Selective breeding cooperation

[Whiskybear]

My second post tonight, but on an entirely different topic.

When I started with quail this time last year it was with the understanding that jumbo strains had been developed and that with such a fast breeding cycle, stock size could be optimized rapidly. I started this spring experimenting with only incubating huge eggs. It paid off. Last year, I started with birds from Blue Ridge, eggs from Southwest and Myshire. I kept a couple dozen hens averaging 12oz over winter. My first hatch this spring incubating only eggs over 16 grams gave me 10 hens averaging 15 oz. All bigger than their mothers. Bigger eggs do indeed hatch into bigger birds. I now have 20 hens from them to keep over winter for next year. I’ll repeat the process.

This season’s getting late, I’m just doing some large, non-selective hatches to fill my freezer for the winter. Between collecting for those I have a lot of bigger eggs from the old ladies and their bigger daughters going to waste. If I had others looking to optimize breeding stock I would be happy to give them these eggs. Next year, I would love to have such from those people. New blood. Myshire and Southwest will send me whatever eggs they gather the day they send them. Individuals intent on selective breeding could swap select eggs of a certain size. Is anyone interested in setting up a circle for egg swapping like this in the US?

 

[vall]

Those are interesting results. I though (based on JFM lines) that the largest eggs didn't produce the largest birds, but slightly smaller birds laying larger eggs.

I'm interested in swapping eggs, but I won't really have room till next year, and my last hatch didn't give me anyone laying 16g eggs anyway so I need a couple generations to get back up. Mine are all feather sexable and I'd like to keep it that way, though.

 

[Cool-breeze7]

Slightly off topic: how do you distinguish a large egg vs a double yoke? From what I’ve read double yokes don’t do well. Might be where the idea of not incubating the largest eggs comes from. I ask because about once a week I get a 20g-22g egg that’s almost always a double. From the few dozen I’ve weighed I’d say 12g-14g is my typical size.

I might be interested in some egg swaps however all my birds share a large enclosure. Sharing large eggs would be easy but identifying bloodlines is currently impractical for me.

 

[Whiskybear]

My year old hens are giving mostly 15 - 16 gm eggs, but I get a few over 16 every day. Really anomalously large ones, like 18+ are usually double yolk. Double or not, very few of the really big ones seem to hatch (boy have I tried!).
My breeders are in several cages, but I gave up really trying to keep them straight beyond generation. That’s why I’ll be wanting fresh blood (especially males, next year.
VAIL- I'm only keeping jumbo wild. Feather sexable.

 

[Cool-breeze7]

My year old hens are giving mostly 15 - 16 gm eggs, but I get a few over 16 every day. Really anomalously large ones, like 18+ are usually double yolk. Double or not, very few of the really big ones seem to hatch (boy have I tried!).
My breeders are in several cages, but I gave up really trying to keep them straight beyond generation. That’s why I’ll be wanting fresh blood (especially males, next year.
VAIL- I'm only keeping jumbo wild. Feather sexable.

Good insight on the 18g+ being your own cut off. I’ve been planning on trying hatch some of the larger eggs when I have time.

This is my first generation, coming from two different sources. One male which is not feather sexable. The rest are all common quail with who knows what kind of recessive genes floating around.

I’ll be using leg bands to keep generations identified. I figure once a yr/ every other yr I’ll buy some eggs and keep a few males. More or less a very similar plan to what you have.

 

[NatJ]

I kept a couple dozen hens averaging 12oz over winter. My first hatch this spring incubating only eggs over 16 grams gave me 10 hens averaging 15 oz. All bigger than their mothers. Bigger eggs do indeed hatch into bigger birds.

This season’s getting late, I’m just doing some large, non-selective hatches to fill my freezer for the winter.

What weights are you getting on the females from those non-selective hatches?

That would be a good comparison, to know if the difference really comes from the large eggs, or from something else (like maybe hybrid vigor, if you're got males breeding females from different genetic lines.)

 

[Whiskybear]

What weights are you getting on the females from those non-selective hatches?

That would be a good comparison, to know if the difference really comes from the large eggs, or from something else (like maybe hybrid vigor, if you're got males breeding females from different genetic lines.)

My first batch where I kept all but the few smallest eggs is in the incubator now. That’s 77 eggs, ought to yeild plenty to compare (if the turner being broken for a couple days didn't ruin them). I can weigh them coming out the incubator to get a sense. The last small batch of 16gm+ eggs was 8 chicks, 6 over 10 grams coming out of incubator. One was almost 11, one was 9.4. I’ll let you know in about 6 days.

 

[NatJ]

My first batch where I kept all but the few smallest eggs is in the incubator now. That’s 77 eggs, ought to yeild plenty to compare (if the turner being broken for a couple days didn't ruin them). I can weigh them coming out the incubator to get a sense. The last small batch of 16gm+ eggs was 8 chicks, 6 over 10 grams coming out of incubator. One was almost 11, one was 9.4. I’ll let you know in about 6 days.

Sounds good!

I am especially interested in adult weights of the ones from small eggs, but I see I'll have to be patient for a while before that can happen!

Chick size at hatch is mostly determined by the size of the egg, so I would expect small eggs to produce small chicks at hatch. I just don't know (yet) if they will grow enough to catch up by adulthood. I do know that among chicken breeds, the largest birds often lay middle-sized eggs, and the largest eggs often come from medium-sized hens. So I've been wondering whether something similar might happen with quail.

 

[Whiskybear]

Well… the hatch got too chaotic to weigh many. I did about 10 out of 40 chicks, small and large seeming ones. One barely over 8gm and several over 11. But I was alone and had some stuck in shells to get to...

More interesting, maybe:
Today one of the gals I set aside for breeding broke a leg. Many of the breeder hens selected this year are bigger than her, but remember her (all their) mothers were from about 11 to barely over 12oz at 6 months (she was about 5 months). Her cull weight (minus a few drops of blood)- 14.3oz. Deboned breast (tared for bag)- 3.63 oz. With legs, that would be a quarter pound of meat from a quail. My hope is to have that as an average of the 10-11 week old stock I’m eating in a couple years. Cross yer fingers for me, eh?

 

[Jetmon135]

My second post tonight, but on an entirely different topic.

When I started with quail this time last year it was with the understanding that jumbo strains had been developed and that with such a fast breeding cycle, stock size could be optimized rapidly. I started this spring experimenting with only incubating huge eggs. It paid off. Last year, I started with birds from Blue Ridge, eggs from Southwest and Myshire. I kept a couple dozen hens averaging 12oz over winter. My first hatch this spring incubating only eggs over 16 grams gave me 10 hens averaging 15 oz. All bigger than their mothers. Bigger eggs do indeed hatch into bigger birds. I now have 20 hens from them to keep over winter for next year. I’ll repeat the process.

This season’s getting late, I’m just doing some large, non-selective hatches to fill my freezer for the winter. Between collecting for those I have a lot of bigger eggs from the old ladies and their bigger daughters going to waste. If I had others looking to optimize breeding stock I would be happy to give them these eggs. Next year, I would love to have such from those people. New blood. Myshire and Southwest will send me whatever eggs they gather the day they send them. Individuals intent on selective breeding could swap select eggs of a certain size. Is anyone interested in setting up a circle for egg swapping like this in the US?