The Natural Chicken Keeping thread - OTs welcome!

[RedRidge]

...

But Maremma are like potato chips, you can't have just one. Besides... they really work best in pairs... they establish their own coordinated work patterns and behaviors. It's really fascinating to watch. And more importantly, as they learn to work as a team, they also learn to trust each other and know when the other has their back. That is not only important when predators are present, but when sleep is required. When working as a pair they get much better quality, much more sound sleep because they know their partner is on duty.

Now, would I have to train (or have them trained) them to work together or do they do all this herding, not eating your livestock, and working together stuff by instinct? I have several herding dogs. .. Belgian tervuren and border collies. Italian Maremma are a "livestock Guardian dog" - that is very different from a "herding dog". My herding dogs work "with me" as my partner when I need to work, move or sort sheep. They live in the house with me when not working. The Maremma live with the livestock 24/7... they have never been to my house. They guard the poultry and sheep. While they do almost everything based on instinct, it is easy to ruin one from being a good lgd if you try to make it a pet. While they don't require a lot of training, they do require a little monitoring and guidance during their teenage months. Mostly it's the new lgd owners that require training... That's why finding a breeder who is willing to be a long term mentor is just as important as finding quality instinct. My 5 month old puppy is working with an adult and is already backing her up, extremely bonded to the stock, and alternating sleep time. It's all instinct. He is so tightly bonded to his sheep that in the 10 acre Winter pasture he is never more than 20' from them. When he opened his eyes at 10 days old the first living thing he saw other than his mom and siblings was chickens and sheep. This is important. When I see lgd pups advertised and their picture is taken obviously in someone's living room, I cringe and run the other way. I don't need a dog bonded to me... I need one who is in love with chickens and sheep to the point where they will give their life protecting them.

 

[armorfirelady]

[

My only concern as I look at is is how heavy it will be to move.  But I think you are saying that the herb boxes will just sit on top of the stair framework...  If I'm getting that right maybe you could use several shorter boxes so that they aren't so heavy??

And...take lots of photos!  You'll have to post this on the DIY thread too

Well I will make it in the basement then take it apart and put it back together outside. The ion/tiger wood is actually really light. The heaviest thing is the stair raisers and the 2x4 frames. But the frame has to be sturdy with all that dirt it needs to support. Plus in winter it's going to have to hold up to the snow.......but once I put it up against the coop I don't plan on moving it again except to put hay bales around the coop next fall.

And you know me I always take pictures


Red ridge I would love to visit , bring a chair & just watch your dogs in action.

 

[aoxa]

Hello!
I don't have the info you are looking for but I'd be interested to see if Aoxa has any info.

My personal thought (based on some extensive reading on issues of the immune system and various thoughts on the subject of building a strong immune system) ...on chickens eating worms, bugs, etc., is that it is something that they would do in their natural environment.

Bugs, birds, animals and their droppings, and all kinds of other various things in the environment can always have the possibility of carrying various diseases. However, if the chickens are healthy with a strong immune system they are designed to come into contact with all those things and thrive. It's when they are weakened by unnatural feed, over-crowding, indiscriminate, regular use of medications, various immunizations, wormers, constant "sanitation" of the environment, etc., that they become weakened and are unable to fight off the things that they'd be exposed to in nature on a regular basis.

This is one of those things that we are "re-learning" in human medicine. When children are exposed to the environment, allowed to get dirty, come in contact with germs, etc., it appears that they have a stronger immune system and are able to more easily deal with various illnesses. Those that have been "kept clean", not allowed to play, have to wash with antibacterial soap every time they come into contact with a little dirt or a piece of raw meat or....etc.... they are now realizing don't have the same kind of opportunities to strengthen their immune systems in quite the same way. Add the constant use of antibiotics - which has led to MRSA and other resistant strains, and we have a real problem on our hands.

Anyhow....
I firmly believe that we - and our animals - were created to thrive in a "natural environment". Part of that would be running out in the dirt and grass, eating worms, grasshoppers, plants and whatever else they can find. And in the process building strong immune systems. So I try my best to "mimic" as best as possible what they'd do if they were free.

Too bad I couldn't let them migrate further south this winter

(Okay...off the

)




Edited to add: I used the term "poor" or "unnatural" feed which in my thinking is any feed that is primarily plant based and includes soy and other legumes. So at some level all of our birds are compromised in the feed area unless we make a definite effort to balance it with animal/insect protein and lower the percentage of grain/legume type feeds. This, of course, is helped tremendously by their being allowed to range and eat a more natural diet including insects and plants they choose in the warm months at least. And that's why I mentioned letting them migrate south...because I have a hunch they would have started following the food to warmer climates a long time ago!!!

I fully agree with you Sue. Nothing more to add, and Blackhead is much more common in some areas than others. I asked my provincial ag vet and he said they haven't had a case of blackhead in years in our area. I had my turkeys in with my chickens without any disease issue.

I've actually heard that Turkeys can give chickens immunity to Mereks.. So yeah.. That's a plus.

 

[RedRidge]

Armorfirelady, would love to have you. You are welcome any time.

 

[armorfirelady]

Armorfirelady, would love to have you. You are welcome any time.

 

[lazy gardener]

I put dry leaves in the run in the fall, dump kitchen scraps on it every day, and put more (saved) bags of leaves on top when it snows, to encourage the chickens to go out anyway.

Does that sound good? Or is there something better I could be doing in their run?

Sounds like chicken heaven.

ok... here's an off the wall question that has nothing to do with chickens (except they eat the left overs...)

I've got a nice pork roast, wanting to do a potroast with it, but not sure what seasonings to use... the last beef roast I did I used salt, pepper, bay leaf & a garlic blend seasoning, beef base and then added some cloves of crushed garlic, onion potatoes carrots and celery and cooked it for about 12 hours on low...

for the pork roast, would I do the same thing you think? or would I use different seasonings?

I mix the dry seasonings and use it like a rub on the meat before braising, then add water to clean the pan and add the rest of the ingredients... that last roast was probably the best I've ever made, I just don't want to screw up the pork one. LOL

I'm a huge fan of rosemary for pork and beef. Your plan sounds yummy. We'll all be right over.

 

[Leahs Mom]

Quote: Oooh Ooooh Oooooh

Can we ALL come?

 

[Scott H]

Your emoticons are amazing...are you kidding me!

 

[ki4got]

Quote:
LOL you're welcome to come down, but you'd have to brave the blizzard we're supposed to get tomorrow... then you'd have to probably walk up my driveway since it's already nearly impassable. LOL

 

[lalaland]

LOL you're welcome to come down, but you'd have to brave the blizzard we're supposed to get tomorrow... then you'd have to probably walk up my driveway since it's already nearly impassable. LOL

um, hope you don't mind but I'm coming too! and don't worry, I have both snowshoes and ice treads.

all kidding aside, how nice to be snowed in with the pork roast cooking away! stay warm and safe.
My nephew lives in Atlanta and yesterday was sent home from work in the morning in anticiaption of the ice storms. He sent me photos of the grocery store he stopped at on the way home - totally empty shelves - no milk, no bread, nothing perishable left (except tons of oranges for some reason).