The Natural Chicken Keeping thread - OTs welcome!

I have a few questions.

The first was in my original post last week, but I asked a LOT of questions so it got lost in the shuffle... it was about whether or not to cull hens who get bare backs. I only have 2 roosters with my 30+ hens, and I have more than I care to admit who have bare backs. Do I need to cull all of them? And I need a WHY if the answer is yes, thanks:)

Also, in reading the last several pages of posts, I see a lot of people are amending their FF with herbs and garlic and stuff. While strangely I had thought about adding some chickweed or some other herb a few days ago, I didn't look more into it and didn't realize it was something people were doing regularly. What do you add (other than feed/grains) to your FF, and is there a list of things to add and their reasoning?

And lastly, I have some questions about natural care for turkeys. I've asked over at the turkey forum, but I'm getting some very NOT natural answers and my gut is saying NOOOOOO!

1) I haven't found any info on FF for turkeys, but I transitioned them when I transitioned the broilers yesterday. They were a lot harder to get started- the broilers figured out it was food in just a few hours, but with the turkey poults I kept having to sprinkle crumbles on top of the FF... then they'd pick all the crumbles off and ignore the FF. FINALLY after a whole day of this they got it and are absolutely wolfing down the FF, so that's good! I'm hoping all the little buggies (as my kids and I call them) in both the FF and the raw ACV in their water will help innoculate them against all the awful diseases they're prone to... Anyone have experience FF turkeys? Or ducks, because I'm also thinking about getting ducks later this spring...

2) Everyone on the turkey forum says they keep their Turkey poults 100% inside until they are 8 weeks old. 1) I just can't, the only way it would even be plausible would be if I set up a makeshift pen in the shed, and there is no way in h*#% you can convince me that is healthier than being outside, since the shed is dark and musty and dusty. And the vaccines... lots of turkey people give their birds the fowl pox vaccine at 8 weeks (before they can get outside...). Is that like 100% necessary or my birds WILL die? My plan, unless someone can present me with a convincing argument otherwise, is to move them outside around 3 weeks (with a heat lamp still if it's super cold outside, as it well could be, although they're pretty darn feathered out already, and if they're fully feathered by then they don't need heat, right?) to the smaller of my two tractors. They will tractor/free range with my chickens, and when the broilers head off the the processor I'll move the turkeys to the bigger tractor for the duration of their time on this earth. If they contract blackhead/fowl pox and die then, well, I guess I've learned my lesson and I won't try turkeys again. But from what I can tell it's not a huge issue in my area, and my chickens, to the best of my limited knowledge, have never shown any symptoms. Anyway... to that end I'll take any natural tips I can get! For what it's worth, other than not taking to the FF right away my poults have done awesome (knocking on wood) this first week, but my friend split the order with me and one of hers is having issues. Surprisingly she seems to have managed to save it (when she texted me Saturday night... of course during the new Doctor Who episode... she was sure he was near death, but she gave it some scrambled egg and some infant vites and it seems to have recovered... she's not the most thorough person, it may have just not been eating before that, I don't know if she realized that was a possibility with poults). Anyway... Thanks in advance for any info! I love this thread!
I always get blasted right off the computer whenever I comment on this but I've always raised my turkeys right along with my chickens. BUT, I did call my county agriculture department and talked with them about diseases locally to poultry. Blackhead is not common in my area. That is not saying that it couldn't be today. I've never had any problems so far. Just this morning I was thinking about putting mine out. They range from 3 - 8 weeks. The younger ones still have a light and I would move it with them. A dozen poults in the bathroom is too much. I really need to sell them but since they require a little more care, I guess I was waiting until they were 2 mo to give them a chance elsewhere. I sprinkle cayenne pepper on top of their food several days a week and feed them a Chick Starter and Flock Raiser along with a handful of scratch now and then mostly, now fermented. They love scrambled eggs. Chuck and Rosie both LOVE yogurt. They are over a year old and Rosie is somewhat aggressive to the chickens. If Blackhead is known in your area, I'd give them a fighting chance by keeping them off the ground as long as possible. I really don't know much about fowl pox. It's a lot of work to not take a few precautions for a couple more weeks. I'd be devastated if mine died and I'm not affectionate to any of my birds.
 
