Saxony Duck Gasping for Air **Update 8-26-12**

[Miss Lydia]

Would a duck struggle to eat if she had a respiratory problem? Cafe hasn't been able to eat much because every time she does she gags. She is basically only drinking water with nutri-drench in it. She is still very gargly sounding even after two treatments of Ivermectin and two rounds of antibiotics. Even when we give her her antibiotics she gags????
Yes, I went ahead and re-treated for gape worms last night, with a half dose of pour-on Ivermectin. After ready how she would probably die if it were gape worms I didn't see the harm in it.
I don't know what else to do but pray. This one is hard because we love Cafe so much. I am just at a loss as to what to do.
P.S. The good news is she talks to us now, her tail wags when she sees us, and she bobs her head up and down. It's not much but at least there is hope.

Can you wrap her in a towel and have someone hold her so you can swab her throat? they say you can see the worms on the end of a qtip. red with forked heads. I know gross but if you knew for sure that was what it is. What antibiotic are you using? if she had a big load of worms it may take a few days to get them out of her.

 

[azhenhouse]

Can you wrap her in a towel and have someone hold her so you can swab her throat? they say you can see the worms on the end of a qtip. red with forked heads. I know gross but if you knew for sure that was what it is. What antibiotic are you using? if she had a big load of worms it may take a few days to get them out of her. 

Well, I did a visual in her throat and didn't see anything. Does that count or do I need to swab? Will they really show up on the swab? She is on oral Baytril, 1ml twice a day for seven days.

She is carefully eating canned peas, no salt added. She is starving and seems to tolerate the soft peas, but drinks a lot of water with it.

 

[Miss Lydia]

Well, I did a visual in her throat and didn't see anything. Does that count or do I need to swab? Will they really show up on the swab? She is on oral Baytril, 1ml twice a day for seven days.
She is carefully eating canned peas, no salt added. She is starving and seems to tolerate the soft peas, but drinks a lot of water with it.

I am not sure about just looking if you can see far enough. if she is eating thats a good thing. add some nutri drench to the peas as well since you can give it straight into the mouth, any added vits would be a good thing right now. From all i have read about gape worm is you can see them on a swab. Hopefully by the end of the weekend you'll see much improvement. None of the rest showing symptoms though?

 

[azhenhouse]

I am not sure about just looking if you can see far enough. if she is eating thats a good thing. add some nutri drench to the peas as well since you can give it straight into the mouth, any added vits would be a good thing right now. From all i have read about gape worm is you can see them on a swab. Hopefully by the end of the weekend you'll see much improvement. None of the rest showing symptoms though? 

No, thank God. They seem fine but I am worming them all just in case it is gape. How long will they need to stay out of the water after the pour-on treatment, do you know? It has been REALLY wet here, and I don't know if she got sick from that or what. Maybe I wll go to the store and buy those long Q-Tips to swab her throat to see if she has gape.

 

[Miss Lydia]

No, thank God. They seem fine but I am worming them all just in case it is gape. How long will they need to stay out of the water after the pour-on treatment, do you know? It has been REALLY wet here, and I don't know if she got sick from that or what. Maybe I wll go to the store and buy those long Q-Tips to swab her throat to see if she has gape.

I would thin 24 hrs would be long enough for the Ivermectin to work.

 

[duckmamma]

