The Heritage Rhode Island Red Site

[rodriguezpoultry]

At the Lucasville show this last weekend, a Rhode Island Red male took Reserve American. I took some (poor) pictures as I thought you all would enjoy!

 

[henpeckedmuch]

Actually the same person took 1st 2nd &3rd place cockerel, Reserve American, and Best of Verity. I think I've got that right. He is a friend of mine B. Anderson from NC He has the Don Nelson Line.
A Rademacher of Minnesota did well with his pullets as well. I believe he took 1st 2nd and 3rd verity pullets
And there was a junior there that took home a bag full of trophies for his LF RIR's I think he got them from Mr. Anderson last year.

 

[henpeckedmuch]

I meant to say Best of Breed not Best of Verity, please forgive me I'm new to showing. I do know the WOW! Factor when I see it though.

 

[griffinkid02]

Rotational Line Breeding

I wrote a article for the APA year book about twenty years ago on this subject. I had this chart produced by my wife and we lost it. We found it about six months ago on a old computer I fired up and got it in here. I have not been able to get this chart in the place of the words I used. But some folks have asked me to at least show the chart. For you who do not know about line breeding lets go to Elberta Alabama for a trip to Matt's place with our pickup trucks and two boxes. Let's say we have Ron From Arkansas and Steve from Georgia. Both are going to get birds from Matt to start a long time breeding program of the old E W Reese Mrs. Donald Donaldson line of Reds which are 100 years old this year. Ron is going to have pen one and pen two. Steve is going to have pen three and pen four.

To help illustrate how this is going to work, I have ordered leg bands and wing bands in the colors for each breeding pen for each breeder and from this day on they will mark all their chicks with the colors as they correspond to each breeding pen. I set down four nice wooden boxes I made for each breeder. On the boxes I have a nuber representing the breeding pen painted Red, White , Blue and Green. On each box I have the leg bands and the wing bands of each color and as we pick the birds we wing band them and put the colored numbered leg bands on their legs and wing area. We go out and pick a male and female from birds that Matt has breed this year. Some are pure Illinois Greg Chamness birds and some are Half Chamness and Half Brian Simmons a line that I sold a fellow in Florida 17 years ago they are still pure Mohawks but needed some fresh blood. We have the birds all in their boxes and all are banded with the colors of Red for pen one, White for pen two, Blue for Pen three and Green for pen Four.

The two fellows head home with their two pairs and at their homes they have built a pen six by six feet with a six foot run and on the door of each pen where they put their breeders they take the colored number off the shipping boxes and place on the door. Each fellow has put their leg bands and wing bands in their incubator room and also have a toe punch to punch the chicks toes as they hatch the following spring. Now its breeding season and the lights have been turned on in each house with the aid of a timer that comes on at five P.M. and goes off at nine P.M. so the birds are stimulated with a total of fifteen hours of light. The eggs are coming very well and around December they start putting the eggs in the incubator ever three days and when the eggs are hatched in a special compartment made in the bottom of their wooden incubator they toe punch the chick to the pen number that was written on the egg. At about a week of age the chick is wing banded with the correct colored band and then recorded on a three by five inch index card for permanent records. As the chicks grow up they are banded at the correct age with the adult numbered bands and observation is then made who is the best type and colored Reds for the season. From a lot of say Thirty chicks from these two pairs four males and eight females are kept for breeders for next year. They are conditioned nicely as the females are in a pen eight by eight four per pen and the males are in a four by four foot conditioning pen and trained to pose and are so gentle the judge will be amazed how docile they act in the show coop. In October there is a show in Clanton Alabama and its half way between each breeder and they enter four males and eight females in the show to look at and see who will win the best or reserve large Fowl Red in the show. Also, I the writer of this article will be coming to the show with my camera to handle each bird and photograph them and help the two fellows pick the correct birds for next year's breeding season.

