Swollen foot (no scab, possible internal bumblefoot)

[Frizzled-n-Sizzled]

I've been treating six of our chickens who seem to have developed bumblefoot over the past month or two. Most of them had a typical scab on the bottom of their feet and all but one are healing up well.

Our Blue Copper Marans has me puzzled. A while back, I noticed long growths on her foot pad that looked like elongated scales. They didn’t bother her, so I didn't think much of it. But a few weeks ago, I noticed a scab on them. When I removed the scab (using gloves), yellowish-clear goo and some blood came out, but there was no smell or heat. She did seem to be favoring it a bit. I treated it as if it was bumblefoot, and it’s healing fine. Now, her other foot has become swollen on the top part. There is no heat or typical scabs anywhere on her foot or leg. I wondered if it could be internal bumblefoot, as one of our Polish hens had similar swelling, and when we lanced it, a lot of pus came out. Once we removed it all, she healed quickly, and the swelling was gone by the next day. However, with our Blue Copper Marans, no nasty pus or kernel came out, just some blood. I’m not sure if I went far enough in.

I also considered that her swelling might be because her other foot was sore, as she’s quite a heavy girl, or it could be gout…. I could have stepped on her at some point too. She always gets in the way and is very klutzy. Even as a chick, one foot was larger, and her middle toe was bent and crooked. However, the current swelling is not “normal” for her.

I did reach out to a vet, but they are pushing for X-rays before even seeing her, which would be over $200. I was hoping to try antibiotics first. X-rays seem a bit much.

Here are a few pictures. I started to give her a low dose Asprin in hopes that it may help reduce swelling incase I stepped on her.

Thanks everyone for your time and any thoughts or suggestions you may have!

 

[Debbie292d]

That first picture is adorable with her in a pot.

Besides possible other trauma or bumblefoot, I think she appears to have the start of SLM (scaly leg mites).

Going with the possibility that she got her foot stepped on, that should be fine in a few days provided her foot isn't broken.

I'd slather her feet tonight with vaseline, then repeat in a couple of days, and then repeat again for a third time. Ten days later, do this all again, and that should kill them all. If it's not, it did well to condition her feet.

If you have other chickens, I'd do the same thing for them. It's easiest to go in the coop at night while they're all roosting.

That can take a few months for them to shed their scales and grow new ones so you won't see immediate improvement.

If in a few days that swollen foot isn't improving, and you think that's looking like bumblefoot, then it's going to need to be treated for that.

Here's a great article that covers every aspect of bumblefoot and treatment.
https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/bumblefoot-in-chickens-my-successful-treatment.75244/

 

[Frizzled-n-Sizzled]

That first picture is adorable with her in a pot.

Besides possible other trauma or bumblefoot, I think she appears to have the start of SLM (scaly leg mites).

Going with the possibility that she got her foot stepped on, that should be fine in a few days provided her foot isn't broken.

I'd slather her feet tonight with vaseline, then repeat in a couple of days, and then repeat again for a third time. Ten days later, do this all again, and that should kill them all. If it's not, it did well to condition her feet.

If you have other chickens, I'd do the same thing for them. It's easiest to go in the coop at night while they're all roosting.

That can take a few months for them to shed their scales and grow new ones so you won't see immediate improvement.

If in a few days that swollen foot isn't improving, and you think that's looking like bumblefoot, then it's going to need to be treated for that.

Here's a great article that covers every aspect of bumblefoot and treatment.
https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/bumblefoot-in-chickens-my-successful-treatment.75244/

Thank you for your thoughts. I have been treating her for bumblefoot (both feet) for weeks now. I’ve read every article and watched every YouTube video on bumblefoot, but not much is covered when there is no visible scab, just swelling.

A few people, as well as a local FB forum (many are having the same problem), suggested trying to draw the fluid/pus out with a needle instead of lancing it. I already lanced her, but nothing came out. I hate needles and sharp objects near my fingers, especially with a possible infection.

I ordered stronger drawing salve and am soaking her feet more often with salts. I hope something will pop through soon, or the swelling will settle. So far, nothing is getting worse, and there is no lameness or heat. The swelling may be going down, but it’s too soon to tell.

I’m not too concerned about SLM since everyone’s scales are tight and smooth. The pictures were taken right after a soak, and the bandages stuck to a couple of scales.

For over 5 years, I’ve never had issues with raising and owning chickens. But, our area recently had two major hurricanes. The weather has been wet, hot, and humid, which isn't helping.

