PLEASE HELP! Sick chicken, not eating, walking in circles.

[chantaltee]

Hi there,
I'm very new to these sort of forum's but I'm getting very desperate for advice as I just cannot seem to get answers about my Isa Brown chicken who is very sick. I'm sorry to be long winded, but I'll give you background on her condition.
I've had her for two years and rescued her from a school where she'd been henpecked then locked in a shed. She was barely moving when I found her. She was bobbing her head up and down quite erratically, as thought it was neurological. The vet gave her antibiotics and kept her for two nights. She began eating and I brought her home and nursed her back to health. She eventually could go outside and while she's always been a little slower than the other chickens, she has put on weight and has pretty much made a full recovery.
Last year she went through a light moult and went backwards - very lethargic. Not moving much. I brought her inside, gave her extra food and she came good again.
In December last year she was laying shell-less eggs. They were runny with no shell. We took her to the bird specialist who put her on a hormone implant. At the time she was also not leaving the pen at all but after the hormone implant we put her back with the others and it seemed to be fine.
In January this year, I noticed she wasn't moving out of the pen. I thought it was like last time, so brought her in and tried to feed her. I noticed that within a few days she was walking around and around in circles, moving her head upwards as though she was trying to look at something. She wouldn't stop doing it and wasn't eating. I felt she would get dizzy, but she continued in the circles. She felt like she'd lost a lot of weight. She wasn't losing feathers at this stage and the hormone implant was still active. I felt it was because she hadn't been getting to the food because of the henpecking. We took her to the vet who put her on anti-inflammatories, antibiotics and checked her over. He gave her a good crop feed and showed us how to do it. He said he wasn't sure what was wrong and felt it might have been a stroke. He recommended crop feeding with a special hand-raising mix or watered down pellets. She pretty much stopped walking in circles straight away and seemed to get a lot better than she'd been the last few days.
I started crop feeding her once or twice a day with 60ml of high protein hand rearing mix and pellets. She would barely eat anything despite me giving her all her favourites - pasta, rice, greens, eggs, watermelon. After a few weeks with no more improvement than the initial few days, I took her back and we tried more anti-inflammatories and antibiotics. There was no change.
About a month ago I decided to step up her feeding and she ended up with an impacted crop. She became dehydrated and had lost a huge amount of weight. After some research and another vet visit and more antibiotics, I started giving her olive oil, fennel tea and the hand raising mix, along with a major protein - alternating between sardines, mealworms and eggs. Since I started doing this she has out on 600 grams. But she will absolutely not eat a thing herself. She might peck, but that's it. She doesn't even look at the mealworms.
I've had to continue crop feeding her for three months now and I know this is far too long to be doing this and something is wrong with her. The vet did bloodwork, which came back with nothing. He really hasn't told me anything and just to keep doing what I'm doing. In the last month, she has started losing a lot of feathers and I believe she is moulting. The new feathers are underneath and are coming out more and more. Her poo is very runny and slimy, with a clear and whitish colour - like egg albumen, but it's not egg. There is a bit of brownish green stools in the middle of the poo.
The last few days I've heard her running around like crazy in the laundry where she sleeps. Last night I went to look at what she was doing and she was sprinting around and around the room, making strange sounds as though she was being chased. I haven't seen her move so fast, and this was different to the circling she did previously. It really scared me, so I picked her up and she stopped and then I put her in a pet carrier to contain her so she wouldn't hurt herself. Tonight she is walking in circles again like she'd done previously…this is despite her having regular feeds and putting on weight. She also seems to get very hot and pants a lot. When she does peck at food, her aim seems to be right off. Her beak also has grown as she isn't wearing it down through foraging and I've cut the tip off it to try and make it easier for her to pick up food.
There seems to be no answers whatsoever. Drugs aren't working. We don't know her age, but she is at least 2-3 years old. Feeds are helping. Her feathers are coming out, but the old ones are just snapping off. She doesn't have worms or mites. She did have scaley mite late last year, which I've treated her for.
I don't want to euthanise her when she has put on all this weight and seems to be pretty happy doing her thing most days. She's not particularly active, but she's better than she has been. During the day she will dustbathe or sunbathe and just walk around here and there clucking happily to herself.
To summarise, her symptoms are:
* not eating
* moulting
* comb and waddle went white and crusty, but has since cleared up and is dark red again
* walking in circles (mostly at night time)
* acting frantically and running around (mostly at night time)
* had previously laid shell-less eggs but now on hormone implant
* has been henpecked but now separated from other chickens (none of whom are displaying any similar symptoms)
* panting a lot - seems hot
* breaking feathers (particularly on wings and tail - just snapping off about an inch from the tip)
* has had scaley mite treated
* no worms, mites or other noticeable parasites
* lost weight without intense crop feeding
* runny, whitish coloured poo with little solid material
* not particularly active - sits down a lot, but then gets up and walks around like normal
* appears off balance and doesn't like being held like she used to.

I've wondered if it's something to do with the shell-less eggs, the moulting or the henpecking. But the henpecking should have only occurred after she displayed symptoms of being unwell. The shell-less egg issue has been since treated. But the strange walking in circles thing has me really freaked out. She was very low when I first brought her home and we managed to get her back, so I want to give her the best treatment. Her quality of life is still good because she is still able to get around and respond. If she would eat by herself, I would feel a lot more positive about her and this walking in frantic circles thing is really weird.

