so I was wondering

[kimberley848]

Okay, I have a bunch of questions and wanted some opinions please.
I have 4 girls, 2 are originals from my starting my flock and are Plymouth Barred Rocks, both are almost 6yrs old, and I also have a 2yr old Golden Laced Wyandotte and a 2yr old Brown Leghorn.
Lacey, my GLW has bumblefoot.... I didn't have anyone willing to hold her for the surgery, so I took her to my vet. (Thank God- he showed me how to do it, since this was a first for me. And let me just say, the pus gunk that he removed is more like thick cheese! Ewww) Anyway, she finished her antibiotics today and I'm still wrapping her feet daily. When she first started limping, occasionally, I saw the one foot and but when I took her in, we found she had it one both feet! I have some of those chicken "booties" ordered.. and she now has brownish/red tint scabs on her feet, no more heat, no limping or anything. Even with wrapping her feet up, she gets them filthy each day in the dirt bath. So if I put her in the booties, should I still wrap her feet first? Also, it's getting hot here (So CA), and I generally turn on the hose around a fruit tree, letting the water puddle (in grass, not dirt) so they can play and drink in it... a favorite thing of theirs, but should I avoid her getting her feet wet? (I'm thinking of a scab getting rubbed off, even in booties?) Or maybe wrap her feet before putting on the booties?

Next, one of my older girls, Gabby pulled or tore a muscle/tendon/something in her thigh... last year(Aug). I took her to the vet then because I couldn't figure it out, but nothing was broken. She's not underweight, in fact she's my lard-butt of the group, but she still limps, it's worse after she's been sitting or laying down for a while. Any ideas to make life a little easier? She only lays occasionally, but she's a pet and the #2 in the flock.. no one bothers her, she bothers the others.

Anyone heard of arthritis in chickens? My other old gal, Hazel has grown really long nails.. (think of an old dog, where you can only cut so much off), and one middle toe now bends at a joint, but it bends to the side, and looks slightly swollen, but she's never limped, no heat or anything. She's the head girl of the group. Should I be concerned about this?

And lastly, when Foggy, the BL molted last year, her comb "seemed" to shrink a little, before it hung down over her one eye.. completly, but afterwards it's not as large it seems. It doesn't flop over her eye anymore, which is good for her, but I wondered if this was common???

Thanks!

 

[azygous]

You are really putting my reading comprehension to the acid test. I'll do my best.

Bumblefoot no longer needs to be kept clean and bandaged once a sturdy scab forms and you see no swelling around the edges. I had a hen with a severe head wound, and she would dirt bathe after I cleaned and put ointment on it. Finally, I gave up trying to keep the dirt from caking the ointment on her wound, and it healed just dandy nevertheless.

Arthritis in chickens does happen but it's very difficult to diagnose it. There are very serious forms of infectious arthritis, but a chicken will be noticeably sick with that. Regular osteoarthritis will make a chicken slightly lame, but they are otherwise fine. A baby aspirin twice a day can help with the pain if the chicken is reluctant to move around much.

They can injure their legs, but that usually heals within a week or two. It's best to restrict a chicken's movement if you suspect injury instead of arthritis.

Combs plump up and deflate, turn red and become pale with the ebb and flow of hormones. A hen that is molting will have a pale dry comb. If she isn't molting, a pale floppy comb can signify reproductive issues, even cancer. A hen will not be very active, and may have a poor appetite if she has reproductive issues.

So, how'd I do? Do I get a passing grade?

 

[cottagecheese]

An idea for madame Gabby la grosse (don't mind me, just trying to amuse myself by speaking in tongues, next I'm gonna drop some Latin, unavoidable I'm afraid). There are two main remedies in homeopathy for strains, sprains, joint injuries, tendon and ligament problems, they are called Ruta graveolens and Rhus toxicodendron. How do we know which one she needs?
The person needing Rhus tox suffers pain on first movement, but continued movement makes them feel better. (Can we call a chicken a person? Nobody disputes the fact that a hen is a lady and ladies are persons, so yes. ) Rhus tox earned the title “Rusty Gate Remedy” by relieving joint and back pains that hurt on initial movement but improve after limbering up– just like an old gate that squeaks at first but quiets down after a bit. Also like the rusty gate, these joints do not like cold damp weather.
So for Ruta, movement does not ultimately relieve the pain, but for Rhus tox, movement relieves the pain - and you did say that "it's worse after she's been sitting or laying down for a while." So she feels better with movement, so madame Gabby will be greatly helped by Rhus toxicodendron. (You didn't mention if she is married, if not we would call her mademoiselle Gabby). Okay, enough joking, these guys are dead serious:

If you want to give her Rhus tox, we need to discuss her treatment plan (dosage and how to administer it) so I'll keep an eye on this thread.

 

[kimberley848]

You are really putting my reading comprehension to the acid test. I'll do my best.

Bumblefoot no longer needs to be kept clean and bandaged once a sturdy scab forms and you see no swelling around the edges. I had a hen with a severe head wound, and she would dirt bathe after I cleaned and put ointment on it. Finally, I gave up trying to keep the dirt from caking the ointment on her wound, and it healed just dandy nevertheless.

