Pellet vs Free Range/Foraging

[Aunt Angus]

I'm currently trying to boost my flock's health after a bout of problems.

They currently get All Flock pellets with oyster shell on the side. I rarely give treats (maybe, like, 2x or 3x in the summer to combat heat - that's it). Fresh water daily. Spot clean coop daily, full clean weekly.

So I've been reading a lot about diet. I'm seeing some conflicting info. Of course balanced commercial feed is good, but what about free ranging/foraging? Is that overall detrimental to their health since it isn't balanced commercial feed?

I was thinking about starting a fodder system, but don't want to detract from a balanced diet. I also allow my birds to forage in the pasture daily, and I'm wondering if that's diluting their nutrient intake.

It seems counterintuitive to think that free ranging could be bad for them, but I've read several blogs/articles and a lot of BYC posts suggesting that anything other than pellets (i.e. letting them free range/forage) is bad for them. It's been suggested to me that I should stop letting them consume anything other than pellets, and I'm wondering if that might be better given that these birds are essentially laying machines...

Thoughts?

 

[Weeg]

So I've been reading a lot about diet. I'm seeing some conflicting info. Of course balanced commercial feed is good, but what about free ranging/foraging? Is that overall detrimental to their health since it isn't balanced commercial feed?

There is quite a controversial opinion on this topic.
Some say absolutely nothing should be fed to a chicken other than a complete and balanced diet. I agree with this, for the most part. As you know, anything bagged, dried, or sold as a chicken treat is no good. Its likely high in fat, with very little nutritional value. Causes fatty liver disease etc, you already know all of that.
But, I really think that greens, spouts, and anything green is very beneficial, and important in a chickens diet.
Chickens eat a diet mostly of grains. They're built for that, but it also means its low in antioxidants, and omega 3's are always helpful since grains are very very high in omega 6's, which create inflammation. Another touch on this, big brand chicken feeds can contain waste kitchen products. So basically whatever is leftover from grain based people food. This can be bread, baked goods, etc. That is going to be very high in omega 6's. There are lots of plants, such as hemp seeds, that have omega 3's. Antioxidants are very important since we all have free radicals, which creates oxidative stress, premature aging, cancer, and lots of other diseases. If you don't get antioxidants, you will succumb to those side affects. Thats why chickens should get lots of forage, fruits, and plants, especially laying hens who age so quickly.
For these reasons above, I think that greenery, forage, leafy greens, and non starchy vegetables and berries are incredibly important for chickens.

I was thinking about starting a fodder system, but don't want to detract from a balanced diet. I also allow my birds to forage in the pasture daily, and I'm wondering if that's diluting their nutrient intake.

I think a fodder system is a great idea! Feeding additional things to chickens can be tricky. The problem with anything sold as a treat for chickens is that it has little to no nutritional value. There for it is only diluting the nutrients in a feed. When your taking leafy greens, forage, fodder, and especially micro greens, those foods are very high in nutrients, and very bioavailable as well. With that in mind, greens/forage shouldn't be diluting the diet to the point where it is causing harm. I personally think that it is doing so so much more good than harm.

As you know, my opinion is likely going to be different than others opinions. I do a lot of research on natural nutrition for my dogs, and a lot of it is linked since you feed dogs chicken. You are what you eat when it comes to nutrition, so a poorly fed chicken that you feed to a dog is going to be a poorly fed dog. Because of that I do a lot of research regarding poultry nutrition as well. I'm fairly confident in my opinion.
Oregano is a fantastic immune booster, along with Echinacea, lemon balm, high quality probiotics, ginger, and most all other herbs.

 

[Aunt Angus]

There is quite a controversial opinion on this topic.
Some say absolutely nothing should be fed to a chicken other than a complete and balanced diet. I agree with this, for the most part. As you know, anything bagged, dried, or sold as a chicken treat is no good. Its likely high in fat, with very little nutritional value. Causes fatty liver disease etc, you already know all of that.
But, I really think that greens, spouts, and anything green is very beneficial, and important in a chickens diet.
Chickens eat a diet mostly of grains. They're built for that, but it also means its low in antioxidants, and omega 3's are always helpful since grains are very very high in omega 6's, which create inflammation. Another touch on this, big brand chicken feeds can contain waste kitchen products. So basically whatever is leftover from grain based people food. This can be bread, baked goods, etc. That is going to be very high in omega 6's. There are lots of plants, such as hemp seeds, that have omega 3's. Antioxidants are very important since we all have free radicals, which creates oxidative stress, premature aging, cancer, and lots of other diseases. If you don't get antioxidants, you will succumb to those side affects. Thats why chickens should get lots of forage, fruits, and plants, especially laying hens who age so quickly.
For these reasons above, I think that greenery, forage, leafy greens, and non starchy vegetables and berries are incredibly important for chickens.


