Run Size

[MissAli]

Okay, newbie here asking the same question everyone else has already asked. How large should my outdoor run be? I have 4 standard size Hens. I read on here about 4-5 square feet per chicken, but then I have read elsewhere about numbers up to 12 square feet per bird. We have a coop that is 4'X'4' and 3' high up to the gable (5 feet tall at the highest point), and we are attaching a run. Is a 4x8 foot run sufficient ( it will be 5 feet high)? ( that would be 8 square feet per bird, right?)

What do you recommend?
Thanks!

 

[Darkwings]

I've always heard and used the 10 sq. ft. per bird rule. Bigger is always better if you have the room and materials. That way you have less chances of them picking on each other, and room to always add more.

 

[Ridgerunner]

This is one of those questions where there is no hard and fast rigid answer. My suggestion is to add as much room as you can stand, within reason.

Since a lot of building materials come in 4’ or 8’ lengths, I can see the attraction of a 4’ x 8’ run. Will that be big enough? Probably.

The rule of thumb of 4 square feet in the coop along with 10 square feet in the run is intended to keep practically everybody out of trouble, whether they live in Denver, Miami, or Duluth, Perth or Inverness, in winter and summer. It is set up for small backyard flocks like yours, but allows a bit for various flock make-ups and different management techniques. The number of chickens you have makes a difference too. The more chickens you have the less room per chicken you generally need. Each chicken has its own personality. Poop load factors into it a bit too. For a lot of people the 4 and 10 rule of thumb is more than they absolutely need, but it really is intended to cover a lot of different circumstances.

I like to provide extra room instead of crowding them because that reduces the possibility of behavior problems. Some chickens take confinement better than others but if they are packed too tightly they tend to fight more and are can be more brutal to each other. If yours “take confinement well” that’s less of an issue. More room reduces my work load. If the poop is spread out more, I may have to manage it less, for example. And more room gives me more flexibility in managing them. For example, if you want to integrate new chickens sometime in the future, that goes a lot easier if you have more room.

So will a 4x8 run be big enough with a 4x4 coop. Probably, but personally I’d go bigger. But then my flock make-up and goals are definitely different than yours.

I do have a strong recommendation though, instead of this wishy washy stuff. I know a lot of fencing materials come in 5 foot heights, but I strongly suggest you make the run taller. That’s not for the chickens’ benefit. They’d be fine in a 2’ tall run. It’s so you can stand up in there.

Good luck with it.

 

[MoonShadows]

The size of your run should be based on many variables. That is why you are finding different sizes as you research. Here on BYC, as Darkwings mentions, you will most often hear 10 square feet per chicken.

I am not refuting 4 sq ft per bird in the coop and 10 sq ft per bird in the run as "minimums" as I read here so often on BYC and because I am rather new to chicken keeping, but I sometimes wonder who those dimensions originated with and when. When I knew nothing, I came to BYC. I read the minimums, had them in mind when building my coop, and have been telling others that ever since when the question has been raised. Are 4 and 10 gospel? Are these dimensions "programmed" into most here because we have heard them since we started and read them all the time here? We often tell others it's "rule of thumb", but you never read "depending on your circumstances."

I think a lot has to do with our birds...types, temperament, individual personalities. I also think a lot has to do with ratio of coop to run. If I have a coop that is 8 sq ft per chicken, do I really need 10 sq ft per bird in the run? if I free range my chickens on a acre, do I really have to give them 4 sq ft per bird to sleep in? How about the climate? Will they be cooped up (pun intended) all winter. I probably want more than 4 sq ft per bird in the coop. Do I raise my chickens in San Diego where they live outside all year and only enter the coop to lay and sleep? How many roosters do I have? What size are my birds? I'm sure there are other variables that will guide our coop and run size, too.

I'm not trying to create a firestorm, and I certainly am not criticizing anyone who has given this advice. (Heck, I have given it myself many times since that is what I "learned" on BYC.) I guess what I am saying is we need to take into account the many variables that each one of us may have in our own situation. To just quickly type out "4 in the coop and 10 in the run" may not be the best advice.

So, MissAli, you can see, there just may not be any standard answer.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Moonshadows, I wrote this a few years back. You might enjoy reading it. I really should update some of the sections but I’m feeling lazy this morning.


I don’t believe in magic numbers for chickens. We keep them in so many different conditions, in different climates, with different flock make-ups, and use so many different management techniques that no one magic number will cover us all. Some of the things that make up the space requirement are, in my opinion:

1. Personal space for the birds. They have different personalities and different individual requirements. Some are very possessive of personal space and some can share. Each flock has its own dynamics.