Picking the breeders: After the judging has been done that mourning we set up some show coops outside the building and have eight cages off the ground on saw horses so we can see and handle the birds that we wish to keep. In the first set of cages We put the top two females from each breeding pen in the cages and mark the cages of the two females Pen one, Pen Two, Pen Three , and pen four. Once the females have been selected we have to go and find the male to breed to them for the next year. Now we have put together another set of show coops eight holes for the males across from the females. We go and pick the best two males from each breeding pen and place them in the cages. As we look at the males we see the colored leg bands of the four colors and now we have to pick the best male to mate to the best two females for this coming year. After we pick the top male we take the second best male and place him back into his show coop in the show room and write down in a log book who he is and that he is a alternate male incase by accident we lose the top male during the breeding season. Now we write down the females in the log book who will be in each breeding pen and place the females back into the show room coops. We also, place the top males four all four breeding pens back into their show coops. The breeders are picked for the 2013 breeding season but the next thing we must do is rotate the males to make this Rotational Breeding program work. First at the end of the show all the females go back in the same show coops that the owners brought from their homes to the show's The females will always go back into the pens in which their eggs came from and this will go on forever in this system. However, we must rotate the males to the right each year to make this plan work so here we go we take male number one and he will go to pen number two, male number two who came from Arkansas will go to Steve in Georgia and go into his pen number three, male number three will go into Steve's breeding pen number four. Now we will take male from Georgia number four and he will go to Arkansas to be put in pen number one. So to make this systems simple always put the females back into the pen that they came out of. The males always rotate one time to the right and if you had four breeding pens then you just rotate each male down to the right each year. If you are a two breeding pen breeder which I recommend then the second and fourth male has to be transferred each year to the other partners home at a show or you ship him the male bird overnight express at the post office. With a system like this you and your partner should be able to go about 20 years without any need to outcross from this 100 year old line. You can also go back to the original breeder such as Matt or Greg or Brian for new stock say in fifteen years and get a new male to introduce into your family of Reds.

Conclusion: Here is a simple method that I took from Turkey Farmers in Wisconsin who had 15 breeding pens and used it to breed large fowl Rhode Island Reds. It is such a simple system for beginner with out to much confusion and math needed to confuse you such as other line breeding methods. Many of those look good on paper but over the last 25 years I have not heard of one Poultry Fancier using these systems. The secret in breeding any Large Fowl is not to have to raise to many adult birds and a two breeding system to keep the cost down and so you can focus your metal energy onto the birds you have. You want to have your birds look like cloans or as Mrs. Donaldson use to say. They look like peas in a pod. You want them uniform in type and color. When you do this you will have a Strain of Rhode Island Reds that will be the envy of the world. You will have plenty of eggs, meat to eat during the year and most of all a off springs from their parents that is true to breed of the American Standard of Perfection and will win big in the show room. This method can be used on other breeds of Standard Breed Fowl. As I have been doing this on my large fowl White Plymouth Rocks for over 25 years with only one introduction of new blood from the original breeder I got my start from. The number one goal you have is in the incubator as the chicks come out. You must discipline yourself to make the correct toe punch right away as you touch the chick. Next you want a fast feathering early developed chick that has high constructional vigor. You want them to lay and crow or mature faster than the other chicks. If you raise these young birds up to where they are the very best conditioned birds you can produce you will also get on champion row with your adult birds. This is just a introduction to breeding and getting started. There are some other items that I will write about with birds that may be superior and how to take them out of the breeding cycle and still use them to produce wonderful birds. I hope with this old chart and my 2012 revised article this will help some of you who wish to be the ones to carry on our tradition of breeding Large Fowl Rhode Island Reds.

