Red hot abd and swollen feet with nodule.

[NorthwoodsChick]

7 month Niederrhiener pullet with red, warm abdomen and swollen feet. Bilateral feet have been progressively getting swollen for about 2 months, now suddenly worse. Stayed in the run on a roost all day today and did not go in at dusk. She let me pick her up and didn’t fight or bite me...very unusual for her. I brought her in, soaked with epsom, gave extra calcium. I don’t feel an egg. abd is not firm, may be somewhat fluctuant but not squishy. She ate, drank, pooped and is resting on a low makeshift roost.
She is eating, drinking, comb, crop and poop is normal and vent looks clear but a little dry (before soak). No others are ill. No diet change.
Abdomen first noticed to be flushed (but not red) last week. She laid her first egg just before Christmas (witnessed) but unsure after that as two other new layers of same breed began.
A nodule showed up on a toe about 2 weeks ago, bled, scabbed and has normal skin over it now. I soaked her feet last week.
No scale, mites or infestations.

On hand for antibiotics is human PenVK 500 and one capsule of doxy 100. Neither given. no avian vet remotely near me so it’s me and BYC. It looks like an abd infection but what and how to manage is where I need guidance, please.
I feel bad for not spotting this abd sooner. She is def a keep your distance gal.
The blue on foot is a cover spray for the nodule from over a week ago, not an injury nor frostbite.

 

[azygous]

Did this begin with respiratory symptoms prior to noticing these current symptoms? https://www.merckvetmanual.com/poultry/mycoplasmosis/mycoplasma-synoviae-infection-in-poultry

It wouldn't hurt to try an antibiotic.

 

[NorthwoodsChick]

Did this begin with respiratory symptoms prior to noticing these current symptoms? https://www.merckvetmanual.com/poultry/mycoplasmosis/mycoplasma-synoviae-infection-in-poultry

It wouldn't hurt to try an antibiotic.

Did this begin with respiratory symptoms prior to noticing these current symptoms? https://www.merckvetmanual.com/poultry/mycoplasmosis/mycoplasma-synoviae-infection-in-poultry

It wouldn't hurt to try an antibiotic.

thx for reply
No resp symptoms that I have seen. The reference reads that resp symptoms may go unnoticed or absent so it’s possible.
Would that lead to her abdomen being so bright red?
I have PenVK 500 mg on hand. Would that be effective for m. synoviae and how should I dose?

 

[azygous]

The "cyclines" such as doxycycline. And Tylosin are the best ones.

This disease can affect the reproductive tract. That could be what the hot abdomen is. This is typically a very difficult disease to treat.

It causes edema in the legs and feet, and that can plague a victim for many months, requiring periodic draining of the fluid.

There is a test you can get to confirm it. It's not cheap, but it's convenient, being done by mail.

 

[azygous]

A PCR test done on a throat swab for a respiratory disease can be obtained at Zoologix Inc. These folks will send you the testing materials (about $25) and do the test. Zoologix Inc 9811 Owensmouth Ave, STE 4, Chatsworth, CA, 91311-9547 818-717-8880 www.zoologix.com This test is around $100. You specify that you want the PCR test for M. synoviae.

 

[NorthwoodsChick]

The "cyclines" such as doxycycline. And Tylosin are the best ones.

This disease can affect the reproductive tract. That could be what the hot abdomen is. This is typically a very difficult disease to treat.

It causes edema in the legs and feet, and that can plague a victim for many months, requiring periodic draining of the fluid.

There is a test you can get to confirm it. It's not cheap, but it's convenient, being done by mail.

I don’t think I can get tylosin or without seeing a vet, which isn’t an option as no vets treat poultry here and none will give abx without seeing the animal. I have one doxy, not enough. I don’t know what to do for her, that’s assuming it is that disease- certainly she has had swollen feet for a couple of months. I chalked it up to the breed which has ‘big legs’ but this now worse. Hocks are spared.

I may have no choice then to try the PCN. It’s that or nothing vs cull. I don’t want her suffering, and she’s seems uncomfortable waddle walking.

Edited to add:
Liquimycin LA inj /oxytetracycline dehydrate 200mg/mL is available at my TSC. .
It is dosed daily according to lbs (odd)
Dosing is 4.5mL per 100 lb (beef cattle).
My pullet is 4 lbs, therefore dose is 0.18 mL IM
Can someone please double check my math.
Where is best place to give IM and how many days do you think I should treat?

I assume egg w/d for at least 2 wks post tx, too.

Hoping tsc has it like site says they do.

 

[azygous]

I saved this post from a BYC member who had researched the dosage for LA200:

"After talking to a Auburn University Poultry Science professor I have found the TRUE dosage for LA-200 to treat gasping, gurgling, congestion, and other symptoms of CRD. Use .20 CC per pound (5lb chicken = 1CC). Inject into breast approx 1/4 inch deep ONCE. Do not inject another dose until day 3! This is a broad spectrum antibiotic that does not begin to dissipate until day 3. On day one, two, and three rub VetRx onto their combs and nostrils and addone ounce of VetRx to one gallon of their water which has to be "faucet hot" to be able to mix with the water. On day three give another dose of LA-200 according to the dosage above and do not give anymore! On days three thru six use the VetRx as used above both topically and in their water supply. Also during this time, put a heat lamp on them and keep them out of the wind. By day seven you should have healthy chickens. This worked miracles for mine who were deathly sick and lying on their sides wth CRD and I did not lose a single one! Follow these instructions precisely and IT WILL WORK FOR YOU!"

 

[NorthwoodsChick]

I saved this post from a BYC member who had researched the dosage for LA200:

"After talking to a Auburn University Poultry Science professor I have found the TRUE dosage for LA-200 to treat gasping, gurgling, congestion, and other symptoms of CRD. Use .20 CC per pound (5lb chicken = 1CC). Inject into breast approx 1/4 inch deep ONCE. Do not inject another dose until day 3! This is a broad spectrum antibiotic that does not begin to dissipate until day 3. On day one, two, and three rub VetRx onto their combs and nostrils and addone ounce of VetRx to one gallon of their water which has to be "faucet hot" to be able to mix with the water. On day three give another dose of LA-200 according to the dosage above and do not give anymore! On days three thru six use the VetRx as used above both topically and in their water supply. Also during this time, put a heat lamp on them and keep them out of the wind. By day seven you should have healthy chickens. This worked miracles for mine who were deathly sick and lying on their sides wth CRD and I did not lose a single one! Follow these instructions precisely and IT WILL WORK FOR YOU!"

Thank you very much. That is easier to dose, too.
I will get the Abx today. I have VetRx on hand.
I read the sticky on IM inj and feel confident doing that.
After late night research I can’t rule out gout; also impacting the organs. She is drinking water like crazy. Stool looks normal with white uremic cap.

She is behaving more like herself—that is to say she bit me pretty hard while I was examining her
I will post an update in a few days. Thanks, again!!!

 

[NorthwoodsChick]

UPDATE:
I think Donald (pullet) is on the mend but I worry about no eggs yet. Abdomen is much less inflamed yesterday, nontender, still pinkish. I gave a second (and final) antibiotic injection yesterday. Her feet are marginally less swollen but certainty look less tender. She is walking and able to navigate the roost plank.
She is eating, drinking, pooping normal.

She hasn’t laid an egg yet but sits in a nest daily so I’ve been giving her calcium with D 600 mg daily…is that ok or should I stop?
I have Oyster shell on side, I feed All flock 17%. Vent is dry, puckers when I peek. It’s not like a bird that has been laying.