The Moonshiner's Leghorns

[sean_wonder]

Well, technically, the SOP never said anything about judging a bird by whatever egg was sitting in the cage.

Technically, yeah. But it’s still there— “This breed lays eggs with blue shell pigmentation with a medium pastel blue being the ideal.” I don’t have my copy of the SOP on hand, but that was a quote from the 2020 APA Committee. Not sure why it wouldn’t be a DQ for an “Ameraucana” to lay a brown egg.

 

[Amer]

It has been at least 10-11 years since I attended my last show, so it sounds like Marans have come up in the world. They weren’t as popular in show at the shows I went to and there were only like 4 people there showing birds.

I believe type and size is very important also, in layer and dual purpose breeds. Because in layers you want them to have a wide and deep enough pelvis to be a good representation of a layer breed. And in dual purpose breeds you want a bird of adequate size because the breast and thighs should be big enough on the carcass to make it worth while to eat them.

In breeds with specific traits, like certain egg colors, such as Marans, I feel like it is dishonest to knowingly show a bird that is not a good representation of the breed’s well known dark brown egg color. But as you mentioned, you can’t judge a rooster by egg color so only the breeder would know. I don’t plan on showing in the future, but I can see how it would be enjoyable if you had a more well-known breed that was judged accurately by their SOP.

I don’t breed Marans anymore, not because they didn’t show well but because they truly are mite magnets with all their plumage. I have never owned a breed before that I had so much trouble keeping mites off of them. I spent so much time dusting them, spraying them, and treating their perimeters that it took away from the pleasure of keeping them. I prefer tighter feathered breeds like Legbars, Leghorns, and Games which all seem to be very mite and bug resistant. It is pretty rare we find mites or bugs on any of those breeds just because their feathers are easier to keep dusted naturally by the birds.

I agree it's dishonest to show Marans with the wrong egg color. That's up to the breeder and they should take care of it.

The thing is, to me showing isn't about winning. In my opinion, people can whatever pretty things they have in the yard, they're paying for the cage. Back when the association started and they had few breeds in the Standard everyone was showing off what they had.

It seems like my d'Anvers are mite magnets too. I spray them with elector psp and it's very effective. And then, mites come back a few weeks later.

 

[KF0002]

Technically, yeah. But it’s still there— “This breed lays eggs with blue shell pigmentation with a medium pastel blue being the ideal.” I don’t have my copy of the SOP on hand, but that was a quote from the 2020 APA Committee. Not sure why it wouldn’t be a DQ for an “Ameraucana” to lay a brown egg.

I agree 100% with this. If an Ameraucana won all the ribbons in show but lays a brown egg, all you have there is a glorified Easter Egger, and not a good representation of the breed whatsoever.

 

[Amer]

Technically, yeah. But it’s still there— “This breed lays eggs with blue shell pigmentation with a medium pastel blue being the ideal.” I don’t have my copy of the SOP on hand, but that was a quote from the 2020 APA Committee. Not sure why it wouldn’t be a DQ for an “Ameraucana” to lay a brown egg.

Because we don't know how the egg got there. Unless the judge saw her lay it.
I've never ever heard of an Ameraucana breeder with brown layers, they are too obsessed with egg color...
And supposing it did lay a brown egg, I doubt it matched the standard anyway because the breeder clearly didn't care about quality. Probably looked like an EE. Definitely should have been dqed but I'm sure it didn't place well

 

[Amer]

Okay, Moony said she "won."
In which case, my theory that the egg simply got there by other means stands.

 

[sean_wonder]

Okay, Moony said she "won."
In which case, my theory that the egg simply got there by other means stands.

Hopefully. I’ve seen eggs roll between cages like that, but still. Grrr if true…

Also bit off topic, where do you get your elector psp from? It seems pretty expensive as far a I’ve seen and had great success just fluffing affected birds with DE, but being able to just spray the girls down rather than catch, fluff, release seems much easier.

 

[KF0002]

I agree it's dishonest to show Marans with the wrong egg color. That's up to the breeder and they should take care of it.

The thing is, to me showing isn't about winning. In my opinion, people can whatever pretty things they have in the yard, they're paying for the cage. Back when the association started and they had few breeds in the Standard everyone was showing off what they had.

It seems like my d'Anvers are mite magnets too. I spray them with elector psp and it's very effective. And then, mites come back a few weeks later.

I blame wild birds for the mites. They have to come from somewhere. When you buy straw for pens, wild birds are in the barns and store houses, and their mites and lice are transmitted in the straw. I like poultry dust because it seems like it leaves residual dust in the birds feathers after dusting, killing off nits as they hatch. Then you retreat again in 7 days and also treat their perimeters with permethrin spray and that usually does the trick for us.

I agree that showing isn’t about winning necessarily. You want to see birds at shows representing what the breeds should look like. And if there is a better bird there than mine who wins, thats good. It gives me goals to work toward. But if I have butchered and eaten nicer birds than what takes home BV/BB at the show, and those birds won not for their type, eye color, comb, etc and only won because they were bigger than mine, that is beyond frustrating. lol

 

[Amer]

Hopefully. I’ve seen eggs roll between cages like that, but still. Grrr if true…

Also bit off topic, where do you get your elector psp from? It seems pretty expensive as far a I’ve seen and had great success just fluffing affected birds with DE, but being able to just spray the girls down rather than catch, fluff, release seems much easier.

I hope so, because otherwise my Dominique rooster produced both eggs and sperm, and I don't want to think about the implications of that!

I've heard DE doesn't really work for infestations.
Elector psp is the most expensive because it is super effective. My birds go from heavy infestation to no mites in about 3 days.

I blame wild birds for the mites. They have to come from somewhere. When you buy straw for pens, wild birds are in the barns and store houses, and their mites and lice are transmitted in the straw. I like poultry dust because it seems like it leaves residual dust in the birds feathers after dusting, killing off nits as they hatch. Then you retreat again in 7 days and also treat their perimeters with permethrin spray and that usually does the trick for us.

I agree that showing isn’t about winning necessarily. You want to see birds at shows representing what the breeds should look like. And if there is a better bird there than mine who wins, thats good. It gives me goals to work toward. But if I have butchered and eaten nicer birds than what takes home BV/BB at the show, and those birds won not for their type, eye color, comb, etc and only won because they were bigger than mine, that is beyond frustrating. lol

That is frustrating.

 

[NagemTX]

Because we don't know how the egg got there. Unless the judge saw her lay it.
I've never ever heard of an Ameraucana breeder with brown layers, they are too obsessed with egg color...
And supposing it did lay a brown egg, I doubt it matched the standard anyway because the breeder clearly didn't care about quality. Probably looked like an EE. Definitely should have been dqed but I'm sure it didn't place well

Not right now with all the obsession over new colors of feathers.

If an EE looks Ameraucana, is the correct color and lays a blue egg it's an Ameraucana. Lol.

If it looks Ameraucana, is the correct color but lays a brown, white or cream egg it's not an Ameraucana. Just don't tell that to fad Ameraucana owners. I kinda have a beef with them and their strange ways. Some in the clubs agree. They use the term EE willy nilly and get upset if you call a project color an EE but will call your project color an EE. It's very high school over there.

 

[NagemTX]

My own thoughts on Ameraucana are as follows. If the barn is correct, the pain can breed true and the egg color is correct its an Ameraucana. That's me and a few others. I've learned more from top breeders of others breeds and the founders of the Ameraucana than from most Ameraucana enthusiasts.