If you can shed any insight I would really appreciate it. Thank you.

 

[chooks4life]

I'm sorry, but I believe it's most likely not treatable within the scope of our current knowledge of this issue with Isabrowns, based on my own and other's experiences --- but by all means, if you want to, keep trying, because there must be a way.

St John's Wort/Hypericum has been used successfully with both humans and poultry to treat neurological diseases including Marek's according to some user's experiences on this forum. Having said that, it does become an issue of ethics sooner or later, but I'll leave you to decide when, if she fails to respond to all treatments; I'm not going to push for a cull. I wish you all the best with her. It can be very hard to put an animal down when it's trying to live and hasn't given up, but letting them reach the point of giving up is hard too. But sometimes it's expedient for one animal to suffer so we can learn how to save others. Hard call to make though.

Isabrown hens appear to have a definite use-by date after which a severe degenerative neurological condition starts to show. It can take a year or more to kill them, commonly with apparent short-term recoveries inbetween bouts of debility, which the bird always relapses from. Just recently on this forum I've been seeing many threads with people who are asking what's happening to their Isabrown hens. Always older hens, always neurological degeneration symptoms, always apparently hopeless. It's the same old story everywhere.

My personal experience with Isabrowns has been the same, and so has the experience of everyone I know who's kept them past the usual cull-by date (around 2 years old for high production layers as a general rule).

It's genetic and apparently unique to Isabrowns. Being raised on different diets, in different environments, being treated (or not treated) with different things, has not made any difference except in how quickly they succumb. It seems inevitable but there's no such thing as an incurable disease, just diseases we don't know the cure for.

Sorry to be a downer, but somebody will find the cure sooner or later (I would guess) --- though this is no lightweight problem to tackle. Best wishes with your flock.

 

[ten chicks]

Look up wry neck,the running in circles is often the start of condition.

 

[chantaltee]

Thank you so much for your very in-depth response. I am really grateful to you for taking the time to respond the way you have.

I had no idea that degenerative neurological symptoms are so common in Isa Brown chickens. If this is something that is so common, why has my vet not picked it up I wonder? He has suggested an MRI, and I'm starting to think we should look at this as an option.

You are right about how hard it is to know what to do. I am against euthanising her when she is still showing an interest in her world. She is indeed a precious little hen and I treat her like I would any other of my animals. She has been known to jump up on my knee and go to sleep, purring the whole time. When I rescued her from the school, she had barely anything left in her and yet we got her healthy again. But I've always suspected that she never fully recovered as she's always been a little off balance here and there, and doesn't manage stairs as easily as the other chickens. When she goes down, she goes right down and fast. But I have always kept such a close eye on her that I've got to it before it's gotten worse. That's why this time it's so hard.

I'm going to try the suggestions you made to me about oils and it does make perfect sense that the brain and liver seem to be malfunctioning from a lack of quality fats. The brain is fat, and the liver processes it, so naturally, those would be affected. I believe in giving her every chance to recover, if it's possible. I will let her tell me what the best thing for her will be. If she responds, I'll continue to help her. While she wants to fight, I'll fight along with her. I love her a lot. I'll also reintroduce apple sauce, which I had been giving her a month ago. Omega 3s, 6s, proteins and lots of antioxidant rich foods will be what I'll try to use for her.

At the moment, she is only having these odd neurological symptoms at night time - when it's starting to get darker. I think this might be a reaction to her seeking out shelter and feeling a bit disorientated, and this brings on the circling behaviour. If this truly is a degenerative disease, I will let her keep going for as long as her interest in fighting is still there. She deserves to have support and love and care, so I will keep doing what I can.

I really appreciate your honesty and thank you for letting me know that this is common to Isa Browns. It is such an incredibly unethical practise to allow these hens to exist. I suspect that they know about these issues, but they're just 'chickens' and so nobody is interested in stopping this breeding because they are such good layers. But that simply is not a good enough reason to treat an animal so unkindly and with such apathy. They might be challenged by this condition, but it doesn't mean they don't deserve any less than any other hen.

Thank you.

 

[chantaltee]

Thank you. I will look it up. She has been doing this on and off for a few months, but I'll definitely research it.

 

[chooks4life]

Quote: You're very welcome.

I think this issue is a 'sleeper issue' and will only come to light in future; the majority of vets people on this site report having taken their poultry to appear to have almost no clue about poultry; some are even dangerously uneducated on the subject. Some members of this site are vets themselves and have little or no idea about poultry. Out of all livestock poultry are possibly the one species most preferred to 'cull and replace' rather than treat.

At this point it's anecdotal and easy to dismiss, and originally I dismissed it myself thinking surely it was an isolated local case of one breeder inbreeding with bad stock, but lately it's showing up in poultry owned by people in other countries so it seems I was wrong. If you vet finds something definitive I would love to see their results.

There are a few other possibilities disease-wise, and the PM I sent you should help sort things out by symptoms (thanks to Jennifer if you ever see this, since I quoted you in the PM because you put it all together so handily).

All the best to you and yours.