The Plymouth Rock Breeders thread

[desertmarcy]

I just posted this ad for Good Shepard line Barred Rock chicks

www.backyardchickens.com/t874554/good-shepard-barred-plymouth-rock-chicks

 

[desertmarcy]

I just candled another batch of GSBR eggs from the pen I was waiting on, to see when they were infertile so I can introduce my new Stukel cockerel. Yes, they are, yeah! Here's the new guy, he's going in with 4 hens today:

 

[desertmarcy]

OK all you Barred Rock fans, I have a dilemma. Remember I posted a month or so ago about getting a new cockerel from Jamie Duckworth? Spent a fortune getting that bird shipped across country. This male has never given me any problem. Maybe he recognizes I am the person who took him out of the box, kept him in the garage for a few days with food and water until he was over his jet lag or whatever...but he did not like my partner and would jump up at him. He has been helping me with the birds, getting greens from the garden every day and distributing them to the pens. He is a slight, not imposing person! He did not feel comfortable catching and pinning the bird down to tell him who was boss, so he'd just keep him at bay with a bucket or something.

OK, fast forward to now. We have a new caretaker living here helping us. It has been 1-1/2 years since the last caretaker, we like this woman and want her happy so she stays! This cockerel has taken to challenging her, too, and now has been jumping up at her and this morning, he drew blood. Now I have never seen any of this activity, because any time I am out there with either her or my partner, he behaves himself. Our caretaker is willing to try a lot of things, so I told her the best method was catching him and pinning him down to the ground and then holding him there until he stopped struggling, then add 30 seconds. She did that. But she told me she wasn't sure just how forceful she could be with him and not hurt him. A friend of hers told her to be preemptive and go in the pen and grab him and hold him down BEFORE he had a chance to do anything. Well this morning, she was intent to do that, but didn't have a chance because he flew at her and drew blood as soon as she opened the door. So she grabbed him and this time held him down for a full 10 minutes. She said she didn't hold him down hard, just enough to keep him there, but now he is limping and favoring (holding up) his right leg! So apparently she did hurt him. She thought maybe he just had "pins and needles" sort of thing from being held in a certain position for too long, but it has been 1/2 a day and he is still limping.

WHAT should I do with this bird?? I did say to her, maybe I should just take care of that pen, but that doesn't help if we go away and she is here by herself. Again, I have no problem with him, I have bent over and picked an egg up off the ground near him, turned my back on him...no aggression. None of us are wearing bright, aggression-causing colors like red. The other two have almost black hair and mine is brown...but otherwise, we are all around the 5'4" to 5'6" range and slender. It won't be more than a month before I take him out of the breeding pen and put him by himself. Not sure if he will be better or worse with them in a small 4'x4' pen, if he will try to fly out at them or not. Normally I would not keep an aggressive male, but this one seems to be selective. And costly.

 

[Fentress]

OK all you Barred Rock fans, I have a dilemma. Remember I posted a month or so ago about getting a new cockerel from Jamie Duckworth? Spent a fortune getting that bird shipped across country. This male has never given me any problem. Maybe he recognizes I am the person who took him out of the box, kept him in the garage for a few days with food and water until he was over his jet lag or whatever...but he did not like my partner and would jump up at him. He has been helping me with the birds, getting greens from the garden every day and distributing them to the pens. He is a slight, not imposing person! He did not feel comfortable catching and pinning the bird down to tell him who was boss, so he'd just keep him at bay with a bucket or something.

OK, fast forward to now. We have a new caretaker living here helping us. It has been 1-1/2 years since the last caretaker, we like this woman and want her happy so she stays! This cockerel has taken to challenging her, too, and now has been jumping up at her and this morning, he drew blood. Now I have never seen any of this activity, because any time I am out there with either her or my partner, he behaves himself. Our caretaker is willing to try a lot of things, so I told her the best method was catching him and pinning him down to the ground and then holding him there until he stopped struggling, then add 30 seconds. She did that. But she told me she wasn't sure just how forceful she could be with him and not hurt him. A friend of hers told her to be preemptive and go in the pen and grab him and hold him down BEFORE he had a chance to do anything. Well this morning, she was intent to do that, but didn't have a chance because he flew at her and drew blood as soon as she opened the door. So she grabbed him and this time held him down for a full 10 minutes. She said she didn't hold him down hard, just enough to keep him there, but now he is limping and favoring (holding up) his right leg! So apparently she did hurt him. She thought maybe he just had "pins and needles" sort of thing from being held in a certain position for too long, but it has been 1/2 a day and he is still limping.