Robert Blosl Rough Draft hot off the press. May 26, 2012

Someone asked me about two months ago for my old article and chart I wrote 20 years ago on line breeding. I just found the lost article that I made in May so I will post it for who ever wanted it. You do not have to line breed your birds as a beginner. But, sooner or latter you are going to have a plan if you contiunue for the five year mark. You dont want to inbreed to much and then loose your egg laying ability and hatchability. This happen one time with the old George Underwood line and when Gary took over his dads birds he crossed production reds into his dads line to freshen things up. If this ever happens to any of you do not do this. Get a good dark Red bird from one of the the lines still left then do it. You dont need to spend ten years getting the color back to the middle of the road. Excellent pictures and that hatchery bird you posted is a good example of a cross of production and Heritage. There was a hatchery in N C that had some pretty good birds not production like but more old fashion. Good pictures keep them coming. bob

Thank you very much Robert. I have been wondering for a while now the best way to set up breeding pens this spring for my Nankins. This sounds like a really wonderful (keeping it simple for the stupid

) method. Since I have access to your breeding knowledge, I have a quick question or two. I hear on a lot of breeding threads that a good rule of thumb for the beginer is "Type from the hen, color from the roo." As well as, "It's easiest to concentrate on one feature at a time. Set a goal for a specific feature and focus your energy there until it looks like your idea of the SoP's description." Now I recognize that those are over simplifications, but as I said I see them offered as good general rules for the inexperienced to start from. What would you say about that advice?

 

[mississippifarmboy]

I haven't posted on this thread much in a while, been just too disgusted with myself. After getting my flock up to around around 40 adult reds earlier this year I started culling heavy. Got down to about 15 of the very best then had a stray dog hit my flock. As always, I was letting them free range during the day then shutting them up in the coop at night. For those who didn't know, I've been very sick the past few months and one night I just forgot to shut them up. I had several medical appointments that day, lots of tests done, then had a bad spell after I got home and just forgot to shut the coop.
Totally my fault, but I won't be selling any birds this year and maybe not next year either. I lost my best rooster and second best cockerel along with several good pullets. I still have my best cockerel though to fall back on, my best young pullets and my three older hens. Several have asked about buying a trio later this fall and sadly, I'll need to keep all I have left to rebuild my flock next year.

The part that made me mad was it was something I never do and was entirely preventable. I had planned on showing my first time later this month in Alabama, but the birds I had picked for the show I either lost or they were banged up, so my first show will be spring at the earliest.

I'm going to try Bob's rotational breeding in the spring using my four best hens and the best rooster. (Well, technically a cockerel, he won't be a year old until about March). Maybe in a few years I'll be able to learn what I'm doing...




edited to add;
I forgot to say I declared war on stray dogs around here. Like Wynette's sig says "in your yard it's a pet, in my yard it's a predator" or something to that effect.


also - Mr Bob.... I'm still waiting on a few seeds from other family members that I am light on and you'll be getting a package. I'm trying to be sure and get you a good selection. I haven't forgotten you.

 

[rodriguezpoultry]

Actually the same person took 1st 2nd &3rd place cockerel, Reserve American, and Best of Verity. I think I've got that right. He is a friend of mine B. Anderson from NC He has the Don Nelson Line.
A Rademacher of Minnesota did well with his pullets as well. I believe he took 1st 2nd and 3rd verity pullets
And there was a junior there that took home a bag full of trophies for his LF RIR's I think he got them from Mr. Anderson last year.

He should be proud! Just thought it was a good bird! I didn't really look past champion row, the Asiatics and the sale area!

 

[Robert Blosl]

That was a big win for Bobby and the Don Nelson line he beat Adrain Radamaker and that is something many dont do.

Sorry for the loss of birds from the Dogs. It happens and they always get the best ones. I have to have mine in pens with one inch wire and if I leave them out I do it a hour befor dark so I can be out with them and they will come back when its time to roost. I let a trio of white rocks out one day the first time by accident and at sun down one hen in the building the rooster wondering around in the woods caught him then I had to wait till dark to find a hen on a old gate. Never again.

The secrets on line breeding and type for female color for male seems to be a thought many use. The female I think is important for type but I always have a male that has super type as well.

In Reds I have always felt its a 50 50 deal .

