PLANNED POULTRY GUARDING DOG

[Primo]

Deer stand is on my property and area where deer would be targeted would almost certainly be as well. Hunter has to be coming in from west or southwest and walking across properties of multiple neighbors to get there. Vehicle is not going to be targeted. Simply introducing myself should resolve problem. I could take the route my brother does which is to collect tree stands. This is a recurring problem around here that gets really interesting during rifle season. I almost have to wear orange just to work in yard but that does not really help with the projectiles have reach well beyond what the hunter can see. Shotgun and muzzle loader seasons are much less of a concern.

Can't believe you are putting up with this on your property, there are also liability issues if you let it continue. (I am an avid deer hunter and couldn't even imagine hunting on property that I didn't know the boundaries of) Collect his stand and leave a note explaining the reasons why and where he can claim it. Honestly, I wouldn't even be that nice, he knows he is not supposed to be there. If you are really serious and want to catch this guy trespassing, there are game cameras that are wi fi and will alert you and send and images to you real time. You can simply call the police or game warden when you get his image and get him red handed so to speak. (I have personal experience with this working)

 

[centrarchid]

Can't believe you are putting up with this on your property, there are also liability issues if you let it continue. (I am an avid deer hunter and couldn't even imagine hunting on property that I didn't know the boundaries of) Collect his stand and leave a note explaining the reasons why and where he can claim it. Honestly, I wouldn't even be that nice, he knows he is not supposed to be there. If you are really serious and want to catch this guy trespassing, there are game cameras that are wi fi and will alert you and send and images to you real time. You can simply call the police or game warden when you get his image and get him red handed so to speak. (I have personal experience with this working)

I am not a hot head and somebody like me being such can get into trouble. It takes time to respond and couple days were required to start seeing a pattern in his visits. I do not normally patrol such a little patch looking to boot people off even though I have by chance had the opportunity to do so. The stand shall be mine I the morning.

 

[Primo]

I am not a hot head and somebody like me being such can get into trouble. It takes time to respond and couple days were required to start seeing a pattern in his visits. I do not normally patrol such a little patch looking to boot people off even though I have by chance had the opportunity to do so. The stand shall be mine I the morning.

What I posted was no where near "hot head". You also posted "if it's the same dude as last year". I know you feel like the newcomer and think this might get you into a hatfield and mcoy type situation, but you must set the boundaries. I guarantee you this is a neighbor or a neighbors friend. Post the note like I said (just a clear non threating note stating the facts no harm no foul). If your neighbor is worth his salt he will come to collect and apologize.

 

[centrarchid]

Dogs are being left out today, so once birds are cared for and sun is fully up we are going visit the woodlot. Then I will begin tending perimeter in part with purple spray. Fencing also needs mending to keep neighbors cows out. A large tree is nearly felled over fence and it can make some nice firewood. Neighbor to south has problems this time of year with cows (actually calves being weaned) getting out. They don't usually cross fence directly between us but eventually come back through my property trying to get back in, A gate exists between us so owner is likely driving them to my huge back 4 acres (joking). In future that option will be denied as I get sheep / goat paddocks setup. Fencing is going to have to be tightened up a lot to keep the goats in. Having all the extra fences to cross will likely be more effective discouragement for trespassers as well.

 

[centrarchid]

Trespasser situation resolved. I will not be popular for a while since individual is a neighbor that was aware of property boundaries. It would have been better if individual did not know I new who he was. This may take a personal nature for a while where transgression as trespasser will not be related when I am vilified in eyes of other neighbors. All will work out in the longer term still.



Roughly 3/4 of fence perimeter is now cattle tight but will require a few hundred dollars to get same stretch goat and sheep tight. The other 1/4 will cost a couple thousand dollars to get it setup as desired. Part of that is a bit hilly as expected for Ozark topography. Subdividing into paddocks will be relatively cheap since fencing will be the mobile type where only corner post will be in fixed locations. Arrangement will need to made so animals will be able to access barn free-choice otherwise several ponds will need to be dug.


I do have a good number of squirrels in that little patch of woods.

 

[scottcaddy]

Trespasser situation resolved. I will not be popular for a while since individual is a neighbor that was aware of property boundaries. It would have been better if individual did not know I new who he was. This may take a personal nature for a while where transgression as trespasser will not be related when I am vilified in eyes of other neighbors. All will work out in the longer term still.



Roughly 3/4 of fence perimeter is now cattle tight but will require a few hundred dollars to get same stretch goat and sheep tight. The other 1/4 will cost a couple thousand dollars to get it setup as desired. Part of that is a bit hilly as expected for Ozark topography. Subdividing into paddocks will be relatively cheap since fencing will be the mobile type where only corner post will be in fixed locations. Arrangement will need to made so animals will be able to access barn free-choice otherwise several ponds will need to be dug.