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I might have a sick hen.....noticed today that one of my hens wattles are HUGE. Her wattles look like my roos. I know its a hen....been laying for months. And ive noticed that one of my ees eggs has blood on it.

Neither are acting off ...neither look injured. They eat /drink /poop just fine. I'm going to try and seperate my roos with certain hens tomorrow. My roos for whatever reason dnt get along anymore. So could the stress from the roos be causing this. When i say blood on egg, its a good smear. Ive looked at butts...dnt see any dried blood....

Sooooo whatcha think
I think the blood is normal, and as for the wattles..

Is it any bigger than this hen:



This is a friend's hen. I always admired her wattles. I know this girl must have leghorn in her blood. Hatchery BR. Still I just love those wattles. Makes me want to touch them. hehe
I always get blasted right off the computer whenever I comment on this but I've always raised my turkeys right along with my chickens. BUT, I did call my county agriculture department and talked with them about diseases locally to poultry. Blackhead is not common in my area. That is not saying that it couldn't be today. I've never had any problems so far. Just this morning I was thinking about putting mine out. They range from 3 - 8 weeks. The younger ones still have a light and I would move it with them. A dozen poults in the bathroom is too much. I really need to sell them but since they require a little more care, I guess I was waiting until they were 2 mo to give them a chance elsewhere. I sprinkle cayenne pepper on top of their food several days a week and feed them Flock Raiser along with a handful of scratch now and then. Chuck and Rosie both LOVE yogurt. They are over a year old and Rosie is somewhat aggressive to the chickens. If Blackhead is known in your area, I'd give them a fighting chance by keeping them off the ground as long as possible. I really don't know much about fowl pox. It's a lot of work to not take a few precautions for a couple more weeks. I'd be devastated if mine died and I'm not affectionate to any of my birds.
I don't think you are doing anything wrong raising them together. I know many, many people who raise turkeys with chickens. If BH is not prominent in your community, than what's wrong with what you are doing?
 
I have a few questions.

The first was in my original post last week, but I asked a LOT of questions so it got lost in the shuffle... it was about whether or not to cull hens who get bare backs.  I only have 2 roosters with my 30+ hens, and I have more than I care to admit who have bare backs.  Do I need to cull all of them?  And I need a WHY if the answer is yes, thanks:)

Also, in reading the last several pages of posts, I see a lot of people are amending their FF with herbs and garlic and stuff.  While strangely I had thought about adding some chickweed or some other herb a few days ago, I didn't look more into it and didn't realize it was something people were doing regularly.  What do you add (other than feed/grains) to your FF, and is there a list of things to add and their reasoning?

And lastly, I have some questions about natural care for turkeys.  I've asked over at the turkey forum, but I'm getting some very NOT natural answers and my gut is saying NOOOOOO! 

1) I haven't found any info on FF for turkeys, but I transitioned them when I transitioned the broilers yesterday.  They were a lot harder to get started- the broilers figured out it was food in just a few hours, but with the turkey poults I kept having to sprinkle crumbles on top of the FF... then they'd pick all the crumbles off and ignore the FF.  FINALLY after a whole day of this they got it and are absolutely wolfing down the FF, so that's good!  I'm hoping all the little buggies (as my kids and I call them) in both the FF and the raw ACV in their water will help innoculate them against all the awful diseases they're prone to...  Anyone have experience FF turkeys?  Or ducks, because I'm also thinking about getting ducks later this spring...