One male used with three or four females in seperate pens will work just rotate him every day to the right then on the fifth day give him a rest. You should have plenty of chicks and then you can worry about next year. Getting the new Carb for the Tiller today then dirt will fly. Got seven black berry bushes three days ago and going to plant them this weekend. bob

 

[NYREDS]

I haven't posted on this thread much in a while, been just too disgusted with myself. After getting my flock up to around around 40 adult reds earlier this year I started culling heavy. Got down to about 15 of the very best then had a stray dog hit my flock. As always, I was letting them free range during the day then shutting them up in the coop at night. For those who didn't know, I've been very sick the past few months and one night I just forgot to shut them up. I had several medical appointments that day, lots of tests done, then had a bad spell after I got home and just forgot to shut the coop.
Totally my fault, but I won't be selling any birds this year and maybe not next year either. I lost my best rooster and second best cockerel along with several good pullets. I still have my best cockerel though to fall back on, my best young pullets and my three older hens. Several have asked about buying a trio later this fall and sadly, I'll need to keep all I have left to rebuild my flock next year.

The part that made me mad was it was something I never do and was entirely preventable. I had planned on showing my first time later this month in Alabama, but the birds I had picked for the show I either lost or they were banged up, so my first show will be spring at the earliest.

I'm going to try Bob's rotational breeding in the spring using my four best hens and the best rooster. (Well, technically a cockerel, he won't be a year old until about March). Maybe in a few years I'll be able to learn what I'm doing...




edited to add;
I forgot to say I declared war on stray dogs around here. Like Wynette's sig says "in your yard it's a pet, in my yard it's a predator" or something to that effect.


also - Mr Bob.... I'm still waiting on a few seeds from other family members that I am light on and you'll be getting a package. I'm trying to be sure and get you a good selection. I haven't forgotten you.

Dogs are great poultry judges: they always pick out the best ones. I've had a couple of preditor setbacks over the years & they're no fun. If I can help with some free eggs in the spring let me know.

 

[melroseladi]

So sorry for your losses. I so feel your pain. I raise and sell guineas for my livelihood and lost all of my hens to a pack of fox this year, while they were out free ranging. Although I set traps I never caught one. I kept the last of my keets to get restarted in the spring and dang if a opossum didn't break into the chain link gate of their pen and killed most of them, I was able to trap him though and he will no longer be eating anything else. I have 2 left in with my 10 week old RIRs. Refortified my pen, replaced the chainlink gate with a heavy duty wood and hardware cloth door. I am sure things will get better for me and for you as well.

I am adding you to my prayer list that your health will improve and your birds will be safe.

 

[catdaddyfro]

Dang Terry sorry about your misfortune there it sucks, really big. I have a solution that works great around here with hardly ever any losses to predators and I free range alot of course it helps that I work right here at the house and I am here just about 24/7 too. But I use dogs to keep other dogs and lots of other critters at bay here. The worst thing I have problems with are Kestrels(sparrow hawks) and of course Red-tails

a few fox attacks in the past but they got tired of being run to death by these Catahoulas(most call curdogs) and the occasional Possum will meander in and end up as one of the three's blue plate special. Yesterday I was out to the barn and I heard a ruckus start up and looked around and off took my brindle gip after it, It was a Kestrel try to come in for a sneak attack, she was on him like stink on poo-poo! He never even had a chance for a bomb dive she ran him way out into the field just a'raisin' cane and running beneath him as far she could letting him know to not get brave and try it again or else.
The ironic thing about my 2 oldest Dogs is when I first accquired them as yearling pups they were running loose on the back side of the Atchafalaya levees at Simmesport and if they ran across a herd of banties or whatever they looked just like the cartoon character (Taz)/ tasmianian devils in whirlwinds of feathers and killing chickens till they wiped out the entire flock. But once in my control/lead I STOPPED all that with great enforcement and now if one of my chickens squawks the wrong way or makes an out of the ordinary whatever they are right there to take care of business, don't nobody mess with their chickens. Anyway sorry for thread busting but you and others that want to free range might ought to check into LGDs they work and help out tremendously. OH yes I live in the woods/bay galls, deep dark sticks with LOTS of critters/varmints, not out on the edge of society where there not much activity from critters we practically live in their dens so things have to be on guard constantly.

Ok back to RIRs now LOL

Jeff