I think a fodder system is a great idea! Feeding additional things to chickens can be tricky. The problem with anything sold as a treat for chickens is that it has little to no nutritional value. There for it is only diluting the nutrients in a feed. When your taking leafy greens, forage, fodder, and especially micro greens, those foods are very high in nutrients, and very bioavailable as well. With that in mind, greens/forage shouldn't be diluting the diet to the point where it is causing harm. I personally think that it is doing so so much more good than harm.

As you know, my opinion is likely going to be different than others opinions. I do a lot of research on natural nutrition for my dogs, and a lot of it is linked since you feed dogs chicken. You are what you eat when it comes to nutrition, so a poorly fed chicken that you feed to a dog is going to be a poorly fed dog. Because of that I do a lot of research regarding poultry nutrition as well. I'm fairly confident in my opinion.
Oregano is a fantastic immune booster, along with Echinacea, lemon balm, high quality probiotics, ginger, and most all other herbs.

I value your opinion about a lot of things, Weeg. I don't give treats other than kale, watermelon, cantaloupe, pumpkin, and shrimp, and only in summer months as I can serve all of these chilled or frozen. I don't feed anything bagged and labeled as treats, either.

I am more confused about microgreens, sprouts, etc. as well as grasses, bugs, and whatnot in my pasture. Is it possible that any of those things dilute what they get from feed, thereby causing a dietary imbalance?

I guess I'm concerned that all these seemingly healthy things from fodder or forage might actually cause more harm than good. There seems to be some belief that it is harmful. And as someone who is desperate to keep my birds as healthy as possible, I don't want to "kill them with kindness."

 

[Suzzers]

I'm currently trying to boost my flock's health after a bout of problems.

They currently get All Flock pellets with oyster shell on the side. I rarely give treats (maybe, like, 2x or 3x in the summer to combat heat - that's it). Fresh water daily. Spot clean coop daily, full clean weekly.

So I've been reading a lot about diet. I'm seeing some conflicting info. Of course balanced commercial feed is good, but what about free ranging/foraging? Is that overall detrimental to their health since it isn't balanced commercial feed?

I was thinking about starting a fodder system, but don't want to detract from a balanced diet. I also allow my birds to forage in the pasture daily, and I'm wondering if that's diluting their nutrient intake.

It seems counterintuitive to think that free ranging could be bad for them, but I've read several blogs/articles and a lot of BYC posts suggesting that anything other than pellets (i.e. letting them free range/forage) is bad for them. It's been suggested to me that I should stop letting them consume anything other than pellets, and I'm wondering if that might be better given that these birds are essentially laying machines...

Thoughts?

Free ranging is definitely not bad for them, that sunlight is good for the hen's egg production, and all the good nutrients they find in bugs or whatnot are very good for them and their eggs. I personally have a diet of half good organic pellets and half free range, but that's just what keep my hens healthy. Definitely keep letting them free range, and since you seem to have them for laying, that extra sunlight and nutrients make the eggs even better for your purpose! I wouldn't cut either out entirely, a even balance seems good though.

 

[Weeg]

I am more confused about microgreens, sprouts, etc. as well as grasses, bugs, and whatnot in my pasture. Is it possible that any of those things dilute what they get from feed, thereby causing a dietary imbalance?

If you ask me, nope! Sprouts and micro greens are actually one of the most nutrient dense forms of greens. They are so high in nutiernts, essential fatty acids, vitamins, and minerals, extremely important antioxidants that I think anything they do dilute they add right back in a very bioavailable form. I actually go out of my way to shop for anything green for my chickens at the grocery store since they can't forage right now due to bird flu.
Bugs are a bit different, but live bugs, not dried are going to have way more nutrients than dried bugs. Dried bugs are heat treated which kills most all nutrients in the bug. Since the ones they are foraging are live, it shouldn't be a problem.