2)  Everyone on the turkey forum says they keep their Turkey poults 100% inside until they are 8 weeks old.  1) I just can't, the only way it would even be plausible would be if I set up a makeshift pen in the shed, and there is no way in h*#% you can convince me that is healthier than being outside, since the shed is dark and musty and dusty.  And the vaccines... lots of turkey people give their birds the fowl pox vaccine at 8 weeks (before they can get outside...).  Is that like 100% necessary or my birds WILL die?  My plan, unless someone can present me with a convincing argument otherwise, is to move them outside around 3 weeks (with a heat lamp still if it's super cold outside, as it well could be, although they're pretty darn feathered out already, and if they're fully feathered by then they don't need heat, right?) to the smaller of my two tractors.  They will tractor/free range with my chickens, and when the broilers head off the the processor I'll move the turkeys to the bigger tractor for the duration of their time on this earth.  If they contract blackhead/fowl pox and die then, well, I guess I've learned my lesson and I won't try turkeys again.  But from what I can tell it's not a huge issue in my area, and my chickens, to the best of my limited knowledge, have never shown any symptoms.  Anyway... to that end I'll take any natural tips I can get!  For what it's worth, other than not taking to the FF right away my poults have done awesome (knocking on wood) this first week, but my friend split the order with me and one of hers is having issues.  Surprisingly she seems to have managed to save it (when she texted me Saturday night... of course during the new Doctor Who episode... she was sure he was near death, but she gave it some scrambled egg and some infant vites and it seems to have recovered... she's not the most thorough person, it may have just not been eating before that, I don't know if she realized that was a possibility with poults).  Anyway... Thanks in advance for any info!  I love this thread!

I no nothing about turkey's. I wouldn't cull because a bare back mainly indicates mating possibly fighting. Watch roo to pullet ratio, their skin (treat any cuts), keep an I eye them. FF I add a variety of things depending on whats available (soaked lentils, spelt berries, food scraps, flax, grit)
 
I think the blood is normal, and as for the wattles..

Is it any bigger than this hen:



This is a friend's hen. I always admired her wattles. I know this girl must have leghorn in her blood. Hatchery BR. Still I just love those wattles. Makes me want to touch them. hehe
I don't think you are doing anything wrong raising them together. I know many, many people who raise turkeys with chickens. If BH is not prominent in your community, than what's wrong with what you are doing?
well aoxa her's are about that big, but look at lot more swollen. my hen is a glw and she hasn't had wattles like that before. they all have been laying well since last summer. they are all now hitting the 1 yr mark. Maybe she just matured all the way..but she wasn't like that night before last-my daughter and I always sit out back with the birds and let them free range till dark. at first glance I just thought it was one of my roosters then when it dawned on my no that's bella~i was like woa wattle city!!!! I have leghorns-hens and they do have huge wattles-huge and red. but her's just don't look normal...I will try to get a picture of her-she's kinda of a spaz.

when I saw her it scared me at first...I don't see she is bothered by them...she is very active-acting very normal. they all look pretty scraggly right now because of the roosters...I'm going to try to separate them today but it's supposed to storm. if I can't get a pic and I will try to find a reference picture..

thanks!!!!!!!!!!
 
well aoxa her's are about that big, but look at lot more swollen. my hen is a glw and she hasn't had wattles like that before. they all have been laying well since last summer. they are all now hitting the 1 yr mark. Maybe she just matured all the way..but she wasn't like that night before last-my daughter and I always sit out back with the birds and let them free range till dark. at first glance I just thought it was one of my roosters then when it dawned on my no that's bella~i was like woa wattle city!!!! I have leghorns-hens and they do have huge wattles-huge and red. but her's just don't look normal...I will try to get a picture of her-she's kinda of a spaz.

when I saw her it scared me at first...I don't see she is bothered by them...she is very active-acting very normal. they all look pretty scraggly right now because of the roosters...I'm going to try to separate them today but it's supposed to storm. if I can't get a pic and I will try to find a reference picture..

thanks!!!!!!!!!!
Hmm I didn't see you say swollen. Yeah I'd like to see pictures.
 
I'm not sure if anyone else commented on this, usually I read to the end and then comment but then forget. At this time I can't mix my own due to not being able to afford it. I'd have to buy each in such large quantities. Thankfully mine like to forage also. I let them out of their own fencing but try to keep them in the big dog fence when I'm not at home. They tried to decimate my strawberry bed last week end. There are all kinds of goodies behind the house but before the creek.

