Possible bumblefoot, please give any advice you can

[Hadley333]

I feel terrible because I'm trying to treat a swollen toe on our guy. We've noticed 3 weeks ago that he has started favoring it. He is 2-3 years old. I can't get any vets to see him unless I travel 4 hours. I've looked everywhere for an online vet but they won't prescribe antibiotics without seeing him first (edit: seeing him in person), which is very frustrating. Currently I'm soaking the foot in epson salts for 10 minutes every other day and then spraying foot with vetricyn plus poulty care. I've been doing this four days but not seeing any results. Is this supposed to help? This guy struggles every time so I feel bad if I'm stressing him out with no results.

I'm not 100% sure it's bumblefoot. We try to take pics to find a scab /source of infection but can't find any. I've attached our best pics in hopes to get opinions from others.

Please, any advice would be fantastic. Thank you. The very first pic is our most recent pic from this morning.

PS I realize his toenail is very long. I'm not sure if I should clip it before treating the swelling, I don't want to hurt him.

 

[alinas2010]

Welcome to the site! Sorry your guy is having troubles. Bumblefoot is usually the first thing that comes to my mind when I see any type of foot swelling, too. But sometimes that is not the case. Clearer pictures of the bottom of the foot would help, but I don’t see any scabs in those pics. Be sure you’re looking in all the crevices and all around the toe and even in the middle of the foot pad. I had a chicken with bumblefoot who ended up with pus and swelling up in between her toes when the scab was down in the lower middle of her foot pad.

The soaking and spraying you’re doing is somewhat to help reduce swelling, but the idea is mainly to soften any scabs you see so that you can remove them and begin working out any pus (infection). In the event that you do find a scab, the soaks would be followed by triple antibiotic ointment such as neosporin (with no pain reliever in it) and wrapping the foot in gauze and vet wrap very carefully as to not cut off circulation. That would keep the scab moist so that you can continue trying to soften it with the next soak. This process can take days to weeks and even once the scab is soft enough to remove, further soaking and wrapping can be required to draw out the residual pus. It is a very long process to remove a bumblefoot infection fully, sometimes taking 6 months in extreme cases.

If you aren’t able to find any scabs or other signs of bumblefoot on your guy, I encourage you to also explore other avenues to explain the swelling. Could he have injured his toe jumping off of something? Somewhat like a human jams a finger? Does it feel broken at all? Or like swollen, puffy tissue? Pus from an infection will feel hard in a chicken, whereas swelling from an injury will be a bit more squishy feeling, caused by accumulation of tissue fluid to cushion things.

Another possibility is gout, some chickens have been known to get gout. I don’t know much about it, but I’ve generally seen it in more than one joint when I come across it in threads on here. Tart cherry juice will help that. You can search the word gout on here and plenty of threads should pop up with helpful information.

 

[Hadley333]

Welcome to the site! Sorry your guy is having troubles. Bumblefoot is usually the first thing that comes to my mind when I see any type of foot swelling, too. But sometimes that is not the case. Clearer pictures of the bottom of the foot would help, but I don’t see any scabs in those pics. Be sure you’re looking in all the crevices and all around the toe and even in the middle of the foot pad. I had a chicken with bumblefoot who ended up with pus and swelling up in between her toes when the scab was down in the lower middle of her foot pad.

The soaking and spraying you’re doing is somewhat to help reduce swelling, but the idea is mainly to soften any scabs you see so that you can remove them and begin working out any pus (infection). In the event that you do find a scab, the soaks would be followed by triple antibiotic ointment such as neosporin (with no pain reliever in it) and wrapping the foot in gauze and vet wrap very carefully as to not cut off circulation. That would keep the scab moist so that you can continue trying to soften it with the next soak. This process can take days to weeks and even once the scab is soft enough to remove, further soaking and wrapping can be required to draw out the residual pus. It is a very long process to remove a bumblefoot infection fully, sometimes taking 6 months in extreme cases.

If you aren’t able to find any scabs or other signs of bumblefoot on your guy, I encourage you to also explore other avenues to explain the swelling. Could he have injured his toe jumping off of something? Somewhat like a human jams a finger? Does it feel broken at all? Or like swollen, puffy tissue? Pus from an infection will feel hard in a chicken, whereas swelling from an injury will be a bit more squishy feeling, caused by accumulation of tissue fluid to cushion things.

Another possibility is gout, some chickens have been known to get gout. I don’t know much about it, but I’ve generally seen it in more than one joint when I come across it in threads on here. Tart cherry juice will help that. You can search the word gout on here and plenty of threads should pop up with helpful information.

Thank you very much for the feedback! We will try to feel around carefully the next time I have him restrained. He's such a fighter that I feel i'm doing more harm than good so it's frustrating that I may be doing this without actually helping. Wife is really timid too as she is the one looking at feet when I'm trying to hold him.

I've been looking for a scab but couldn't find anything yet.

 

[alinas2010]

Thank you very much for the feedback! We will try to feel around carefully the next time I have him restrained. He's such a fighter that I feel i'm doing more harm than good so it's frustrating that I may be doing this without actually helping. Wife is really timid too as she is the one looking at feet when I'm trying to hold him.

I've been looking for a scab but couldn't find anything yet.

I completely understand. I had the worst time trying to deal with my gal at first, too. Not sure how you’re doing it currently, and I do not have a rooster, so probably a lot different attitude, but a towel helps. Wrap a towel around his body (not too tight) if you need, pinning his wings at his sides, and it’ll restrain his wings from flapping. You can also use it to cover his eyes, people say that helps calm them down too. I’ve never tried covering mines eyes, and I’ve always unwrapped mine if she starts panting.