My girls are living a chickluxurious life in a covered horse stall barn with outdoor runs. They even have their own chandelier... Maybe they’ve been swinging too much! Haha

None of my girls had severe bumblefoot as I check them daily. The swelling on her foot seems odd. The storm and wet weather could have caused debris to poke them, or they may have jumped off too hard from their roosts during the storm. Our poor neighbor lost six hens in the last storm.

 

[Debbie292d]

I think you're doing right by her so maybe time will tell. I'd think the PRID or whatever you're using should draw that out, but initially, I thought you were considering it's swollen from possibly being stepped on. If the latter is the case, what you're doing by soaking might help that. If bumblefoot, you're catching it early as nearly all of them have a scab. That's what's making it harder for you as there's no known place to either drain or lance. Perhaps in a few days your drawing salve will show something coming.

Good luck!

Oh, P.S. I'd be sure to put her/them on vitamin water to give her a boost, whether she's healing or fighting an infection, that would help support her system. We have both Poultry Cell and Nutradrench and I'd use either one.

 

[Frizzled-n-Sizzled]

I think you're doing right by her so maybe time will tell. I'd think the PRID or whatever you're using should draw that out, but initially, I thought you were considering it's swollen from possibly being stepped on. If the latter is the case, what you're doing by soaking might help that. If bumblefoot, you're catching it early as nearly all of them have a scab. That's what's making it harder for you as there's no known place to either drain or lance. Perhaps in a few days your drawing salve will show something coming.

Good luck!

Oh, P.S. I'd be sure to put her/them on vitamin water to give her a boost, whether she's healing or fighting an infection, that would help support her system. We have both Poultry Cell and Nutradrench and I'd use either one.

Thank you for the encouragement, I’m giving all of them extra vitamins etc. everything you mentioned.
And I will start rubbing with vaseline on those raised scales just in case I’m dealing with SLM too… I am starting to get paranoid!

I watched another video on bumblefoot that was supposedly uploaded by a vet. I almost lost my biscuits…. It’s one of those videos that you should watch before you get chickens. To convince yourself not to buy any or hatching more.

The pus that came out of that bird reminded me much of my one Polish hen who had a swollen foot no scab, but I felt a “kernel” ball moving around…The pus chunk that came out was very similar. She also had a visual scab on the bottom part of her pad that “healed over.”

I have no idea what our BCM girl has going on without seeing a scab and everything hard as a rock….

I’m getting to a point where I just want to rehome them all! I am so worn out from the hurricanes and then wrapping 6+ feet for something, over the past couple of months.

I do know I stepped on one, but I can’t remember who… so it may have been her too

Time will tell, I just don’t want the infection if it is an infection getting to her bones…

I plan to call more vets to see if they are more responsible of their price.

 

[Alilbit88]

Thank you for the encouragement, I’m giving all of them extra vitamins etc. everything you mentioned.
And I will start rubbing with vaseline on those raised scales just in case I’m dealing with SLM too… I am starting to get paranoid!

I watched another video on bumblefoot that was supposedly uploaded by a vet. I almost lost my biscuits…. It’s one of those videos that you should watch before you get chickens. To convince yourself not to buy any or hatching more.

The pus that came out of that bird reminded me much of my one Polish hen who had a swollen foot no scab, but I felt a “kernel” ball moving around…The pus chunk that came out was very similar. She also had a visual scab on the bottom part of her pad that “healed over.”

I have no idea what our BCM girl has going on without seeing a scab and everything hard as a rock….

I’m getting to a point where I just want to rehome them all! I am so worn out from the hurricanes and then wrapping 6+ feet for something, over the past couple of months.

I do know I stepped on one, but I can’t remember who… so it may have been her too

Time will tell, I just don’t want the infection if it is an infection getting to her bones…

I plan to call more vets to see if they are more responsible of their price.

Hi any update on this ? I’m having same issue. Very swollen footpad on one foot but no black/brown dot/scab. The other foot has one but one foot doesn’t. What did you end up doing to get rid of it?

Thanks

 

[Frizzled-n-Sizzled]

Hi any update on this ? I’m having same issue. Very swollen footpad on one foot but no black/brown dot/scab. The other foot has one but one foot doesn’t. What did you end up doing to get rid of it?

Thanks

I continued to soak and used a stronger drawing salve on her for an additional week… incase in was an internal bumblefoot issue… However, I saw no change. I’m personally thinking because she is such a heavy bird and when she was a chick she had bent toes on the same foot that is swollen so she compensates still…. It could just be a calcium build up or arthritis. I would say it looks like gout but she is acting completely normal and not showing any other symptoms. At this point, I am just watching her closely for any discomfort. I did check with a local vet, and the cost of X-rays and surgery was absurd! I had another hen with an internal bumble foot issue and I was able to treat her fine once her bumble worked its way out. This is definitely different.

