raising Chickens is for the Birds

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The idea is not to teach a dog to not kill chickens.

The idea is to make the dog adverse to being in close proximity to any chicken ever again.

If the dog won't get within chicken killing distance of chickens, then it can't kill chickens. Our ancestors were unconcerned with the dog's motivation, they just wanted results.

The idea is to modify the dogs behavior instead of teaching him a new Politically Correct way of behaving.

A shock collar works in the same fashion but it requires constant monitoring and certain things on the owners part are Verboten, like you need to put the collar and batteries on a day or two in advance of a training session. The idea being that affixing the shock collar or the chicken that the dog killed on its back is not associated with you. If it is you are only training the pooch to avoid you.

A dog, a coyote, or even the big bad wolf tucks its tail between its legs to protect certain tender tidbits of flesh located in this anatomical neither region. Never mind that every time that you've chewed your dog's butt out for bad behavior that you've never bitten him. Dog is just acting on a sufficiency of caution when it tucks its tail between its hind legs.

The wolf in this video holds off a pack of coyotes until the wolf is full of elk meat. The wolf tucks his tail every time he attacks or chases the coyote pack. I don't think that Mr Wolf is signaling his submissiveness to the coyotes because the wolf has plenty of opportunities to head to the tall timber, he is more likely being cautious because of the fact that wolves are not born with a second pair of eyeballs in the back of their head.

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E collars really need to only be used by experienced dog trainers/people.
I have two pit bulls who are 100% ok with my chickens.
One was introduced as a puppy and one as a 3 year old.
Issues for a month with the 3rd old, but now she doesn't even look at them. I never used an e collar on her. Just lots of research for desensitize training and focus training. Your pup is too young. You need to keep it leashed and correct it when it gets in prey mode or does anything not ok. Terriers are working breeds....exercise, train, and consitancy.
 
The idea is not to teach a dog to not kill chickens.

The idea is to make the dog adverse to being in close proximity to any chicken ever again.

Wrong, wrong, WRONG!! The idea SHOULD be to socialize and train your dog to live in harmony with your chickens. Great relationships can be made between dogs and flock/herd animals - there are entire breeds of dogs who excel at working with other animals!

I, for one, do not want my dogs to be "adverse" to my chickens. I don't want them to fear or become jealous of my chickens. I do NOT believe in "breaking" a dog through demoralizing acts, which is what you are describing. My ultimate goal is to get my dogs to understand that the chickens are now part of our family - they are 'pack' members and friends. With proper training and socialization this is ENTIRELY possible. It takes time, patience, consistency, and KNOWLEDGE on the part of the owner.

I am seriously praying that you don't actually have dogs. You are advocating some of the worst training methods I've ever seen. Dogs are FAR smarter and FAR more capable than you are giving them credit for. Please stop watching the discovery channel and actually take a class in dog training before giving advice.
 
Wrong, wrong, WRONG!! The idea SHOULD be to socialize and train your dog to live in harmony with your chickens. Great relationships can be made between dogs and flock/herd animals .... It takes time, patience, consistency, and .....
There is an old saying that goes something like this, "There was never a bronco that can't be rode, and there was never a cowboy that can't be thrown!

What do you recommend when socialization fails? A bullet in the head like another poster suggested?

You said that,
Quote: and .... I should add that it may take a lot of sacrificial chickens to reach your goal. Cruel is as cruel does to both the dog and to the chickens that the dog mauls while its being socialized. Or have you never met a dog that you couldn't ride?
 
i guess i am lucky to have and chihuahua and dachshund like to walk with the chickens,the dachshund is still young 8 months old,after a few "NO" going after chickens and a rooster jumped on him,she walks around chickens,i will take a pic of them today,most of the time they sit of lay on the ground with the chickens
 
Wrong, wrong, WRONG!! The idea SHOULD be to socialize and train your dog to live in harmony with your chickens. Great relationships can be made between dogs and flock/herd animals - there are entire breeds of dogs who excel at working with other animals!

I, for one, do not want my dogs to be "adverse" to my chickens. I don't want them to fear or become jealous of my chickens. I do NOT believe in "breaking" a dog through demoralizing acts, which is what you are describing. My ultimate goal is to get my dogs to understand that the chickens are now part of our family - they are 'pack' members and friends. With proper training and socialization this is ENTIRELY possible. It takes time, patience, consistency, and KNOWLEDGE on the part of the owner.

