Silkie thread!

[SilverSilkie]

sagersilkies :

Quote:
hm yes, and what she say your mom ?

o when u said import the eggs she was tellin me the same thing​

mom's are the best ;-)
I am located in Belgium (the biggest sports mondial champions place in the world)
I not breed paints (for several reasons)

 

[sager:)silkies]

Quote:
o when u said import the eggs she was tellin me the same thing

mom's are the best ;-)
I am located in Belgium (the biggest sports mondial champions place in the world)
I not breed paints (for several reasons)

u got paints but dont breed them

 

[SilverSilkie]

sagersilkies :

Quote:
mom's are the best ;-)
I am located in Belgium (the biggest sports mondial champions place in the world)
I not breed paints (for several reasons)

u got paints but dont breed them​

I not have them anymore. Gived them all away to a friend in Italy => www.moroseta.com

 

[sager:)silkies]

Quote:
u got paints but dont breed them

I not have them anymore. Gived them all away to a friend in Italy => www.moroseta.com

im goin to italy next year for a trip maybe i could stop buy and get some eggs or something

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Quote:
You cannot get splash if one parent is black. Both parents must carry blue, meaning that they must be either blue or splash. Splash is two copies of the blue gene: if they inherit one copy from each parent they will be splash.

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Quote:
All black chicks (white in Silkies is normally recessive white) but all these black chicks will be carrier of 1 allel of recessive white.
When the cicks become mature they can have outbreak of red/gold in neck/hackle/wings (because most Silkies are based on gold).
This outbreak of red/gold become more possible on Black with unpure ground-color E/eb than on pure ground-color E/E.

I disagree. THere is no way to know what colour the chicks will be--it really depends on all the colour and pattern genes they have that are prevented from expressing by recessive white--every one could give a different result. Many black silkies are not E based; you can make a black bird on just about any E-allele except wheaten. THere are a lot of US silkies that have silver; I do not know if there is a predominance of silver or gold birds here--just that both are common.

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

sagersilkies :

Quote:
A chick that have 2 alleles of recessive white (c/c) is ALWAYS a white whatever is his ground-color. Recessive white is epistatic over all other colorations.

ty so much for the help so if the black silkie has chicks they will be white thats weird​

Only if 1) they carry recessive white (as the previous example would provide) and 2) if paired to another bird that is or carries recessive white. If paired to a recessive white, the odds are 50/50 of white chicks; if paired to another carrier of recessive white, the odds are only 25% for a recessive white bird. Of the remaining quarters, 25% will not have recessive white at all and the remaining 50% will have one copy of recessive white. You will not be able to distinguish between these birds.

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Quote:
The color trait genetics are very confusing to me too. I am always trying to learn more so I'm reading everything I can to try to make sense of it. I understand where you're coming from. That said, I would not experiment with mixing colors without understanding what will bring. You will likely end up losing the good qualities in the silkies you have - not strenghtening them. As someone already said, the black cockerels may grow up to show leakage of other color in the hackles, which many breeders have worked so hard to breed out. If you want to keep a mixed flock, I would use the eggs for something other than hatching.

The basic color-genetics is not really so difficult to understand.
There only 2 color-pigments, black and red and the absence of both = white.
There are only 5 ground-colors.
All five are based on gold or on Silver. Since this is sex-linked there are 5 (ground-colors) X 3 based on possibilities for male => s+/s+ (=gold based) or S/S (=Silver based) or S/s+ (=Golden based). for females this is more simple they can be only 5 (ground-color) X 2 based on possibilities => s+/- (gold based) or S/- (Silver based).
There are only 18 genes to count with (our alphabeth count 26) and there are only a few rules to know as Dominant genes (always with a with Capital => E) and recessive genes (always written with a normal letter => eb).
Keep in mind sexual reproduction as need for every gene 1 allel from papa and 1 allel from mama to come together in a new gene. All genes together give a new subject. Color-genes are only a little part of the totality.
After comes in some more "fine-tuning" knowledge but for the basics this was you have to know.

All started with G.J.Mendel (1822-1884)

I think some of the confusion is that some of the folks asking are kids. Not sure what level in school they are, but they may not have gotten to genetics yet, and their school may or may not cover it well. The other confusing thing is terminology--the difference between allele and gene is not always something that people who are not into genetics understand readily--simply because they haven't been exposed to it. Henk's http://kippenjungle.nl/basisEN.htm#basisEN is an excellent starting point.

 

[SilverSilkie]

Quote:
All black chicks (white in Silkies is normally recessive white) but all these black chicks will be carrier of 1 allel of recessive white.
When the cicks become mature they can have outbreak of red/gold in neck/hackle/wings (because most Silkies are based on gold).
This outbreak of red/gold become more possible on Black with unpure ground-color E/eb than on pure ground-color E/E.

I disagree. THere is no way to know what colour the chicks will be--it really depends on all the colour and pattern genes they have that are prevented from expressing by recessive white--every one could give a different result. Many black silkies are not E based; you can make a black bird on just about any E-allele except wheaten. THere are a lot of US silkies that have silver; I do not know if there is a predominance of silver or gold birds here--just that both are common.

Yes of course all genes have to be taken in consideration. Was why I said there are 18 color-genes.
In this particular case I was speaking of the F2 (maybe you not readed all posts).
I tryed to keep the explanation as simple as possible to explain a cross between a common Black and a common white.
What I intended with the chicks out of a cross Black X white was that they are all carrier of 1 allel of the recessive white C+/c when the white parent was a recessive white c/c
Whatever other genes are present in a recessive white the c/c is epistatic on all => white phenotype.
Whatever is the groundcolor of a Black melanized or not when the phenotype is Black we call it a Black (the heritance will be different when the ground-color is not E/E than with a melanized eb/eb or a E/eb but that was not the point)
When after crossed these chicks (carrier of 1 allel recessive white C+/c) will result in +- 25% recessive white F2 because these becomed 1 allel "c" from father and 1 allel "c" of mother => c/c on whatever groundcolor with whatever other color-genes.
I live in Europe and the change a Silkie is based on gold instead of Silver (when not visible in the phenotype) is much bigger. I can't speak for US.
I know you have a big knowledge of the color-genetics but I not understand your last statement : "I do not know if there is a predominance of silver or gold birds", S is Dominant on s+ and in roosters the S/s+ result mostely in a golden phenotype. Or did you intend something else?

Sorry if I was not explicite enough.

 

[Shayna]

Quote:
LOL that or it's been more than a dozen years since we were in school when genetics were taught. Back then it didn't interest me! Memory is failing too.