I hope your hen feels better soon.

 

[Alilbit88]

I continued to soak and used a stronger drawing salve on her for an additional week… incase in was an internal bumblefoot issue… However, I saw no change. I’m personally thinking because she is such a heavy bird and when she was a chick she had bent toes on the same foot that is swollen so she compensates still…. It could just be a calcium build up or arthritis. I would say it looks like gout but she is acting completely normal and not showing any other symptoms. At this point, I am just watching her closely for any discomfort. I did check with a local vet, and the cost of X-rays and surgery was absurd! I had another hen with an internal bumble foot issue and I was able to treat her fine once her bumble worked its way out. This is definitely different.

I hope your hen feels better soon.

What drawing salve did you use and how long did you soak for? How many weeks has it been?
It’s been 2 weeks for mine and the Prid is helping my other chickens. This one foot is gradually getting worse and super swollen.

 

[Alilbit88]

I continued to soak and used a stronger drawing salve on her for an additional week… incase in was an internal bumblefoot issue… However, I saw no change. I’m personally thinking because she is such a heavy bird and when she was a chick she had bent toes on the same foot that is swollen so she compensates still…. It could just be a calcium build up or arthritis. I would say it looks like gout but she is acting completely normal and not showing any other symptoms. At this point, I am just watching her closely for any discomfort. I did check with a local vet, and the cost of X-rays and surgery was absurd! I had another hen with an internal bumble foot issue and I was able to treat her fine once her bumble worked its way out. This is definitely different.

I hope your hen feels better soon.

Hey update maybe it’ll help your hen. So there was no “scab” at the bottom like a typical bumblefoot infection but the foot was so swollen the web between her toes started swelling up really bad last night.

I can feel a hard core at the bottom , when I do the Epsom salt the bottom of the foot u can almost see a white huge core wanting to come out even if there was no dot/scab at the bottom… so I went ahead and lanced it and squeezed it more and low and behold! There was a yellow white hard piece of infection.. some stringy stuff.I can see a few more white pieces in there not wanting to come out. So I just got what I could and continue to do the prid and draw it out.. but for my scenario I had to lance into the hard part and use the prid, then squeeze it more. There was blood so i hesitated the first time and the staph was deeper inside. This will prly take a few weeks or months to get it completely out. But I was able to finally squeeze out some of the infection. Here some pics of what the stuff looks like once it hardens …first pic from the internet ..after that are from my own treatment of another hen but to give you idea what it looks like. It’s whiteish yellow looks like pieces of meat but not connected to the leg and comes out when u squeeze it. I guess it’s when the infection pus has hardened.


But yes had to make an opening for the infection to “come out “ in the middle of the puffy harden swollen part and used prid. If your girl gets worse maybe this can help. I read don’t don’t bumblefoot there bc it can kill them. Hope your hen gets better as well…….

 

[Frizzled-n-Sizzled]

Hey update maybe it’ll help your hen. So there was no “scab” at the bottom like a typical bumblefoot infection but the foot was so swollen the web between her toes started swelling up really bad last night.

I can feel a hard core at the bottom , when I do the Epsom salt the bottom of the foot u can almost see a white huge core wanting to come out even if there was no dot/scab at the bottom… so I went ahead and lanced it and squeezed it more and low and behold! There was a yellow white hard piece of infection.. some stringy stuff.I can see a few more white pieces in there not wanting to come out. So I just got what I could and continue to do the prid and draw it out.. but for my scenario I had to lance into the hard part and use the prid, then squeeze it more. There was blood so i hesitated the first time and the staph was deeper inside. This will prly take a few weeks or months to get it completely out. But I was able to finally squeeze out some of the infection. Here some pics of what the stuff looks like once it hardens …first pic from the internet ..after that are from my own treatment of another hen but to give you idea what it looks like. It’s whiteish yellow looks like pieces of meat but not connected to the leg and comes out when u squeeze it. I guess it’s when the infection pus has hardened.


But yes had to make an opening for the infection to “come out “ in the middle of the puffy harden swollen part and used prid. If your girl gets worse maybe this can help. I read don’t don’t bumblefoot there bc it can kill them. Hope your hen gets better as well…….

Glad you got it out! I had done the same with my one polish hen… I could feel a lump (kernel) moving around and was able to remove it successfully. She healed up pretty fast and you could definitely see an improvement in her behavior almost immediately! However, with my BCM was/is different. I actually lanced her a couple times in different areas but there was nothing to remove and no visual signs of pus or a kernel. :-/

Idk, that’s why I am assuming it’s scar tissue from when she was younger or gout.

I appreciate your input. I hope your baby continue to improves!