I do have a good number of squirrels in that little patch of woods.

Fried or stewed Squirrels make good eating!! Good luck with your neighbor 'who' should have known better.

Scott

 

[centrarchid]

INTERESTING LACK OF PATTERN IN LGD'S WITH RESPECT TO HAWKS


As I drive into my lab each work day I go by three paddocks, each with a different herd and a dog. Less than 1/8 of the landscape has a herd and dog confined to it any giving time owing to the frequent rotation pattern associated with the intensive grazing. Hunting the area very consistently is an adult Red-shouldered Hawk, female I think. She is easy to approach as she hawks for rodents among forage and around feeders since nobody harasses her. What is interesting to note is that she hunts in paddocks with and without livestock / dog and the dogs' behavior. A couple of the dogs flat out ignore her while a couple others will at least "wuff" at her if not give chase. The Akbash chases. Under same situation my dogs would be denying hawk opportunity to hunt area. The hawk poses no threat to livestock and they ignore it. My chickens on the other hand would at least give low intensity alarms which my dogs respond to immediately. My dogs make sense but the variation in the dogs at work is interesting. My assumption is the dogs would be more consistent in their reactions to the hawk. I don't think breeding has anything to do with reactions, rather somehow it is experience.

 

[aart]

INTERESTING LACK OF PATTERN IN LGD'S WITH RESPECT TO HAWKS


As I drive into my lab each work day I go by three paddocks, each with a different herd and a dog. Less than 1/8 of the landscape has a herd and dog confined to it any giving time owing to the frequent rotation pattern associated with the intensive grazing. Hunting the area very consistently is an adult Red-shouldered Hawk, female I think. She is easy to approach as she hawks for rodents among forage and around feeders since nobody harasses her. What is interesting to note is that she hunts in paddocks with and without livestock / dog and the dogs' behavior. A couple of the dogs flat out ignore her while a couple others will at least "wuff" at her if not give chase. The Akbash chases. Under same situation my dogs would be denying hawk opportunity to hunt area. The hawk poses no threat to livestock and they ignore it. My chickens on the other hand would at least give low intensity alarms which my dogs respond to immediately. My dogs make sense but the variation in the dogs at work is interesting. My assumption is the dogs would be more consistent in their reactions to the hawk. I don't think breeding has anything to do with reactions, rather somehow it is experience.

What are the 'herds'? Larger animals maybe that aren't prey to hawks?

 

[centrarchid]

What are the 'herds'? Larger animals maybe that aren't prey to hawks?

Herds are goats and / or sheep. Herds are also broken up by sex and age as well as experiment they are involved with. One herd is all bucks / rams / billies, while a there are multiple doe / ewe / nanny herds. Most are represented by young of kids / lambs. The young are produced from to birthing seasons each year making so you have some pushing a year old and others that are not quite six months. We have another farm with which animals are moved back and forth from. Dogs are also used there but I do not know those. At a third farm intended for organic demonstration / research we have donkeys used as livestock guardians; three I think and each has a different herd although one is associated with a very small herd of beef cattle numbering less than a dozen. All three sites are in Cole County which has a leash law for dogs making so feral dog attacks are extremely rare. Major predators there for ruminants are coyotes and bobcats although raccoons may be problematic for newborns on organic farm. I have seen raccoons steal 20 to 30 lb pigs out of farrowing barn but a single dog, does not have to be big shuts that down.

My location is much tougher where I have all the above baddies plus actual packs of feral dogs larger than a single and sometime two of the LGD's from the farms in Cole County can handle. Those packs in my county (Callaway) are legal until they cause damage so my dogs and I have a much tougher go. I also have a slightly tighter predator management budget than a government owned research facility has.




That is probably more than you wanted but it should help provide a handle on where I get images and make observations. I also know personally a few diversified producers of meat animals including poultry that use LGD's, usually at least two and some have as many as four. One with the higher number of LGD's looses chickens to red-tailed hawks that my dogs would not allow. I can do things they cannot with respect to free-range use for poultry because of the difference range management strategies. I probably could not protect sheep and goats yet but can do a better than they do with chickens. I have had a good forty years experience in one form or another and that does make a difference, especially when much of that involved use of walks for gamefowl.

I will effort to provide more pictures of the farms to illustrate the varied strategies. Some of the dog types are also underrepresented on this site as well which can be rectified. It pretty cool once you realize some pretty small changes in management can impact forage quality and greatly reduce predation losses. I will show some fish related as well. We have used LGD's for them as well although a training effort should have been employed.

 

[aart]

Way more.... cause the main variable is that animals are not hawk prey so dogs don't chase them off....but I understand.