The Natural Chicken Keeping thread - OTs welcome!

[aoxa]

That's one thing with using the general feed. Most people think of giving extra calcium to the layers but don't think about adding extra protein for the kiddos.

Since mine is formulated so that all can eat it I put out free-feed calcium and then give the babies extra protein too (usually in the form of meat).

Unfortunately my feed stores do not carry a flock raiser.

Starter is okay for all birds though. It's just a bit more expensive (like $1 more than grower per bag).

Oh and my girl with the feet, one of those feet is frostbitten. She is not in any pain, so I'm going to let the toes come off themselves. I've done some research on it, and I'm just not going to cull her for something I know wouldn't have happened if I didn't have open water.. and I just can't lose her. Not now.

She doesn't act like it hurts her at all now. I cut the toe nail right off and there is no blood flow. Nothing is infected, and the other foot is all healed. The blisters we saw were the start of the frost bite.

So be careful of open water.. It can be pretty dangerous in this cold weather.

 

[Leahs Mom]

Aoxa - remind me on what breed your frostbite girl is. (And I'd do the same thing too! Then if I observed problems I'd cull later on but wouldn't if she's getting along. It will be interesting to see how she does foraging once the weather allows.

 

[Leahs Mom]

We found and are preparing a branch to replace the current roost.

Anyone else want to weigh in on diameter? Can the babies stand on such a thing too?

 

[pigeonguy]

"Stop worring about worms in one poop. Yes..you see them. But they all have worms. Perhaps what you have been doing is killing them and making them leave..have you thought of that? Good job on adding space for your birds.."



Thanks Delishsa, thats what I was wondering - sin.ce I haven't ever seen worms, whether seeeing one set in poop meant I had an overload. Sounds like you are saying no. I've been really tempted to try the one tsp of kerosene in the water too! but will just leave it with the carrots and garlic. It has been a while since I routinely fed them garlic, so I will start that up again, maybe weekly.

What I am about to say is just my opinion. Everyone has there own way of doing things and this is mine.
I do agree that everything has worms but I disagree that everything has round worms. When it becomes noticeable that any critter has round worms It is time to get rid of them.
I don't remember how many birds you have so I will talk about mine. For 2 gallons of fermented feed I would add 1 can of cayenne pepper It takes a lot to get rid of them (not so much to control or prevent) I would repeat this in every 3 days doing it 4 times.
I actually use habanero peppers ground up in the blender outside did it inside once won't make that mistake again. I put in about a 1/3 of a cup each time. For prevention they get about 1/8 cup 0once every other week. None of this is 100% proven but except when the neighbor to the north got round worms in his flock (they slowed down laying and seen them on the floor) I told him to give cayenne he did for a week and said there was no improvement. I ask how much did you use (did not think I needed to specify) he said I sprinkle it on top of their food every day. I said that it was not enough and mixed up a batch of mash with water and dumped the whole can in and mixed it up. He said really that much. I said don't see where little bits are going to help and to much can't hurt. Took it out filled the feeder and they did not eat we watched for a while and nothing. I put a little dry on top closed the door and said they will eat it trust me. Called the next day ask if they ate it he said every bite . I told him to repeat in three days 3 more times he called back 2 days later and said the eggs were picking up should he still give them the cayenne I said yes lets make sure we get them all the pepper only chases out the ones that have hatched it can't get the worm eggs and it takes 7 to 10 days to make sure all have hatched. If we do this every 3 days for 12 days we have to have got them all.
Like I say everyone has their own thoughts and methods on what they would do this is just mine. One method that works does not make another method that works wrong it is just a different method.

HAVE YOU EVER SEEN A SMALL CHILD RUNNING DOWN THE HALL YELLING "HURRY, HURRY!" OH, WAIT, THAT WASN'T FOR AN EGG! (Not always a small child either!)


On whitewash, my family all were farmers, grand dad, uncles, they always had a company come in and spray their entire barns down. When I researched it back when we had mites it said painting (or I like slathering) with a large paint brush was much more effective. I cannot get rid of the mites. As soon as the NY weather lets me (prob May) that is what I intend on doing. As I remember it was so very thick. I didn't get a lot of interaction on that other thread maybe it's not considered natural but I don't like the naturalness of dead birds or itchy arms either. Sue

White wash only gets the ones not on the birds. They still need to be dusted with ash or DE and then have a dusting area with one of the 2 in it.

