Question about protein

[U_Stormcrow]

I get 24% Game Bird "Grower" and add it to 16% layer, usually 1 bag GBG to 3 bags LC (18% final protein). Paying cash, and buying 10 bags at a time, I've got my feed bill down to about $0.22/lb.

The excess calcium from the layer (though the local mill skimps some) isn't great for my males (average of 2.5% - 3% calcium +/-), but the truth is, I cull almost all of the males before maturity, they don't have a lot of time for calcium buildup to become a health issue. My "keeper" I don't expect to keep for more than eighteen months so its a risk to his health I'm willing to take, as there's always a couple hatchings of potential replacements in the wings. Same with my layers, they get till first molt unless there's something special about them.

Not something I would (or do) recommend to the typical backyard owner though. My hatchlings spend the first six - eight weeks (depending on integration) on the GBG alone, except the ducks, they get 1:1.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

I don't remember who, but someone a few years ago, or so told me mixing feeds ruins the quality, or whatever.

I'd be curious of their reasons. All mine comes from the same mill, is fresh to within a week or a few of milling, and doesn't last more than a month or so on my property - so the usual reasons for spoliation don't fit my circumstances. I can see concerns with it not being uniformly distributed (though over time its unlikely any particular bird would always benefit/suffer from that - VERY long odds), but I measure as needed, form a wet mash, and mix thoroughly before feeding.

**Think** I've covered the likely problems, but always interested in what I might not have considered, or known to look out for.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

This is super informative, thank you!

Just amalgamating what I've learned from others, then experienced for myself. I'm not doing anything new, just confirming that their advice works for me, and is consistent with the broader literature. Happy to share - this site has been a wealth of information for me.

 

[MysteryChicken]

I'd be curious of their reasons. All mine comes from the same mill, is fresh to within a week or a few of milling, and doesn't last more than a month or so on my property - so the usual reasons for spoliation don't fit my circumstances. I can see concerns with it not being uniformly distributed (though over time its unlikely any particular bird would always benefit/suffer from that - VERY long odds), but I measure as needed, form a wet mash, and mix thoroughly before feeding.

**Think** I've covered the likely problems, but always interested in what I might not have considered, or known to look out for.

Same.

When I add feed (Different Protein content to 20%) I mix/stir in evenly as possible to make sure everyone is getting the same thing.

 

[Folly's place]

Doing what Stormcrow does works great, IF you have a mill nearby that produces good feeds, and you have a large enough flock to use up all that feed quickly, and store it safely. And the extra time it takes to mix, and mix, and all that.
For most of us, buying something fresh at the feed store, 18% to 20% protein, and using it up within at least eight weeks of it's mill date, is the best plan.
My birds free range most days, and find their own bugs and worms! They get scratch occasionally as a treat, and a few kitchen scraps.
That 16% layer feed, as mentioned, is specifically for caged commercial leghorn type layers, not so much for our home flocks of birds laying, not laying, molting, both sexes, and all ages.
Too much protein is likely in the 24% and up range, and all those meal worms and sunflower seeds are very high in fat, taste great, and unbalance their diets unless fed in very small amounts.
Mary

 

[NNYchick]

Not all protein is equal. The percentage of crude protein is not as important as the amino acids used, different animals metabolize different amino acids. This podcast helps explain it. There are about 5-6 nutrition podcasts episodes. I’ve learned so much about how to read the nutrition label on the feed and what the chickens need based on time of year and development stage. https://www.breedersacademy.com/the-misconceptions-about-feeds-feeding-and-nutrition/

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Doing what Stormcrow does works great, IF you have a mill nearby that produces good feeds, and you have a large enough flock to use up all that feed quickly, and store it safely. And the extra time it takes to mix, and mix, and all that.
For most of us, buying something fresh at the feed store, 18% to 20% protein, and using it up within at least eight weeks of it's mill date, is the best plan.
My birds free range most days, and find their own bugs and worms! They get scratch occasionally as a treat, and a few kitchen scraps.
That 16% layer feed, as mentioned, is specifically for caged commercial leghorn type layers, not so much for our home flocks of birds laying, not laying, molting, both sexes, and all ages.
Too much protein is likely in the 24% and up range, and all those meal worms and sunflower seeds are very high in fat, taste great, and unbalance their diets unless fed in very small amounts.
Mary

^^^

This. The whole post is worth repeating, which Is why I quoted it in its entirety. Also why I said "Not something I would (or do) recommend to the typical backyard owner though" in the thread, above.

Go through any of the "what should I feed my birds" threads, and you will find me consistently recommending All Flock/Flock Raiser plus free choice oyster shell (and sometimes complaining that my birds don't care of the 50# bag of the brand of OS I bought). Yes, even with my mix, I still free choice oyster shell for my layers.

 

[HiEverybirdy]

Not all protein is equal. The percentage of crude protein is not as important as the amino acids used, different animals metabolize different amino acids. This podcast helps explain it. There are about 5-6 nutrition podcasts episodes. I’ve learned so much about how to read the nutrition label on the feed and what the chickens need based on time of year and development stage. https://www.breedersacademy.com/the-misconceptions-about-feeds-feeding-and-nutrition/

This podcast is worth a listen. Great "food for thought" about protein, the role of methionine/lysine/cysteine, feeding for a molt, concerns with vegetable proteins and soy- and corn-free, and bioavailability of things like oats and BOSS (having to digest husks means birds don't get as much value as you'd think).

I'm sitting here with a brooder full of ginormous heritage Marans chicks. Breeder said to feed 20%. I trust her but was hedging because I already bought a bag of 18%, based on standard teachings at county extension seminars in years past and concerns that excess protein could cause kidney damage.

After this podcast, I shifted them to a 20% with min 0.5% methionine. I've mixed the 18% into the 20% for the birds in the yard, who I'm moving toward a 20% diet to try to firm up their egg whites.

@U_Stormcrow - you make very important points about knowing your flock goals and that feed choices aren't one-size-fits-all. Someone rotating birds every year should have a different approach than the tender who wants birds to reach old age.

The challenge becomes sussing out which diet is for which goal. The variables are vast, and the information out there is pretty darn confusing.