Peach * Cameo

[deerman]

I'm just not sure peach is purple and cameo......if peach carry cameo.....then you would think as many peach and purple ...i would have produce a cameo........NEVER.


i do have one peach silver pied peacock.......and a cameo bs silver pied hen.

i understand the sex link colors and how they work...i just don't know the peach is purple /cameo....don't think that is fact yet......

 

[AquaEyes]

I'm just not sure peach is purple and cameo......if peach carry cameo.....then you would think as many peach and purple ...i would have produce a cameo........NEVER.


i do have one peach silver pied peacock.......and a cameo bs silver pied hen.

i understand the sex link colors and how they work...i just don't know the peach is purple /cameo....don't think that is fact yet......

Peach IS Purple Cameo. It was the original breeder's intention to combine the mutations, and he succeeded. He didn't understand how it could happen, but I explained that linked genes can separate and recombine during meiosis -- this is a well-documented fact that is taught in high school biology. And frankly, the Peach phenotype shows characteristics of both the Purple and Cameo phenotypes together.

I can't clearly understand incomplete sentences, and I'm not sure what pairings you used that "never" produced a Cameo -- it's likely that the pairings you had simply couldn't. Unless you state what the pairings were, I can't comment about whether a Cameo offspring was possible or not. But if you're wondering what pairing can result in a few Purple and Cameo hens using Peach, it would be:

BLANK split to Peach Male X ANY female

The BLANK in this case would be any non-Purple, non-Cameo, non-Peach color (IB, Bronze, Midnight, etc).

In order for the Purple and Cameo genes to separate out again, there must be a homologous chromosome with neither mutation on it. This can occur only in males (females have only one Z). Thus you need to use a male with one "normal" Z chromosome, and one Z with "Peach" (i.e. Purple and Cameo) on it. I've already read accounts from breeders (even in this forum!!!) who used males split to Peach and got Purple and Cameo daughters.

Another test would be getting Purple Males from a Peach father -- since Males need two copies of Purple (one from each parent), Purple sons from a Peach father MUST be inheriting a copy of Purple from Dad, which means Dad MUST have at least one copy of Purple to give. The same would go for Cameo sons from a Peach father, regarding their need for a copy of Cameo from each parent.



Frankly, I don't understand why this is such a controversial issue. The phenomenon is well-studied in many other species, the original breeder had the goal of combining the colors, and the model of inheritance indicating that Peach arose as a spontaneous mutation does not fit with actual breeding results. And no one provides evidence that it IS a separate gene -- people just keep quoting dogma in knee-jerk responses.

When I first mentioned this, people said "how is that possible?" and I answered that question. Then they said "there is no proof" and I responded with breeding results that don't fit the "new mutation" model. But people here seem to have memorized some false "rule" that "colors" are somehow inherently different from "patterns" with regards to genetics and refuse to acknowledge evidence to the contrary. So now I ask -- what further "proof" is required? Just let me know, and I'll figure out how to get it for you.

 

[deerman]

Peach Male X Cameo Female = 50% Cameo split to Peach Males, 50% Peach Females

Cameo Male X Peach Female = 50% Cameo split to Peach Males, 50% Cameo Females

so you are saying no matter the father one a peach other cameo all male chicks will be the same.

i bred a silverpied split peach to my one and only cameo bs silverpied. .....didn't get any cameo, all males chicks were blue silver pieds

 

[AquaEyes]

so you are saying no matter the father one a peach other cameo all male chicks will be the same.

i bred a silverpied split peach to my one and only cameo bs silverpied. .....didn't get any cameo, all males chicks were blue silver pieds

From a male split to Peach X female Cameo, 50% of the males will be IB split to Cameo, and 50% Cameo split to Peach. The breeding results I posted were for VISUAL Peach fathers, not SPLITS. So while you didn't get any Cameo sons from that cross, that was still a genetic possibility -- just as while technically breeding splits will give you set probabilities, actual results can vary due to chance.

My question would be if you happened to get any Cameo or Purple daughters -- the chances would be small, but if any occurred, it'd be proof that Peach is Purple-Cameo. Since daughters don't get their Z from their mothers, it'd have to come from their father. Cameo or Purple daughters would happen if the father's Z chromosome with "Peach" on it crossed over with his Z with no mutation on it, and the two colors separated out. The result would be some sperm carrying Z with Purple, and some carrying Z with Cameo.

The odds would be dependent upon how far apart the two genes lie on the Z chromosome -- genes further apart are more likely to separate during crossover. Before the advent of genetic sequencing, determining the distance between two genes on the same chromosome was through measuring incidences of crossover when breeding large numbers of offspring -- numbers you probably didn't achieve from that particular pair.

But now I'm curious -- did you happen to get any Purple or Cameo daughters?

 

[deerman]

got a few peach silver pied hen chicks....no cameo ever...really never have hatch a cameo ever'

i understand dealing with a split male , small number wasn't much proof , i just have not see enough to prove peach is purple /cameo....and hear say is just that.

i got rid of most of my birds. I wonder about peach being cameo/purple. myself just never saw proof. and sad to say producing new colors have not been told.

so until i see the peach purple mating i will still see peach as its own mutation. sorry i have hear some crazy tail of how colors were produce.

i find it funny you want to tell me about genetic in peafowl....I GET IT


so i'm done here......

 

[AquaEyes]

got a few peach silver pied hen chicks....no cameo ever...really never have hatch a cameo ever'

i understand dealing with a split male , small number wasn't much proof , i just have not see enough to prove peach is purple /cameo....and hear say is just that.

i got rid of most of my birds. I wonder about peach being cameo/purple. myself just never saw proof. and sad to say producing new colors have not been told.

so until i see the peach purple mating i will still see peach as its own mutation. sorry i have hear some crazy tail of how colors were produce.

i find it funny you want to tell me about genetic in peafowl....I GET IT


so i'm done here......

It is a peach peachick I have been breeding peach sense 2004 so I know the different in the color. Jay your male being split to peach keep in mind this breeding will produce purple and cameo color chicks also even with all peach color hens. I hope it turns out to be a male but peach male are hard to come by for ever 7 to 8 peach I hatch only 1 will be a male.

Section above bolded by me for emphasis, and found in the thread below:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/546456/peach-peachick/10#post_7028099

What more proof is required? Such a breeding result would not be possible if Peach was a separate mutation. It would be as likely as a male split to Purple giving Cameo offspring, or vice versa.


And yet, the "controversy" continues.......

 

[birdboy82]

i think you would have purple cameos.