Update on my bumblefoot girl...
Still working on things but the swelling in the worst foot has reduced quite a bit. I kept her isolated on a separate floor with totally clean pine shavings Wed, Thurs, & Friday. (Boy...was she fit to be tied!) Yesterday evening I went out to take food and she had worked at it enough that she was able to get out of the little pen and was sitting on top of the people door to the nest box. Still isolated on a clean surface however! It was pretty funny seeing here hunkered down on there. I brought her in to work on her foot then put her back in the little pen overnight.

This morning I replaced about half of the litter in there with new pine shavings and let her back in with the others. I just wanted her feet to stay as clean as possible without getting a lot of old shavings and/or poop inside the bandages.

I also did something else. I took down the ramp board (with the cross wise step things) that they use to walk up and down into the coop.

From the time we've put that up, it looked to me like they had trouble sliding on that thing - especially coming down from inside. I have wondered for months if they were possibly hurting their feet on it - or possibly getting slivers, etc. Even the babies were sliding on it so I don't think it was related to weight and size.

So.... I took it down and replaced it with "log steps".

Had some old "junk logs" that were going to go on the bonfire pile so I had a lot to choose from. I had already made one for the babies to go down to the left of the ramp. So I just removed the ramp and put up another set of logs where it was.

I watched them using these this morning and they just walk right down with no ado. (of course the babies hop from log to log, but the adults can stride right down or up them). Looks much easier on the feet.

Love this it looks so natural.

I have a ? about how much vinegar to put in .. the FF. when you add to the existing.. i there an estimate / gal..
I'm only doing a small amount.. right now and I've been adding about a cap ful per cup of water.. Is that enough?

#2? Making Vinegar from scratch.
I'm wondering about starting a vinegar from scratch.. does any one here do that.? and have you used other fruit?

I had some "fancy " fruit from Xmas that 2 pears got soft.. and all i could remember was cover with sugar water. and let set .. and now i can t find my directions..
I'll thank you in advance.. for your input here..

I hate to ask a ? and run.. I'm vacationing with my nephews and Nana.. next week so.. if i disappear.. i will be back..
Thanks...

Thanks.. for the welcome and directions.. Its good to be here..
I.. was trying to make it more difficult than it needed to be.. Hugh!
and just by adding the Braggs to the apple juice will turn. ok.. great..
I'll see if i can get some going.. I'm really liking learning about all kinds of fermenting. I making my own ACV .. .. i bet if i make it.. I'll use more.

Does the age? of the vinegar matter? .. I have an older bottle.. i could use. I'm just about out of the one i was using to start the FF

Thanks every one.. for the help.. <wow that was fast..>
Debra

Like I said above every ones methods are different. I only use one bucket and add a shot of UP/ACV every couple of weeks if I think it needs it. I do have 2 separate buckets I keep going all the time. I feed about 2 or 2 and a 1/2 gallons a day and when I feed I put between a 1/2 shot and a shot UP/ACV in the bucket I scooped the feed into to feed every day. I also add a table spoon of garlic and some oregano never measured the oregano about 1/8 to 1/4 of the jar I get at Aldi's twice a week.

1 Table spoon UP/ACV per gallon of water or fermented feed per day.
Break it down from there.
1 T = 1 Gallon
1/2 T = 1/2 gallon
1/4 T = 1 quart
1/6 T = 1 pint
1/32 T = 1 cup
That is in what is added to water or FF and fed right away not in the main ferment bucket.
In the main ferment container to get it started I would still suggest 1 shot glass per gallon. After that you really don't need to ever put any more but if your like me and it makes you feel better to do so just put little amounts. I would not do so every day though as I would think eventually it would get to strong.
Bottom line is do whatever you think will work it is pretty hard to screw up to a point they won't eat it and along the way you will say hey they seemed to like it better when I did this and then you will go back and do that.

Hope all this ramble made sense.

 

[aoxa]

Aoxa - remind me on what breed your frostbite girl is. (And I'd do the same thing too! Then if I observed problems I'd cull later on but wouldn't if she's getting along. It will be interesting to see how she does foraging once the weather allows.

She is a bantam Ameraucana. She will lose 2 toes for sure, and maybe a third. I have seen some really bad stories of frost bite and how the birds survived no problem. She will be able to walk, as the sole of her foot is fine.

She is very affectionate to people. She loves to sit on our lap. Getting used to it from the constant coconut oil we are applying (she likes to eat it too!).