WHAT should I do with this bird?? I did say to her, maybe I should just take care of that pen, but that doesn't help if we go away and she is here by herself. Again, I have no problem with him, I have bent over and picked an egg up off the ground near him, turned my back on him...no aggression. None of us are wearing bright, aggression-causing colors like red. The other two have almost black hair and mine is brown...but otherwise, we are all around the 5'4" to 5'6" range and slender. It won't be more than a month before I take him out of the breeding pen and put him by himself. Not sure if he will be better or worse with them in a small 4'x4' pen, if he will try to fly out at them or not. Normally I would not keep an aggressive male, but this one seems to be selective. And costly.

No!No! I just got eggs from Jamie Duckworth. Could his line be people aggressive? I have been so use to people saying that standard bred poultry is not aggressive unlike the hatchery stock. I should have asked more questions, I mean I asked, but didn't really inquire like I should have. I will put up with an aggressive cock to a degree, but you can't expect others to do that. Not when a friend or family takes care of the flock while you are away.

 

[speckledhen]

Quote: I sure cannot imagine who would tell you that. That is WAY too broad of a generalization. I don't think it has anything to do with whether he came from a hatchery or a heritage line. I had my own original Stukel line cockerel flog me once and rush me once, testing his boundaries a bit, seemed to me, and he even did it to Scott once or twice after he went to live there, however, once he began free ranging regularly and expending his pent up energy, he calmed down considerably, I'm told. Some are like that, some are not. My McMurray hatchery BR rooster and his two sons I kept were very calm and easygoing males.

I think many ignore the temperament when faced with a drop dead gorgeous bird that you have spent lots of money on for obvious reasons. Some think temperament is irrelevant. I think it's very relevant and part of the breed trait you choose/cull for, but that is me. I will always breed for temperament in every LF line I have. The Delaware in my avatar came from a line specifically bred for temperament as well as the SOP.

Could be that small breeding pens don't help the situation with these energetic young males. Some of them do better when they can roam free a couple of hours a day. I'm sure some breeders will poo-poo anything I say along those lines, but I do NOT believe you must tolerate a human-aggressive rooster to have a good breeder. JMHO. It's hard when there is a big investment at stake, certainly.

 

[normanack]

Beekissed has an excellent tutorial on establishing dominance over an aggressive cockerel. I'll look for it -- meanwhile, Jules, could you post it here if it's handy? Thanks.

 

[Yard full o' rocks]

OK all you Barred Rock fans, I have a dilemma. Remember I posted a month or so ago about getting a new cockerel from Jamie Duckworth? Spent a fortune getting that bird shipped across country. This male has never given me any problem. Maybe he recognizes I am the person who took him out of the box, kept him in the garage for a few days with food and water until he was over his jet lag or whatever...but he did not like my partner and would jump up at him. He has been helping me with the birds, getting greens from the garden every day and distributing them to the pens. He is a slight, not imposing person! He did not feel comfortable catching and pinning the bird down to tell him who was boss, so he'd just keep him at bay with a bucket or something.

OK, fast forward to now. We have a new caretaker living here helping us. It has been 1-1/2 years since the last caretaker, we like this woman and want her happy so she stays! This cockerel has taken to challenging her, too, and now has been jumping up at her and this morning, he drew blood. Now I have never seen any of this activity, because any time I am out there with either her or my partner, he behaves himself. Our caretaker is willing to try a lot of things, so I told her the best method was catching him and pinning him down to the ground and then holding him there until he stopped struggling, then add 30 seconds. She did that. But she told me she wasn't sure just how forceful she could be with him and not hurt him. A friend of hers told her to be preemptive and go in the pen and grab him and hold him down BEFORE he had a chance to do anything. Well this morning, she was intent to do that, but didn't have a chance because he flew at her and drew blood as soon as she opened the door. So she grabbed him and this time held him down for a full 10 minutes. She said she didn't hold him down hard, just enough to keep him there, but now he is limping and favoring (holding up) his right leg! So apparently she did hurt him. She thought maybe he just had "pins and needles" sort of thing from being held in a certain position for too long, but it has been 1/2 a day and he is still limping.