2. Access to feeder and waterer.

3. Being able to put the feeder and waterer where they will not poop in it when they roost.

4. Roost space. They not only need to have enough room to sleep on the roost, they need to have enough room for them to spread their wings and fly to the roost and to sort out who gets to sleep next to whom and who gets the prime spots once they get on the roost. When they get on, they may jump from some midway support or fly directly to the roost, but either way, they like to spread their wings. And some chickens seem to enjoy blocking the entry points if there are limits. And when they get off, mine tend to want to fly down, not jump to a halfway point. They need room to fly down without bumping into feeders, waterers, nesting boxes, or a wall.

5. Poop load. The larger area they have the less often you have to actively manage the poop. They poop a lot while on the roost so you may have to give that area special consideration, but mucking out the entire coop can be backbreaking work plus you have to have some place to put all that bedding and poop. In my opinion, totally cleaning out the coop is something that needs to happen as seldom as possible.

6. How often are they able to get out of the coop? The more they are confined to the coop, the larger the personal space needs to be. The normal recommendation on this forum is 4 square feet per full sized chicken with a minimum of 10 square feet of run per bird. This additional requirement outside is sometimes not mentioned. How often they are allowed out of the coop may depend on a lot more than just weather. Your work schedule, when you are able to turn them loose, what time of day you open the pop door to let them out or lock them up at night, all this and more enters into the equation. The 4 square feet recommendation assumes they will spend extended time in the coop and not be able to get in the run. What that extended time can safely be depends on a lot of different factor so there is no one correct length of time for everyone.

7. Do you feed and water in the coop or outside. The more they are outside, the less pressure on the size of the coop.

8. The size of the chicken. Bantams require less room than full sized chickens. This has to be tempered by breed and the individual personalities. Some bantams can be more protective of personal space than others, but this is also true of full sized breeds. Young chicks need less space than mature adults.

9. The breed of the chicken. Some handle confinement better than others.

10. The number of chickens. The greater the number of chickens, the more personal space they can have if the square foot per chicken stays constant. Let me explain. Assume each chicken occupies 1 square foot of space. If you have two chickens and 4 square feet per chicken, the two chickens occupy 2 square feet, which leaves 6 square feet for them to explore. If you have ten chickens with 4 square feet per chicken, each chicken has 30 unoccupied square feet to explore. A greater number also can give more space to position the feeders and waterers properly in relation to the roosts and provide access. In general the more chickens you have the less space per chicken you need. You are more likely to get in trouble with 4 square feet per chicken if you have very few chickens.

11. What is your flock make-up? A flock with more than one rooster may be more peaceful if it has more space. I don't want to start the argument about number or roosters here as I know more than one rooster can often peacefully coexist with a flock, but I firmly believe more space helps.

12. What is the maximum number of chickens you will have. Consider hatching chicks or bringing in replacements. Look down the road a bit.

13. Do you want a broody to raise chicks with the flock? A broody needs sufficient room to work with or you risk problems from other chickens.

14. The more space you have, the easier it is to integrate chickens. Chickens have developed a way to live together in a flock. It’s called the pecking order. But establishing that pecking order can be pretty violent. One method they use to take most of the danger out of establishing the pecking order is that the weaker runs away from the stronger when there is a confrontation or they just avoid the stronger to start with. They need room to run away and avoid.

15. The more space you have the more flexibility you have dealing with problems.

I'm sure I am missing several components, but the point I'm trying to make is that we all have different conditions. There is no magic number that suits us all. The 4 square feet in a coop with 10 square feet in the run is a good rule of thumb that most of the time will keep us out of trouble, but not always. People starting out with no experience with chickens need a starting point. The 4 and 10 is a good starting point. For a lot of us it is more than they could possibly squeak by with but I do believe that more is better both in the coop and in the run.

There are also people that have no trouble with a lot less space. If the coop is used only for sleeping and maybe some nest boxes, you can get by with less. But there has to be additional space available when they are awake. If you commit to giving them that space whenever they are awake, you don’t sleep in any mornings and you have to find someone to let them out at the crack of dawn if you are away for a while.

It doesn’t matter if the space is in the coop, coop and run, or they free range and sleep in trees. It’s total space that counts, not just coop size in isolation.

 

[MoonShadows]

You said it much batter than I did. It bears reviewing or repeating every time a new member asks, "How much room do I need for...".

 

[MissAli]

Thanks for everyone for your input, its much appreciated! We were able to expand the width by 2 feet which gives me just over 10 feet per chicken. I think 6x8' will be an acceptable size run for our 4 girls.