I totally understand... I have stressed about feed. Over the winter I could barely afford to feed my chickens conventional feed, let alone organic, which is twice as expensive (lesson learned- I'm overwintering a lot fewer chickens next year). There is a feed mill in MN that sells organic and transitional (which would be GMO free) feed that is really reasonable, BUT it's a 6 hour round trip, and the delivery fee makes it more expensive than the stuff I can get locally. And mixing my own was explored, but it's a lot more work even just locating all the ingredients. Luckily a friend of mine runs an organic CSA and raises organic meat chickens, so she has connections and let me know that a nearby feed mill sells GMO free feed that is less expensive than organic, and now that it's spring (well, kind of...) the will be eating less feed, so it's do-able. Of course, then I'll also have to add in the broiler and Turkey feed... I think that alone has talked me out of getting ducks this year- I don't need one more kind of feed to buy!

Thanks for all the Turkey advice- I was actually going to raise my turkeys right in with my chickens, but the big poults kept walking all over the broilers and I took pity. My brooder (which is like 7.5 x 2.5) is meant to be divided as needed, so I just threw the divider up... that was a week ago, and the turkey poults still haven't figured out that they can't walk through the divider. But there is by no means any bio-seperation- there's simply a piece of hardware cloth in between the two batches. And when they're bigger they will free range together with my layers. I'm really glad to hear others are out there who are doing the same things my gut is telling me to do. I think that what I'm going to do is this- I'll move the broilers outside at two weeks (with a heat lamp still), giving the poults the entire brooder and leave them in there for a few more weeks. Then I'll move them out around 3-4 weeks, or when they're too tall for the brooder (it's only 18 inches deep). I'm actually feeding all of the meat birds regular game bird feed. I can't find ANY organic or GMO free chick starter, broiler feed, OR game bird feed, and I've decided that's okay and I'm not going to stress about it... I'm feeding them all fermented game bird feed, then in a few weeks I'll switch to fermented unmedicated broiler feed for everyone. Good to hear about the cayenne pepper and other additions... I have plenty of herbs laying around that I can supplement with (I'm a bit of an amateur herbalist!).

And I'm really glad to hear there's no compelling reason to cull for bare backs... that would eliminate nearly half of my hens! I don't know why it's so bad- I have more than 15 hens per rooster, and at the moment one of the roosters isn't even in with the hens, he's seperated because he was fighting with the other rooster and became injured.
 
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this is not my hen but this is what her wattles look like...both of them...
 
On the bare back issue. I just re-homed my huge rooster because he was rubbing my 7 girls raw, even with saddles(he outweighed my biggest hen by 6lbs). So now he is in a large flock and has some bigger girls too. Now I will be shocked if the bantam cockerel rubs the girls raw, since he will be half their size.
 
Quote: There's a few on here, I'd love to examine their "wattles".....

Pigeon Toe, I know what you're saying about catching vs. fishing.... It is why I enter fishing tournaments... They don't seem to know the difference, so I let them donate to my catching.

That fish is 72lbs 8 oz's.... not to be exact.....

Rod and reel, Hook and line, 8:30pm March 6th 2006, 14 feet of water, water temp 52.6 degrees. Bait, cut Shad. Rod, Black and Blue Custom, Line, 40lb Monofilament, Hook 8/0 Gamakatsu Offset Octopus Circle, James River, Chester Va.

I have handfished for Flathead actually have a video of it somewhere but I cannot post it here.... I was in purple boxers and there is some quite delightful, yet colorful, almost sailorish language in there....

Thought for the day: There is an old saying that I am fond of. "I wish I knew then, what I know now". It hit me this morning. I was given a new chance yesterday. I know now and then is the new now. So knowing now, what I know now, I ought to be able to get there, like I did then, faster and easier. Life is good!
 
Thought for the day: There is an old saying that I am fond of. "I wish I knew then, what I know now". It hit me this morning. I was given a new chance yesterday. I know now and then is the new now. So knowing now, what I know now, I ought to be able to get there, like I did then, faster and easier. Life is good!

I am also fond of that saying. Hope your new endeavors work well for you !
 

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