Well, the possibilities look like:
Pneumonia--you're treating with Baytril. Should see improvement within 3 days of starting treatment. You said she may be picking up a bit, which is good.
Gapeworm--You treated with Ivermectin, perhaps twice. Should see improvement within a day or so. I wouldn't retreat unless I was positive she didn't get any of it, because Ivermectin is a strong product. Were you able to get it on her skin...I put it in the duck's "armpit" under their wings, where the feathers are very short. Even 3 drops of the blue liquid "pour-on" Ivermectin would have sufficed, instead of 5.
Aspergillosis--This mold infection, when advanced, could grow in the throat and this would affect your duck's eating. It grows in various parts of the body, eventually colonizing the body and slowly suffocating the bird. If it's been very wet outside, as you say, this would foster the growth of mold. Oftentimes, only the duck with the weakest immune system would get asper while the others are fine. She could have eaten something that was particularly moldy as well. I would definitely call the vet and ask if he could immediately give you the meds (water-soluble fluconazole and terbinifine) to treat asper. I had my duck on fluconazole for 2 weeks and terbinafine for 2 months (both started at the same time). My duck started to improve within a day and soon completely healed. Terbinafine is well tolerated by ducks, as if the fluconazole. Both could be given along with the Baytril. Be sure to keep your duck hydrated.

 

[azhenhouse]

Well, the possibilities look like: 
Pneumonia--you're treating with Baytril. Should see improvement within 3 days of starting treatment. You said she may be picking up a bit, which is good. 
Gapeworm--You treated with Ivermectin, perhaps twice. Should see improvement within a day or so. I wouldn't retreat unless I was positive she didn't get any of it, because Ivermectin is a strong product. Were you able to get it on her skin...I put it in the duck's "armpit" under their wings, where the feathers are very short. Even 3 drops of the blue liquid "pour-on" Ivermectin would have sufficed, instead of 5. 
Aspergillosis--This mold infection, when advanced, could grow in the throat and this would affect your duck's eating. It grows in various parts of the body, eventually colonizing the body and slowly suffocating the bird. If it's been very wet outside, as you say, this would foster the growth of mold. Oftentimes, only the duck with the weakest immune system would get asper while the others are fine. She could have eaten something that was particularly moldy as well. I would definitely call the vet and ask if he could immediately give you the meds (water-soluble fluconazole and terbinifine) to treat asper. I had my duck on fluconazole for 2 weeks and terbinafine for 2 months (both started at the same time). My duck started to improve within a day and soon completely healed. Terbinafine is well tolerated by ducks, as if the fluconazole. Both could be given along with the Baytril. Be sure to keep your duck hydrated. 

Wow, It could be mold. We had a microburst come through and completely saturate their coop. We couldn't get it cleaned out right away, which was a concern of mine. This poor girl is also the one duck that has had some form of health issue since she was a duckling. Unfortunately, I don't think there is a vet open around here on Sundays. Do you think it could wait until Monday? I have Clavamox (15 ml, 1ml three times a day) It was for a parrot of mine that never got used. I don't even remember what it was for. I will have to check to see if it is the same as what you mentioned above. It doesn't expire until 2/2013 so it is still good. Also, the vet said a humidifier could help, but if it's mold I wonder if that is bad.

I won't give her anymore Ivermectin. I am sure she has had enough.

Thanks so much for your help.

Just read and Clavamox is an antibiotic.

UPDATE: Oh, Lord am I tired. It is 11:40pm, and I am just getting back from a 1 1/2 hour drive to a vets office to pick up some fluconazole. This is a different veterinarian from the one I took Cafe to yesterday, and I am very grateful they were willing to help me out. None of the vet offices here have terbinafine, so I am hoping that the fluconazole works. They only had it in pill form so I am dissolving it in water. I am to call the office back if I want it in liquid, and they will call it in from Phoenix. I will probably do that since she will be on the medication for a long time. I hope this works.

