Please help with diagnosing these poorly chickens. **pics and story included**

[IrishAcreFarm]

X 3 to feed laying feed instead of scratch. Increasing their feed to 20 % flock raiser might with some crushed oystershell on the side would even be best for a few weeks. Worming with SafeGuard paste 1/2 ml per bird may also help. 

Agreed!

 

[Fancychooklady]

Ben, I'd have to agree with our fellow chook keepers. Worm them at 10 day intervals , delice them and definately change their feed. That grain looks like it's all cracked. Once a grain is cracked it has a very short shelf life. There is probably little nutritional value in it. The white stuff around the vent area looks a little gleetish, I'd add a good tablespoon of acv to the waterer.

 

[satay]

I agree with everyone else ben. If they don't want to spend much on feed I would suggest a good layer pellet. Also black oil sunflower seeds should help too. Acv as fancy say will be really good for gut health if they are having any problems. Crush up egg shells great for calcium.

 

[MyHaven]

Yep I'm no expert but I agree with improving the diet and worming. I'd be interested in the outcome of the discharge. I've not ever had that issue.

My sisters flock - all isas and Australorp hybrids looked the same - except for the discharge. Still do a bit but they are improving. She was embarrassed by the comparison when she saw my birds.

They were on a laying mash - but low protein as you know most are too low and also free ranged in the afternoon. We started supplementing the diet with meat meal and occasional fish etc.

My grandmother used to say were as good as a tonic - hard boiled and mashed shells and all.

She doesn't admit it was diet. She discovered a rat infestation in the roof of the coop. Eradicated them and now that her birds Re improving says it was the rats.

The only other thing I would add to the other voices is check out why they aren't roosting? That ladder doesn't look used. What material is it? How wide is it from the phot angle it looks narrow.

Will check in to see how they progress. Latte is georgous.

 

[seminolewind]

A person in a feed store is not the one to ask. They need Layer feed and oyster shell. Without layer feed, they are doing without a lot of stuff they need to stay healthy.

 

[Bens-Hens]

Hi Ben, Those birds are in very poor condition.
I agree with what others have said above, worm them and put them on a feed mix that will actually sustain them!
A trick to help them put condition on quickly is feeding them sardines every other day. Packed with protein and nutrients. This will help stop the feather picking, and over all condition and egg laying issues. It is ideal to feed your flock sardines during moulting season as well.
I would get them on to Super Poultry Mix ASAP. It is currently one of the best feeds around for layers and breeders. I feed my flock 50% Super Poultry Mix ad 50% Layer Crumble. I then mix it together in an ice cream container and add water to turn it into a mash. I also add in garlic powder as a natural wormer. The chickens go crazy for it! Once a week I then mix natural yoghurt into their mash to boost vitamin levels. They get fed this in the morning and then greens from the veggie patch in the afternoons along with soaked 1st grade wheat for extra protein.

Another thing to look at is the size of the pen in relation to the number of chickens. If the pen is too crowded, feather picking can result. If the pen is crowded I definitely would not be advising them to get more chickens either. My pen is 90sqm and I will not keep any more than 12 Australorps (1 roo 11 hens/pullets) in there at any one time. That works out to be about 7.5sqm per chicken. The absolute minimum should be about 5sqm per chicken but I like to be on the safe side.

After reading this I may sound a little harsh but I am sure the condition of the chickens will improve when diet and any overcrowding issues are addressed.
Hope this somewhat helped...

I like the sardines idea, in hand with the rest of the feed improvements. They have 6 birds in an area about 100m2, but that includes a 2x3m garden shed. I don't think space is the problem.

This flock is not very 'fussed over', unlike our spoilt princesses!

Can you see any new feather growth on them? Could they just be molting? Whatever the case, most solutions seem to point to better nutrition/more protein.

No, I did manage to go over a couple of them and could not see new growth. When my wife first told be about their feathers I suggested they might be moulting (two of ours are) but she described the fluffy feathers and I had to go see for myself, so the next day I did the run.

There are not many loose feathers on the ground, our place is covered in them during moult!

I would also check them for vent gleet. Whitish discharge/bare,irritated bottoms can indicate this.

We asked if they use ACV and again it was a blank look, so I will take a small bottle over to get them started and recommend a dosage based of what I use.

Ben, I'd have to agree with our fellow chook keepers. Worm them at 10 day intervals , delice them and definately change their feed. That grain looks like it's all cracked. Once a grain is cracked it has a very short shelf life. There is probably little nutritional value in it. The white stuff around the vent area looks a little gleetish, I'd add a good tablespoon of acv to the waterer.

