saw had multiple "suckers" that were allowed to grow to a significant height; not the norm in most agricultural trees.  Are you looking at these as a source of food for your chickens.  We have a walnut orchard and our birds go crazy for the nuts.  I haven't observed them actually cracking the shell, but if one gets cracked underfoot, or after falling from the tree, they go wild for them.  

The hazels grown in the northwest are a tree form. Those don't live here due to disease. The hazels that have been developed to grow here are a shrub form. One variety has been developed for wildlife, with a thin shell. I was thinking of these for the chickens to eat also. The shrubs I am talking about are here:
http://www.badgersett.com/
I met the owner at an organic farming conference some years ago. At that time I did not have a situation where they would fit in to what I was doing. Now, however, I have an ideal place for them and a need for bushes, so they are on my must plant list.

As for the Siberian pea shrub, I found considerable information about it at:

http://www.pfaf.org/user/plant.aspx?LatinName=Caragana+arborescens