I’ve also had very good luck spreading a towel or two on the floor and putting a shallow dish down and just having her stand in it. I then stand her in it and distract her with food while she stands in it for her soak. Something like a pancake that I can break into super tiny pieces and feed her very slowly while she stands there in the dish. Sometimes you can only get 5 mins, sometimes you can get 15 or 20, and that’s okay. You just do what you can. Make it work for you and him. After I get as long as I can out of her and it’s time to wrap, I just have my helper scoop her up in the towel and make quick work of dressing or working on her foot. Sucks stressing them out, I know, but it beats loosing a foot to staph infection and some cherry tomatoes or BSFL afterwards are always a good makeup treat.

 

[Hadley333]

I completely understand. I had the worst time trying to deal with my gal at first, too. Not sure how you’re doing it currently, and I do not have a rooster, so probably a lot different attitude, but a towel helps. Wrap a towel around his body (not too tight) if you need, pinning his wings at his sides, and it’ll restrain his wings from flapping. You can also use it to cover his eyes, people say that helps calm them down too. I’ve never tried covering mines eyes, and I’ve always unwrapped mine if she starts panting.

I’ve also had very good luck spreading a towel or two on the floor and putting a shallow dish down and just having her stand in it. I then stand her in it and distract her with food while she stands in it for her soak. Something like a pancake that I can break into super tiny pieces and feed her very slowly while she stands there in the dish. Sometimes you can only get 5 mins, sometimes you can get 15 or 20, and that’s okay. You just do what you can. Make it work for you and him. After I get as long as I can out of her and it’s time to wrap, I just have my helper scoop her up in the towel and make quick work of dressing or working on her foot. Sucks stressing them out, I know, but it beats loosing a foot to staph infection and some cherry tomatoes or BSFL afterwards are always a good makeup treat.View attachment 3930870View attachment 3930871

Those are great pics. To be honest, the one I'm holding in pic is guinea fowl, but I"m so desperate to look for info that this has been the best source so far.

I think the next thing I'm going to do is when I hold him tonight, instead of just spraying the whole foot and wishing for the best we are going to use that little time we have to try to inspect the foot for a source.

I'm going to continue trying the towel. I tried this morning but it resulted in him getting loose and me having to catch him all over again. These buggers are rugged. Thank you again. -

 

[alinas2010]

Those are great pics. To be honest, the one I'm holding in pic is guinea fowl, but I"m so desperate to look for info that this has been the best source so far.

I think the next thing I'm going to do is when I hold him tonight, instead of just spraying the whole foot and wishing for the best we are going to use that little time we have to try to inspect the foot for a source.

I'm going to continue trying the towel. I tried this morning but it resulted in him getting loose and me having to catch him all over again. These buggers are rugged. Thank you again. -

Not a problem. I thought those feathers were awfully pretty! lol yes this is a wonderful site with very helpful information, I’ve learned so much here. I was a long time lurker before joining. It was always the first site that popped up on a google search for chicken questions.

Another helpful bit of advice for you and your wife; have all of your tools ready before you catch the guy. Have your area ready, your flashlight, tweezers, sprays, etc. I’m sure you already know that, but I had to learn that the hard way. Seems obvious?? Idk what I was thinking. Anyways. I used a small dog crate to bring my gal inside every day and she was much easier to treat in an unfamiliar area. It made her a bit more timid I think. She would have had one over on me outside.

Good luck to you guys. Let us know how he gets along and if you need more help you know where to find us.

 

[alinas2010]

I thought this was an interesting post. Something else to consider is an injury around or under the nail bed. I did notice it looks a little red around his nail. It could just be his normal coloring, though. I would’ve kept trying to treat or amputate if I was this person, but my chickens are pets and I love them so:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...toe-swelling-and-peeling-bumble-foot.1505656/

 

[Hadley333]

Hi, just wanted to update everyone. I couldn't find a source to the infection so we decided to travel to a vet today that would look at birds. It was a long trip for all of us but so worth it. The vet couldn't find a source to the infection so we did an xray and it was obvious that the infection was well into the bone of the toe. We could have attempted antibiotics but good chance they wouldn't work which would lead to more trips. So we decided to do what was most likely the inevitable, which was to amputate the toe. Just got back and he's doing well.

Thanks for offering suggestions. If anyone happens to be in maine and looking for a good vet Kindred Spirits in Orrington was absolutely fantastic. I wish they would accept me as a patient instead of the health care that's available in my area lol.

 

[alinas2010]

Hi, just wanted to update everyone. I couldn't find a source to the infection so we decided to travel to a vet today that would look at birds. It was a long trip for all of us but so worth it. The vet couldn't find a source to the infection so we did an xray and it was obvious that the infection was well into the bone of the toe. We could have attempted antibiotics but good chance they wouldn't work which would lead to more trips. So we decided to do what was most likely the inevitable, which was to amputate the toe. Just got back and he's doing well.

Thanks for offering suggestions. If anyone happens to be in maine and looking for a good vet Kindred Spirits in Orrington was absolutely fantastic. I wish they would accept me as a patient instead of the health care that's available in my area lol.

Great to hear he is doing well and that you found a vet! Good poultry vets are hard to come by. Sounds like amputation was the best choice and he’ll be much better off without the toe. Hope his recovery goes smoothly! Thanks for the update.