 

[Weeg]

I guess I'm concerned that all these seemingly healthy things from fodder or forage might actually cause more harm than good. There seems to be some belief that it is harmful. And as someone who is desperate to keep my birds as healthy as possible, I don't want to "kill them with kindness."

This is completely understandable. And I know for sure there are going to be quite a few controversial opinions on this thread. I'm sure a few that will disagree with me, but I have done a lot of research so am fairly confident in my opinion.
You have right to be concerned if you are talking about something that doesn't have any nutrients, like corn, or a dried mealworm. But when your birds are foraging for something that has very bioavaible nutrients for the birds, its adding whatever its diluting right back in, and shouldn't cause any issues. Its actually adding more back in such as antioxidants, omega 3's, and different bioavailible nutrients. Plus variety which is vital for all animals gut bacteria.
If it were me, I would actually look at my brand of feed I was feeding to look for problems. I wont go there though, I'll definitely get some opposing opinions on that.

 

[Weeg]

I value your opinion about a lot of things, Weeg. I don't give treats other than kale, watermelon, cantaloupe, pumpkin, and shrimp, and only in summer months as I can serve all of these chilled or frozen. I don't feed anything bagged and labeled as treats, either.

I am more confused about microgreens, sprouts, etc. as well as grasses, bugs, and whatnot in my pasture. Is it possible that any of those things dilute what they get from feed, thereby causing a dietary imbalance?

I guess I'm concerned that all these seemingly healthy things from fodder or forage might actually cause more harm than good. There seems to be some belief that it is harmful. And as someone who is desperate to keep my birds as healthy as possible, I don't want to "kill them with kindness."

You reminded me of this.
In this thread, the op has healthy happy chickens thriving off of a 100% free range/forage diet. She never updated so not sure how it did long term, but the chickens in the thread were 1-2 years old to my understanding if I remember correctly. Laying well, and in good body condition. Not suggesting you try this Aunt Angus, but it does show that there is quite a bit of nutritional value in forage. With that in mind it further shows that it likely wont cause a problem in their diet.
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/successful-100-forage-diet-experiment-long-post.1435544/

 

[3KillerBs]

I have forgotten, how old are your birds?

What sort of issues have you had? Is there any reason to think that they could be diet-related?

Have you assessed their range area for the quality of the plants available and the possible presence of anything unhealthy?

 

[NatJ]

So I've been reading a lot about diet. I'm seeing some conflicting info. Of course balanced commercial feed is good, but what about free ranging/foraging? Is that overall detrimental to their health since it isn't balanced commercial feed?

It seems counterintuitive to think that free ranging could be bad for them

Whether foraging and free ranging is bad for their diet depends on what they are finding when they forage.

For example, eating green grass and scratching up worms from a compost pile is likely to be fine.

But if they find a lot of grass seeds and not many bugs, that has about the same nutritional effect as eating a lot of extra grain and not enough protein. (Like when people offer too much scratch.)

And if they forage in a place with spilled grain (like in a barn with other livestock), or pizza (like a place where people eat lunch and think it's fun to feed leftovers to the birds), I think it's obvious what effect that would have on their diet.

It's been suggested to me that I should stop letting them consume anything other than pellets, and I'm wondering if that might be better given that these birds are essentially laying machines...

If your chickens are having health problems,
and if you think those health problems might be related to their diet,
then it might be useful to limit them to only a complete commercial feed, to see if that helps.

A month or two would probably be long enough to show if it makes a difference.

As the seasons change, so do the things they can forage, so they will naturally eat more or less of the commercial feed at some seasons. So if you think about what has happened during the course of the year, you might notice if they are better or worse at what seasons, and see if that correlates with how much of what they eat.

I would probably let them keep foraging unless you have reason to think their diet is causing a problem, but limiting them to commercial food is definitely a safe thing to try, and has a chance of helping (depending on what their actual problem is.)

 

[RubelliteRose]

Do you allow your flock free access to the pellets while they free range? I feel like that is an ideal situation. Mine free range most of the day, but will also go back to the run to grab mouthfuls of crumble a couple times a day as well. They seem to know what they need to eat and left on their own, don't fill up on any one type of food. Berries are normally considered a treat, but while foraging, mine will eat a few strawberries or beautyberries and then move on with out stripping the plant.
Another consideration is that the exercise from free ranging allows for more leeway in their diet. If they are doing laps around a couple of acres, their needs are different than birds confined to a few hundred square feet.