The toes are completely black and leathery and very stiff. Definitely frost bite. Poor girl. I've had blind hens that I wouldn't cull.

I can't imagine her being any worse at foraging than a silkie.

 

[stonykill]

As I am dealing with bumble foot issues...

I keep reading everywhere that flat roosts (as in 2x4 or 1x4), even with curved edges, can cause foot injuries.

I'm sure that many - if not all - of us were told to use a 2x4 with the 4" side flat for them to roost on. I know plenty of people that are using those successfully with no problem so I'm not totally convinced that flat roost boards are a problem at all.

That being said - I also know that many folks use branches from outdoors for roosts.

The Question:

If you are using branches, what size diameter works best?
Give me some "branch roost testimonies"

I use the wide size 2x4. Now the birds who choose to roost in tree's

choose large branches. 4 to 5 inches in diameter. Knock on wood in the 9 years I've had chickens I have not once yet had to deal with bumblefoot. I have a very knowlegable chicken keeper friend with an average of 300 birds a year who has a flock like mine. Some on 2x4 roosts and some in tree's onlarge branches. He rarely has bumblefoot so there must be something to it

 

[Leahs Mom]

Pigeon (Dr

)...

Do you use powdered or flake cayenne?

 

[stonykill]

Update on my bumblefoot girl...
Still working on things but the swelling in the worst foot has reduced quite a bit. I kept her isolated on a separate floor with totally clean pine shavings Wed, Thurs, & Friday. (Boy...was she fit to be tied!) Yesterday evening I went out to take food and she had worked at it enough that she was able to get out of the little pen and was sitting on top of the people door to the nest box. Still isolated on a clean surface however! It was pretty funny seeing here hunkered down on there. I brought her in to work on her foot then put her back in the little pen overnight.

This morning I replaced about half of the litter in there with new pine shavings and let her back in with the others. I just wanted her feet to stay as clean as possible without getting a lot of old shavings and/or poop inside the bandages.

I also did something else. I took down the ramp board (with the cross wise step things) that they use to walk up and down into the coop.

From the time we've put that up, it looked to me like they had trouble sliding on that thing - especially coming down from inside. I have wondered for months if they were possibly hurting their feet on it - or possibly getting slivers, etc. Even the babies were sliding on it so I don't think it was related to weight and size.

So.... I took it down and replaced it with "log steps".

Had some old "junk logs" that were going to go on the bonfire pile so I had a lot to choose from. I had already made one for the babies to go down to the left of the ramp. So I just removed the ramp and put up another set of logs where it was.

I watched them using these this morning and they just walk right down with no ado. (of course the babies hop from log to log, but the adults can stride right down or up them). Looks much easier on the feet.

I only use ramps when the babies are too small to fly or jump in. I have noticed the same thing. In the morning on the crazy run out the door with dew on the ramp, or worse on the ramp they slide. I was afraid of leg injuries, so I only use a ramp on an "as needed" basis. I like the log steps!

 

[Pullet Surprise]

Quote: I know that to cull is one of those things that is a fact of life. But I sometimes wonder if it is always necessary, of course if the bird is in pain...But my mother had a 'pet' hen (she had pet everythings, always bringing home stray, wounded this and that, drove my grandparents nuts at times) that had a very gimpy leg. I asked my mom about Pippy not long ago and she reminded me that that gimpy chicken was the best layer my grandmother ever had (RIR). My grandfather had been ready to put it down, but my mother was so insistent on caring for it etc.Now, I sure would not want a whole flock of special needs chickens, but if you have the time and where-with-all to care for one, and if it isn't in pain, then why not, might just turn out to be another Pippy. During the Depression, every egg was important.

 

[countrygirl74]

I know that to cull is one of those things that is a fact of life. But I sometimes wonder if it is always necessary, of course if the bird is in pain...But my mother had a 'pet' hen (she had pet everythings, always bringing home stray, wounded this and that, drove my grandparents nuts at times) that had a very gimpy leg. I asked my mom about Pippy not long ago and she reminded me that that gimpy chicken was the best layer my grandmother ever had (RIR). My grandfather had been ready to put it down, but my mother was so insistent on caring for it etc.Now, I sure would not want a whole flock of special needs chickens, but if you have the time and where-with-all to care for one, and if it isn't in pain, then why not, might just turn out to be another Pippy. During the Depression, every egg was important.