I have a bottle here that I think I can only use once more (due to resistance) so I will give them to them to use straight away. I will also try a recommendation of adding garlic, as mentioned about the ACV, I'm on it.

Any recommendations for a local product as a mite/lice treatment?

I agree with everyone else ben. If they don't want to spend much on feed I would suggest a good layer pellet. Also black oil sunflower seeds should help too. Acv as fancy say will be really good for gut health if they are having any problems. Crush up egg shells great for calcium.

We just started to use eggshell as a supplement as our mixed age flock is on grower,She change to a layer crumble/pellet. I will try get her to splash out for a bag of the Super Poultry Mix to use at a ratio of 50:50

Yep I'm no expert but I agree with improving the diet and worming. I'd be interested in the outcome of the discharge. I've not ever had that issue.

My sisters flock - all isas and Australorp hybrids looked the same - except for the discharge. Still do a bit but they are improving. She was embarrassed by the comparison when she saw my birds.

They were on a laying mash - but low protein as you know most are too low and also free ranged in the afternoon. We started supplementing the diet with meat meal and occasional fish etc.

My grandmother used to say were as good as a tonic - hard boiled and mashed shells and all.

She doesn't admit it was diet. She discovered a rat infestation in the roof of the coop. Eradicated them and now that her birds Re improving says it was the rats.

The only other thing I would add to the other voices is check out why they aren't roosting? That ladder doesn't look used. What material is it? How wide is it from the phot angle it looks narrow.

Will check in to see how they progress. Latte is georgous.

They used to get extra eggs but lately production has dropped off, hopefully she can put some eggs aside to boil for them as a healthy treat.

The frame that is there is tool thin I think. I tried a similar frame a while back (pool fence) for some little chicks and they liked to climb on it, but once their toes curled all the way around I removed it and made some natural branch roosts. She may have to do the same. Being rescue birds, they have never roosted before, so they will have to go down at dusk and place them on the roost....once they make some.

Latte' was so beautiful, my wife was a bit sad when she saw her and she just looked like the other rescue birds, nothing like when we gave her to them.

A person in a feed store is not the one to ask. They need Layer feed and oyster shell. Without layer feed, they are doing without a lot of stuff they need to stay healthy.

Thanks Seminolwind. This family didn't know any better, and I was not sure how to fix it, until now!


Thank you all very much for taking the time to offer advice.

My action list looks like;
Catch up with the family today,
Do a final lice inspection and look very closely at the oil vent,
Provide a spare bottle of wormer,
Take a bottle of ACV to get them started, recommend regular use,
Recommend change to a production layer feed in crumble or pellet, the first bag to be mixed 50/50 with Super Poultry Mix,
Recommend additional free choice container of dried eggshell or Oyster shell,
Recommend occasional treat of mashed hard boiled eggs including shell,
Recommend occasional addition of garlic granules or gloves to water or feed,
Recommend preventative mite/lice treatment with (whatever local product I can get my hands on)

Hopefully, that puts some form back into the girls and I can rest easy knowing I helped them out.

I will report back with some pics or extra findings.

 

[Bens-Hens]

Firstly, I am sorry I did not report back with any images. They will come soon.

Last weekend I visited and we went to buy some feed. I insisted on Super Poultry Mix and brand name layer crumbles. The wife had said they tried pellets in the past but the chickens didn't like them, so they went with the grain. I pre mixed it for them 50/50. I also gave them a bottle of ACV, which she is mixing into their drinking water every second day. once this lot is gone she will go back to plain layer crumbles. She nearly had a heart attack seeing the price of the Super Mix ($28 compared to the $20.50 she paid for the grain mix. Layer crumbles I think we not that bad at about $22)

I have not had a chance to sneak them some sardines yet hahahaha.

I did stop by this families place today with a few tools to lend a hand. I made a few roosting perches from some natural timbers. One runs slightly elevated along the top of the nest boxes to deter sleeping on the top, and the other runs level across where teh metal frame was. About 3.5m of perch space for 6 birds should be plenty. It's also all above the nest box height, so hopefully tonight the girls are all up with their tender backsides out of their nightly droppings.

The girls look better, feathers don't look any better really, but they looked like they had put on some weight and seemed sprightly. Latte was keen for me to get out of the way so she could lay her egg.

Next time I am there, I will get a few update pics for comparison. Thanks again to those who offered some help.

 

[scottcaddy]

Firstly, I am sorry I did not report back with any images. They will come soon.

Last weekend I visited and we went to buy some feed. I insisted on Super Poultry Mix and brand name layer crumbles. The wife had said they tried pellets in the past but the chickens didn't like them, so they went with the grain. I pre mixed it for them 50/50. I also gave them a bottle of ACV, which she is mixing into their drinking water every second day. once this lot is gone she will go back to plain layer crumbles. She nearly had a heart attack seeing the price of the Super Mix ($28 compared to the $20.50 she paid for the grain mix. Layer crumbles I think we not that bad at about $22)

I have not had a chance to sneak them some sardines yet hahahaha.