Arthritis in chickens does happen but it's very difficult to diagnose it. There are very serious forms of infectious arthritis, but a chicken will be noticeably sick with that. Regular osteoarthritis will make a chicken slightly lame, but they are otherwise fine. A baby aspirin twice a day can help with the pain if the chicken is reluctant to move around much.

They can injure their legs, but that usually heals within a week or two. It's best to restrict a chicken's movement if you suspect injury instead of arthritis.

Combs plump up and deflate, turn red and become pale with the ebb and flow of hormones. A hen that is molting will have a pale dry comb. If she isn't molting, a pale floppy comb can signify reproductive issues, even cancer. A hen will not be very active, and may have a poor appetite if she has reproductive issues.

So, how'd I do? Do I get a passing grade?

Yes, you get an A+
Good to hear about the bumblefoot, I think I got lucky in catching it before it got really painful for her. Plus I'm sure my vet did a better job than I would've.
The arthritis issue isn't bad, no limping or anything, just a slightly swollen knuckle on one foot, so I'll just watch her.
Re: injured leg. None of my girls are easy handlers, so while Gabby doesn't wander as much as everyone else, separating her would become an issue. She gets around pretty well, just has the limp, and me concerned.
And Foggy's comb is always a wonderful red in color (except for molt), she lays like a production breed would be... it was just one of those things I noticed and wondered about.
So thank you!!!

 

[kimberley848]

An idea for madame Gabby la grosse (don't mind me, just trying to amuse myself by speaking in tongues, next I'm gonna drop some Latin, unavoidable I'm afraid). There are two main remedies in homeopathy for strains, sprains, joint injuries, tendon and ligament problems, they are called Ruta graveolens and Rhus toxicodendron. How do we know which one she needs?
The person needing Rhus tox suffers pain on first movement, but continued movement makes them feel better. (Can we call a chicken a person? Nobody disputes the fact that a hen is a lady and ladies are persons, so yes. ) Rhus tox earned the title “Rusty Gate Remedy” by relieving joint and back pains that hurt on initial movement but improve after limbering up– just like an old gate that squeaks at first but quiets down after a bit. Also like the rusty gate, these joints do not like cold damp weather.
So for Ruta, movement does not ultimately relieve the pain, but for Rhus tox, movement relieves the pain - and you did say that "it's worse after she's been sitting or laying down for a while." So she feels better with movement, so madame Gabby will be greatly helped by Rhus toxicodendron. (You didn't mention if she is married, if not we would call her mademoiselle Gabby). Okay, enough joking, these guys are dead serious:

If you want to give her Rhus tox, we need to discuss her treatment plan (dosage and how to administer it) so I'll keep an eye on this thread.

Okay, wow.... It would be Mademoidelle Gabby as no roos allowed here. What am I looking at if I did want to dose her? She's not exactly my friendliest girl and won't be happy about a lot of handling, so I'd like an idea of what's required? ie: daily/weekly meds? oral dose? etc... Also, if she's medicated, what about eggs? Can they be eaten? I have 3 brown egg layers, of my 4 girls and am only sure of one brown "egg" & who it belongs to.. even though she only lays a few eggs a month, I'm not positive which are hers.... And I assume this would become a daily thing that continues forever like people?
Thank you so much for answering and giving me options!!!

 

[cottagecheese]

Right back atcha for being such a great chicken mom!

There is no problem whatsoever with the eggs, they can be safely eaten. Rhus tox. is made from poison ivy, the original tincture of poison ivy is diluted and diluted and shaken in between the dilutions. We'll give her Rhus tox.30c, it means it was diluted 30 times in a row at a ratio of 1 to 100. So after one dilution there's 1 part tincture of poison ivy and 99 parts water, so that's 1% poison ivy. After two dilutions there's 0.01% poison ivy. After three - 0.0001%. If I'm not mistaken, after 30 dilutions -

0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% poison ivy. So there's nothing to worry about, mademoiselle Gabby won't be poisoned and her eggs will be perfectly edible. Nobody knows why it works (it works energetically, not chemically), but it's the same with all varieties of medicine, I'm surprised reading mainstream medicine texts, how often I find the phrase 'it is not well understood at this time why...' or 'we don't know how...'

The treatment will last a few days at the most, giving her a pill twice daily. Then maybe once in a while a pill if she relapses. You're sure that the limp is less severe after she moves around a little bit, right? The mental picture of Rhus tox. is one of irritability, did I understand correctly that senorita Gabby is a tad irritable?

The pills are ridiculously inexpensive, but special care must be taken when administering because you're not supposed to handle them directly as the remedy is often applied to the outside of the pills and when you touch them, most of the remedy will end up on your fingers ... The easiest way to dispense a pill is to tip one into the lid of the bottle. When there are many to treat, the pill(s) are dissolved in water. But you have only one patient, so imo the 'direct to the beak' method would be best here. That means you tip it from the lid directly in her open beak, not very easy. If the pill falls on the ground it's not viable any more and it has to be thrown out. And they'll fall... and it is forbidden to give them to the patient or to put them back in the bottle once they've been compromised by accidental touching or by falling down. So this circus act twice a day for a few days depending on how she'll respond.

