Restrictive covenants in subdivisions?? Has anyone dealt with this? Is it legal?

[THunter]

Covenants can only be enforced by the Homeowners Association, not the government, which affects the degree to which things are enforced. The only recourse a HOA has is to levy fines, post liens, or sue all of which are very expensive and often not worth the trouble. Sure they can levy fines and place liens, but if you're not planning to move, what's that matter to you. The biggest issue is from governmental ordinances. If your county/city allows it but covenants don't then it's all up to the HOA. Get involved in your community and run for a position on the HOA Board, then change the covenants. I am the president of our HOA for that very reason. I didn't want a bunch of "neighborhood Nazis" running the show so I got involved. We keep a very nice community--by actually BUILDING relationships with neighbors---and we use a TON of descretion in enforcement of covenants. And the HOA Board can change the covenants without the approval of the entire membership--just 50% + 1, and we have a couple times.

 

[openheartnurse]

Thank you everyone for your advice and suggestions. Since posting this I found out that there are 5 sections in the subdivision and I was told I was in section 4 of the development (but was told today that that was incorrect and I am in section 5) and the city hall only has information on the restrictive covenant for sections 3-4. I emailed the developer and he has no information on a restrictive covenant and as far as I know, there is no HOA. I e-mailed the county recorder of deeds to see if they have anything on file in the way of restrictive covenants for my subdivision. If they don't have anything on file .... then I am free to raise chickens in town (as long as the planning commission and the city council approve the amended city ordinance) )

 

[Fred's Hens]

THunter, Very good reply. Different HOA write their operational codes or by-laws differently, but YES, HOA rules can indeed be changed. But, they get changed just as the political municipalities get laws changed. With a HOA, everyone has a say, or the opportunity to express their opinion and to vote. It is rare that 100% of the membership take the time to vote, but you never know.

I'm very glad this seems to be working out for you. But this subject comes up quite frequently here on BYC. When buying a house, condo or property, it remains good advice: Know what you are buying into. Know what covenants or easements exist that are attached to the home and property. It is up to the purchaser to do their due diligence. It is very common to hear of these things being disclosed for the first time at your closing. That is a hectic time to discover such things. Sometimes they are buried in the documents. People get excited and just want to get through it. Don't let something come up a year or two later that catches you unaware.

 

[openheartnurse]

Good News!!! The county Recorder of Deeds has nothing on file for Section 5 of my subdivision ... which means that although some of the other sections do have a restrictive covenant, I do NOT! ) One less hurdle to jump, now I have a meeting with the Planning Commission on Wednesday night next week and I hope everything goes well there! This is a GREAT website, everyone is so helpful ... THANKS AGAIN!

 

[Avonlea22]

Deed restrictions and HOA covenants are super tough. Usually ironclad and only the covenant makers themselves, all who are part of the covenant, can amend them. In a subdivision of 200 homeowners, this proves very, very difficult and almost impossible.

In my subdivision, my HOA board said I needed to get a petition signed by 95% of the residents in order to change the covenent that dissalowed chickens. That was over 300 signatures. I decided to just be a rebel.

Good News!!! The county Recorder of Deeds has nothing on file for Section 5 of my subdivision ... which means that although some of the other sections do have a restrictive covenant, I do NOT! ) One less hurdle to jump, now I have a meeting with the Planning Commission on Wednesday night next week and I hope everything goes well there! This is a GREAT website, everyone is so helpful ... THANKS AGAIN!

Best of luck!!!

 

[Chemguy]

That's great news!

 

[WhiteMountainsRanch]

Homeowner's Associations have HUGE powers to deny just about any activity, including flying the American flag on your own property. They can dictate what color you paint your home, whether you can have a garden and what kind of landscaping you can have, what your roof is made of (and the color), where (and whether) you can park your car, etc. Just read the news, seems there is always a story somewhere about HOA's and/or restrictive covenants denying somebody what would seem to be a basic human right. And HOA's also can get very nasty by imposing fines if you don't do what they say... I've heard of people getting liens against their homes and eventually losing them because of such stuff, I guess the concept of a HOA may sound attractive to some people (keep "trash" and things we don't like out of our neighborhood, make everybody look the same, etc), but it can backfire in a heartbeat. I would NEVER live in a place that had a HOA or restrictive covenants.

X2!!!

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Covenants can only be enforced by the Homeowners Association, not the government, which affects the degree to which things are enforced. The only recourse a HOA has is to levy fines, post liens, or sue all of which are very expensive and often not worth the trouble. Sure they can levy fines and place liens, but if you're not planning to move, what's that matter to you. The biggest issue is from governmental ordinances. If your county/city allows it but covenants don't then it's all up to the HOA. Get involved in your community and run for a position on the HOA Board, then change the covenants. I am the president of our HOA for that very reason. I didn't want a bunch of "neighborhood Nazis" running the show so I got involved. We keep a very nice community--by actually BUILDING relationships with neighbors---and we use a TON of descretion in enforcement of covenants. And the HOA Board can change the covenants without the approval of the entire membership--just 50% + 1, and we have a couple times.

I applaud your building community and relationships; that is certainly the way my HOA works. However, state statutes can limit things that covenants can forbid. A couple of examples in Arizona are guaranteeing the right to fly an American (and several other) flag, and placing solar panels on the roof. They do give HOAs some leeway, such as saying that a homeowner cannot have a flagpole that is a hundred feet tall (we can limit it to the height of the house) or not having 100 flagpoles (to are guaranteed by right). FCC already overruled covenants against satellite dishes for television reception. With solar panels, we can make reasonable stipulations that do not affect their efficiency; so placement, number, etc. are pretty much things that could not easily be dictated. I suppose an HOA could require that the framework holding them in place match roof colour or something similar.

If a covenant is not enforced, or is enforced unfairly, after a period of time in which violations of that covenant are not addressed, or addresed only against some violaters, not all, a court can, and often will rule that that particular covenant is no longer enforceable. But generally that does not impact other covenants.

Many states allow homes to be foreclosed upon for unpaid assessments and even for unpaid fines. This has been a very hot topic in many states. There have been cases where a home was foreclosed on when only a very few hundred dollars in fines were owed. In Arizona, we can no longer foreclose at all based upon fines, and foreclosing based upon unpaid assessments is very strict.

In most cases changing the covenants requires a large majority of all property owners to approve a change--typically either 2/3rds or 3/4ths of all owners. Changing bylaws or rules is usually a simple majority of the board. Some older covenants have no built-in procedure for being changed, which means that it would take 100% of the lot owners to agree to a change.

I have almost reached term limits for being on my board--most of that time I was president plus a year's stint as VP to a president who was almost never there. A few months ago I threatened to resign if someone else did not take the job. I am looking forward to a well-earned break

 

[Pastorjack]

It is so ridiculous to move into a gated community to live a better life only to try to fight to bring it down for yourself. I had chickens. I also had 30 acres of land in the Country but when I came here I did not want to hear roosters or smell anything other than flowers and trees. If you want chickens move somewhere where you can have them.

 

[SillyChicken]

It is so ridiculous to move into a gated community to live a better life only to try to fight to bring it down for yourself. I had chickens. I also had 30 acres of land in the Country but when I came here I did not want to hear roosters or smell anything other than flowers and trees. If you want chickens move somewhere where you can have them.

wow, "Pastor"jack ... I have so much I'd like to say........I'm sure many of us, on a chicken forum, don't feel our lives have been brought "down" because we have chickens... rather the opposite really, my life has never been better.