I did stop by this families place today with a few tools to lend a hand. I made a few roosting perches from some natural timbers. One runs slightly elevated along the top of the nest boxes to deter sleeping on the top, and the other runs level across where teh metal frame was. About 3.5m of perch space for 6 birds should be plenty. It's also all above the nest box height, so hopefully tonight the girls are all up with their tender backsides out of their nightly droppings.

The girls look better, feathers don't look any better really, but they looked like they had put on some weight and seemed sprightly. Latte was keen for me to get out of the way so she could lay her egg.

Next time I am there, I will get a few update pics for comparison. Thanks again to those who offered some help.

Thanks Ben, it's good to have this update!!

Scott

 

[satay]

Firstly, I am sorry I did not report back with any images. They will come soon.

Last weekend I visited and we went to buy some feed. I insisted on Super Poultry Mix and brand name layer crumbles. The wife had said they tried pellets in the past but the chickens didn't like them, so they went with the grain. I pre mixed it for them 50/50. I also gave them a bottle of ACV, which she is mixing into their drinking water every second day. once this lot is gone she will go back to plain layer crumbles. She nearly had a heart attack seeing the price of the Super Mix ($28 compared to the $20.50 she paid for the grain mix. Layer crumbles I think we not that bad at about $22)

I have not had a chance to sneak them some sardines yet hahahaha.

I did stop by this families place today with a few tools to lend a hand. I made a few roosting perches from some natural timbers. One runs slightly elevated along the top of the nest boxes to deter sleeping on the top, and the other runs level across where teh metal frame was. About 3.5m of perch space for 6 birds should be plenty. It's also all above the nest box height, so hopefully tonight the girls are all up with their tender backsides out of their nightly droppings.

The girls look better, feathers don't look any better really, but they looked like they had put on some weight and seemed sprightly. Latte was keen for me to get out of the way so she could lay her egg.

Next time I am there, I will get a few update pics for comparison. Thanks again to those who offered some help.

Yah Ben. Glad you managed to get them to see the light a little .

 

[Bogtown Chick]

Ben: Thank good ness for you jumping in to lend a hand with this skinny chooks. Sounds like you are doing well helping them out with getting the birds back on formulated feed pellets. I would go with a higher protein feed like flock raiser or gamebird feed. I like the idea of an occasional sardine feast. My birds prefer their whole grain scratch too over their pellets but I know that it's not a complete food for them. One trick on this BYC forum is fermenting the feed. This not only helps save the pricey food from spillage and being pecked out of the feeder onto the ground but it seems to make the nutrients of the feed more bio-available if you will. The birds seem to gain weight on it and produce eggs with yolks jumbo size while providing good intestinal health. And although we are trying to get them to eat more of this food...you will see that a little goes a long way. There is literally tons of information on fermenting feed on BYC, but I'll let yo how I do it. Real easy and simple. I use a clean plastic ice cream bucket. Put a scoop of formulated feed, (just a little scratch and sunflower seeds to peak their interest--no more than 5-10% of the total food) add capful of Apple cider vinegar with the Mother and water until it's an oatmeal consistency. Cover in a warm area with dish towel-stirring once to twice daily. You might have to add a bit more water as it absorbs up. After day 2 you should smell a nice home-made bread dough yeasty smell. It's ready to be served up and the chooks go crazy for it once they have a taste. They maybe put off at first until they are used to it, but then they really clean it up after their first taste. You might note intestinal sloughings as their gut acclimates to the feed. I usually have 2-3 buckets going in a cycle. When one is empty the next one in line is waiting for the next day's feeding. So on and so forth. As the birds put meat back on -- they'll notice that they'll eat less and less of the fermented feed. It's a sign their nutritional needs are being met.

Also...if you are not sure if it is Vent Gleet or mites you could just try ordering up some Nu Stock. I believe it treats both. It can be tough to get here in the states and probably even worse for Australians. But if you find a good reliable on line source maybe you'd have it there in a week or more. Providing the girls with some diversions like hanging cabbages or apples or home-made flock blocks to pick on will maybe help with the feather picking. Dust baths with wood ashes and maybe mixed with some Poultry dust might help. I'm glad you wormed them as well.

Oh. I might also add. Look around to see if they have access to pebbles or smallish gravel for grit. Their crops wont process the food properly and get nutritional value out of it without some grit in their gizzard.

You've already got some solid advice on here for those chooks and sounds like you are well on your way!