Source of Vitamin B deficiency?

[TwistedTayy]

I have a friend that recently bought some younger d’uccle chickens off of me.

Cockerel (h: may 16,2022)
Hens (h: Aug 2, 2021)
Pullets (h: July 4, 2022) sired by a rooster from the same breeder as the cockerel and the moms were the two hens she took

ETA - she got them from me on sept 4, cockerel started showing symptoms around the 21st, and a pullet a few days after that, another pullet yesterday. All chickens were brought inside for rest and supportive care as an injury was suspected with the cockerel until the others started following suit. Poultry cell treatment was added to water yesterday and direct treatment on the symptomatic birds began this morning. The birds that are more symptomatic are all eating, drinking, and have had no change in condition. not better, not worse.

ETA again - I had treated the hens and pullets for suspected cocci a week before they were picked up.

The pullets were broody raised by the hens and were allowed to free range with their supervision. I had been using Kalmbach all natural non gmo 18% starter and kalmbach all natural 16% all flock but I recently switched to Nutrena. The hens are fine but the cockerel and two of the pullets are showing signs of vitamin b deficiency.
We ruled out mareks because the cockerel was the first to fall ill and he’s vaccinated. Anyways they are being treated for Vit B with poultry cell direct and in the water.

MY QUESTION though is I’m concerned the problem started with me. One of my pullets is starting to show symptoms and is from a completely different line. Is Nutrena or kalmbach deficient in vitamin b? Is there a different feed that is better? I have no problem supplementing vitamin b but that seems dumb to me if I’m supplementing because the feed is deficient. My friend is also feeding Nutrena and the original breeder feeds Nutrena also but regularly supplements with brewers yeast.

I can understand treating but that’s not really fixing the source of the problem.

 

[Wyorp Rock]

We ruled out mareks because the cockerel was the first to fall ill and he’s vaccinated. Anyways they are being treated for Vit B with poultry cell direct and in the water.

The best thing you can do is take the worst one to your state lab and have them perform diagnostics and necropsy to find out what the issue is.

You can't rule out Marek's because a bird is vaccinated. The vaccine only helps to lessen the formation of tumors, it does not prevent infection from the virus, so yes...it could be Marek's you are dealing with.

If you suspect Vitamin B2 deficiency, then give the birds 1/4 tablet B-Complex daily and see if there's improvement.

The feeds you are using are balanced poultry feeds and should provide all the necessary nutrition they need. If that's all they have been eating and the feed is fresh, then I'd be looking at other causes. Marek's, genetics (possibly), something in their environment (some type of toxicity), parasites, etc.

 

[TwistedTayy]

The best thing you can do is take the worst one to your state lab and have them perform diagnostics and necropsy to find out what the issue is.

You can't rule out Marek's because a bird is vaccinated. The vaccine only helps to lessen the formation of tumors, it does not prevent infection from the virus, so yes...it could be Marek's you are dealing with.

If you suspect Vitamin B2 deficiency, then give the birds 1/4 tablet B-Complex daily and see if there's improvement.

The feeds you are using are balanced poultry feeds and should provide all the necessary nutrition they need. If that's all they have been eating and the feed is fresh, then I'd be looking at other causes. Marek's, genetics (possibly), something in their environment (some type of toxicity), parasites, etc.

Im inclined to disagree. While I understand that the mareks vaccine doesn't prevent the disease, the symptoms just don't line up. And I mentioned it because I would expect the vaccinated bird to not fall ill a full week before the unvaccinated ones. I have birds from the same hatch/breeder and they are all perfectly healthy. The birds are otherwise healthy and active (as active as they can be). The legs aren't paralyzed. Comb on the cockerel is bright and red (pullets are still too young to have that be an indicator.

There is no "worst" one. They kind of just stopped walking and then plateaued. I can't confirm whether or not it is a Riboflavin deficiency because the only way to know is to treat and see whether or not they get better. Mareks has no treatment (and I don't feel the symptoms fit) so may as well treat for what's treatable. Poultry cell will not make mareks worse to my knowledge.

And besides, I was specifically asking about the feeds and whether there could have been something I did in raising them to cause the deficiency. I'm inclined to err on the side of "they just have higher riboflavin requirements due to genetics." Just looking for a way to prevent this in the future. I only buy about a weeks worth of feed at a time and I don't supplement with scratch in the summer.

Another small possibility is Blackhead/Ringworm but again, not all the symptoms match and id say its less likely than mareks. But I have considered other options besides deficiency.

 

[TwistedTayy]

Update on the affected birds… they are showing either signs of improvement (on the least affected) or arrested decline (on the worst) with treatment for vitamin b deficiency