Found something that's really something, a video of a dog cured of paralysis by homeopathy.

There are many many remedies that cure paralysis, the trick is to know which one will work in a particular case. The mental picture is very important (that is a challenge when dealing with chickens, haha). Here the fact that the dog was jealous of another dog led to the pinpointing of his remedy, Lachesis, made from snake venom! Extremely diluted snake venom, of course.

For Gabby with her old injury, the lucky break was the way you described the limp. So what do you think?

 

[kimberley848]

Right back atcha for being such a great chicken mom!

There is no problem whatsoever with the eggs, they can be safely eaten. Rhus tox. is made from poison ivy, the original tincture of poison ivy is diluted and diluted and shaken in between the dilutions. We'll give her Rhus tox.30c, it means it was diluted 30 times in a row at a ratio of 1 to 100. So after one dilution there's 1 part tincture of poison ivy and 99 parts water, so that's 1% poison ivy. After two dilutions there's 0.01% poison ivy. After three - 0.0001%. If I'm not mistaken, after 30 dilutions -

0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% poison ivy. So there's nothing to worry about, mademoiselle Gabby won't be poisoned and her eggs will be perfectly edible. Nobody knows why it works (it works energetically, not chemically), but it's the same with all varieties of medicine, I'm surprised reading mainstream medicine texts, how often I find the phrase 'it is not well understood at this time why...' or 'we don't know how...'

The treatment will last a few days at the most, giving her a pill twice daily. Then maybe once in a while a pill if she relapses. You're sure that the limp is less severe after she moves around a little bit, right? The mental picture of Rhus tox. is one of irritability, did I understand correctly that senorita Gabby is a tad irritable?

The pills are ridiculously inexpensive, but special care must be taken when administering because you're not supposed to handle them directly as the remedy is often applied to the outside of the pills and when you touch them, most of the remedy will end up on your fingers ... The easiest way to dispense a pill is to tip one into the lid of the bottle. When there are many to treat, the pill(s) are dissolved in water. But you have only one patient, so imo the 'direct to the beak' method would be best here. That means you tip it from the lid directly in her open beak, not very easy. If the pill falls on the ground it's not viable any more and it has to be thrown out. And they'll fall... and it is forbidden to give them to the patient or to put them back in the bottle once they've been compromised by accidental touching or by falling down. So this circus act twice a day for a few days depending on how she'll respond.

Found something that's really something, a video of a dog cured of paralysis by homeopathy.

There are many many remedies that cure paralysis, the trick is to know which one will work in a particular case. The mental picture is very important (that is a challenge when dealing with chickens, haha). Here the fact that the dog was jealous of another dog led to the pinpointing of his remedy, Lachesis, made from snake venom! Extremely diluted snake venom, of course.

For Gabby with her old injury, the lucky break was the way you described the limp. So what do you think?

I once again think you are wonderful!!!
I've written this all down and will take it to my vet and get some to try on her. She is definitely worse when first getting up after laying down, but always has some type of limp. Right now, I'm still wrapping Lacey's feet for the bumblefootin the mornings, so giving some meds at the same time shouldn't be an issue... maybe.
Think of military marching, she does that on the one leg... She was keeping all the toes straight, but now it's only the inner toe and her "thumb". She will relax and bend the toes if she's grazing while slowly wandering... and her limp is almost un-noticeable during that. So we'll try a couple week trial and see how it goes! Thank you so much for your help and wonderful advise!!! My hens and I appreciate it!

 

[cottagecheese]

Wait, wait, is your vet 'holistic' or naturopathic, or homeopathic? Because if not, you could be in for a surprise .
So if your vet uses homeopathy, great! But if they don't ... or if you would just prefer to...um...save some dinero... then little old me could still be useful. It's not a big deal and it would be impossible to make a mistake and harm her. Totally up to you.

 

[kimberley848]

Wait, wait, is your vet 'holistic' or naturopathic, or homeopathic? Because if not, you could be in for a surprise .
So if your vet uses homeopathy, great! But if they don't ... or if you would just prefer to...um...save some dinero... then little old me could still be useful. It's not a big deal and it would be impossible to make a mistake and harm her. Totally up to you.

Well, I'm all about saving some dinero, so please be even more useful and share!!!
My vet does it all, and is great about trying out options, but saving me money isn't one of them. So thanks again, I very much appreciate your help and great advice!

 

[DellaMyDarling]

Perhaps, to add, the particular chicken with long nail and crooked toe will be more comfortable with a series of pedicures, no?

Clipping is easy, avoiding bleeding is sometimes not.
I use a clipper sold as a dog's nail clipper that has a slide over stopper to prevent you from clipping too far (theoretically, can still happen.)
Cuddle chicken in a towel on your lap, hold with forearm, use both hands to grab a toe and clip.
Keep some styptic powder or corn starch ready in case of bleeding.
I clip once per week until nail is ideal length (no longer bothering the position of toe.)