 

[duckmamma]

Hi azhenhouse,
I think your duck needs something today or you might lose her, if you wait till Monday to call the vet. The only product I know that you can run out and buy that will kill aspergillus mold, that also will have no side effects for your duck regardless of what it has, is the nanosilver solution like Silver Biotics, or a good colloidal silver solution like Sovereign Silver (available at The Vitamin Shoppe). Here's a page from wildpro website re aspergillosis infection:
http://wildpro.twycrosszoo.org/S/00dis/FungalAlgal/Aspergillosis.htm
Your duck also will need to eat...one thing that very sick ducks I've had seem to relish is blueberries. I buy the big ripe ones, soak them in a bowl full of 1 tb. lemon juice or vinegar and filtered water for 5 minutes, then rinse well--this will remove any pesticide residues. Cut up the blueberries and put in a little ramekin with a little water.
You could also give your duck something to alleviate the effects of any bacterial or fungal toxins in its system...such as 10 mg of alpha lipoic acid per day (put it in the blueberry water). When my duck had asper, it was blowing air like a bellows, so I also gave it something to strengthen its heart, which was coenzyme Q10...the supplement store sells it in softgel capsules of 30 mg each. Your duck could have half a capsule with its blueberries (15 mg/day).

 

[azhenhouse]

Hi azhenhouse,
I think your duck needs something today or you might lose her, if you wait till Monday to call the vet. The only product I know that you can run out and buy that will kill aspergillus mold, that also will have no side effects for your duck regardless of what it has, is the nanosilver solution like Silver Biotics, or a good colloidal silver solution like Sovereign Silver (available at The Vitamin Shoppe). Here's a page from wildpro website re aspergillosis infection: 
http://wildpro.twycrosszoo.org/S/00dis/FungalAlgal/Aspergillosis.htm
Your duck also will need to eat...one thing that very sick ducks I've had seem to relish is blueberries. I buy the big ripe ones, soak them in a bowl full of 1 tb. lemon juice or vinegar and filtered water for 5 minutes, then rinse well--this will remove any pesticide residues. Cut up the blueberries and put in a little ramekin with a little water. 
You could also give your duck something to alleviate the effects of any bacterial or fungal toxins in its system...such as 10 mg of alpha lipoic acid per day (put it in the blueberry water). When my duck had asper, it was blowing air like a bellows, so I also gave it something to strengthen its heart, which was coenzyme Q10...the supplement store sells it in softgel capsules of 30 mg each. Your duck could have half a capsule with its blueberries (15 mg/day). 

Hi, I made a quick update in the previous post. I have a four hour, one way drive ahead of me tomorrow. I just gave her the anti fungal, and will try to update her condition before I leave. If not, it will be when I get home. Thx

 

[duckmamma]

Hi again azhenhouse,
Your update didn't post (for me anyways) until this morning. Hope the fluconazole works. If you have to grind the tablets into powder, I do it with a cast iron skillet, if you don't have a pill grinder. The powder will sink to the bottom of whatever water you put it in, so you'll have to shake it and try to ensure your duck swallows the particles at the bottom. Try putting a little pedialyte in the water to sweeten it up and cover up the bad taste (although ducks don't have a very good sense of taste, thankfully).
I have some terbinafine I can send you, if you like...email me at [email protected]. I'm surprised your vet was unable to get you any...they should be able to get an aqueous solution of it that has 1 mg/ml. They also should have given you water-soluble fluconazole. Strange.
Here's an excellent pdf file that explains asper treatment:
http://130.88.242.202/medicine/Aspe...aspergillus-web/articlesoverflow/kearns03.pdf
Here's an excerpt from that pdf:
A variety of systemic antifungal agents, including ketoconazole (30 mg/kg PO q 12 h), itraconazole (10 mg/kg PO q 12 h),
fluconazole (15 mg/kg PO q 12 h), terbinafine (10 - 15 mg/kg PO q 12 - 24h), and amphotericin B (1.5 mg/kg IV q 8h x 3
days) have been used successfully in the treatment of avian aspergillosis.
I'd still try the silver solution. To cover yourself, I think you should make a list of all your duck's symptoms, and read thru all the possibilities of what it might have, since only you truly know all the details. Here's the webpage I go to do troubleshoot what's wrong with my ducks:
http://wildpro.twycrosszoo.org/list_vols/waterfowl_mod/list_waterfowldiseases.htm
I'm sure you're very drained right now...you are to be commended for caring so much about your little one.