I am seriously praying that you don't actually have dogs. You are advocating some of the worst training methods I've ever seen. Dogs are FAR smarter and FAR more capable than you are giving them credit for. Please stop watching the discovery channel and actually take a class in dog training before giving advice.

So what you're saying is your the best-of-the-best and you're opinion is the only one that matters? I'm seriously praying you never have the power to control other people the way you would like to. There are many roads that lead to Rome.
 
So what you're saying is your the best-of-the-best and you're opinion is the only one that matters? I'm seriously praying you never have the power to control other people the way you would like to. There are many roads that lead to Rome.

If the other options are a tying dead, rotting corpse around my dog's neck, strapping on a pain collar, or shooting her? Then YES, I prefer my way.

There are many effective, gentle ways to train a dog. As long as they are humane and respectful then more power to you with whatever method you choose. But I prefer positive training techniques to fear and aversion. Funny enough, but it also worked quite well in my classroom when deal with kids. Seems people prefer to be treated with kindness rather than bullying - who would have thought. Guess it's just too outrageous for some to think that dogs might want that too.
 
If the other options are a tying dead, rotting corpse around my dog's neck, strapping on a pain collar, or shooting her? Then YES, I prefer my way.

There are many effective, gentle ways to train a dog. As long as they are humane and respectful then more power to you with whatever method you choose. But I prefer positive training techniques to fear and aversion. Funny enough, but it also worked quite well in my classroom when deal with kids. Seems people prefer to be treated with kindness rather than bullying - who would have thought. Guess it's just too outrageous for some to think that dogs might want that too.



Your point is made very well and I agree. It is time to step back and let your position ride.
 
There is an old saying that goes something like this, "There was never a bronco that can't be rode, and there was never a cowboy that can't be thrown!

What do you recommend when socialization fails? A bullet in the head like another poster suggested?

You said that,
and .... I should add that it may take a lot of sacrificial chickens to reach your goal. Cruel is as cruel does to both the dog and to the chickens that the dog mauls while its being socialized. Or have you never met a dog that you couldn't ride?

Have you actually TRIED training and socializing a dog through positive training techniques? Have you put in the time and effort to see it through? Because I have, many times over. It produces happy, well-adjusted dogs that are a joy to live with.

I have dogs AND chickens. BOTH are my responsibility. I haven't sacrificed ANY of my chickens for the sake of my dogs. Go read what I wrote in this post about the method I used to train my dogs:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/910205/we-just-got-chicks-this-week-dog-troubles#post_13847065

Your comments tell me that you know NOTHING about training dogs. When YOU, the owner, take control of your dogs, they aren't EVER put in a position to fail. I don't just let my dogs 'have at it' with the chickens and call it play time. "Socialization" is not happy hour. It is a training technique that when followed correctly is effective. And yes, for me that has been EVERY time. Some of my dogs have been remarkably quick at picking up training, others have been thick as rocks. The dog in my thumbnail picture, in fact, is part terrier - and her instinct is to chase my chickens. It took TIME, PATEINCE, and WORK to train her to stay calm around the chickens. But we - my dog and I - succeeded.

The other side of the coin that you are forgetting is that my CHICKENS are also participating in socialization and training. Every time I exposed my dogs to the chickens, the chickens were exposed right back. Dogs are predators and chickens instinctively know this. I didn't want my chickens to be stressed out every time they saw my dogs out in the yard. By gradually letting the dogs around them and ensuring that the dogs stayed CALM, the chickens had time to adjust to the dogs. Now they love the dogs and have no fear of them. But that's MY dogs, who they see every day. They still head for the coop when a new dog comes over, which is a good thing. And go take a look at my coop - my CHICKENS don't wander around unprotected either. Their coop and run is reinforced all over with hardware cloth and concrete. They are just as protected as my dogs.

You're hurling a lot of words around like "cruelty" and "mauling." That tells me that you have no real understanding of dog training. It is a very rewarding thing to train a dog and creates a bond that can't even be described. You really don't know what you're missing by sticking to an "aversion" philosophy.
 
Your point is made very well and I agree. It is time to step back and let your position ride.

No, I agree. I'm not going to get into a battle here. My responses were simply to clarify what I had already said because clearly the people attacking missed my point entirely. It makes me so sad, sometimes, to know how some dogs are treated in this world.
 
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