WHAT should I do with this bird?? I did say to her, maybe I should just take care of that pen, but that doesn't help if we go away and she is here by herself. Again, I have no problem with him, I have bent over and picked an egg up off the ground near him, turned my back on him...no aggression. None of us are wearing bright, aggression-causing colors like red. The other two have almost black hair and mine is brown...but otherwise, we are all around the 5'4" to 5'6" range and slender. It won't be more than a month before I take him out of the breeding pen and put him by himself. Not sure if he will be better or worse with them in a small 4'x4' pen, if he will try to fly out at them or not. Normally I would not keep an aggressive male, but this one seems to be selective. And costly.

Ok, a few things come to mind

1. Like Cyn said, I won't deal with an aggressive cock(erel) and I seriously doubt Jamie does either! He has younger kids

2. Does the K get any free range/outdoor time? How large an enclosure is he in?

3. How many females is he with?

4. I've seen my cockbird limp around after getting his butt kicked by his son. I think he'll survive that part.

5. I think I'd wait and see how he responds after today's events. Maybe he learned who "alpha" was....if not, get the chicks you need outta him and move him along. No sense keeping trouble. Expensive? Yup, but not worth human injury. Don't rush to judgement. I keep a 4' section of 1" PVC pipe in the chicken yard and outside in the food plot exclusively for "attitude adjusent". Everyone at my place knows how to put one in their place if need be....I bet it's been over 2 yrs since any of us used it, BUT, some birds (even females) need to get knocked down a notch in the pecking order occasionally

 

[Fred's Hens]

Ok, a few things come to mind

1. Like Cyn said, I won't deal with an aggressive cock(erel) and I seriously doubt Jamie does either! He has younger kids

2. Does the K get any free range/outdoor time? How large an enclosure is he in?

3. How many females is he with?

4. I've seen my cockbird limp around after getting his butt kicked by his son. I think he'll survive that part.

5. I think I'd wait and see how he responds after today's events. Maybe he learned who "alpha" was....if not, get the chicks you need outta him and move him along. No sense keeping trouble. Expensive? Yup, but not worth human injury. Don't rush to judgement. I keep a 4' section of 1" PVC pipe in the chicken yard and outside in the food plot exclusively for "attitude adjusent". Everyone at my place knows how to put one in their place if need be....I bet it's been over 2 yrs since any of us used it, BUT, some birds (even females) need to get knocked down a notch in the pecking order occasionally

Not much to add to the above. Said it well.

 

[desertmarcy]

I sure cannot imagine who would tell you that. That is WAY too broad of a generalization. I don't think it has anything to do with whether he came from a hatchery or a heritage line. I had my own original Stukel line cockerel flog me once and rush me once, testing his boundaries a bit, seemed to me, and he even did it to Scott once or twice after he went to live there, however, once he began free ranging regularly and expending his pent up energy, he calmed down considerably, I'm told. Some are like that, some are not. My McMurray hatchery BR rooster and his two sons I kept were very calm and easygoing males.

I think many ignore the temperament when faced with a drop dead gorgeous bird that you have spent lots of money on for obvious reasons. Some think temperament is irrelevant. I think it's very relevant and part of the breed trait you choose/cull for, but that is me. I will always breed for temperament in every LF line I have. The Delaware in my avatar came from a line specifically bred for temperament as well as the SOP.

Could be that small breeding pens don't help the situation with these energetic young males. Some of them do better when they can roam free a couple of hours a day. I'm sure some breeders will poo-poo anything I say along those lines, but I do NOT believe you must tolerate a human-aggressive rooster to have a good breeder. JMHO. It's hard when there is a big investment at stake, certainly.

I always breed for temperament, I think it is very important. This male is fine around me, why does he go after my partner and caretaker? Could he be detecting an "attitude" that is somewhat subliminal? What I'm saying, I have an attitude, I am not putting up with any s--t from any bird. I feed them, water them, clean their pens, look after them...I expect certain things in return, one of which, they accept me as their superior. Perhaps the other two do not have this attitude and the bird is picking up on it.

I was just out there cleaning pens, and the poor male is either sitting or standing with his right foot up. I picked him up and moved the leg and felt around, but didn't find anything. Perhaps when she pinned him for so long, his leg or foot was in a bad angle. I am hoping it is temporary, otherwise she ruined an expensive breeder

. There is no way he is going to be trying to breed his hens right now. I candled his eggs I set 5 days ago, and 2 of the 12 were infertile, so I am not convinced he has yet breed all the hens. It has not been that long ago that I added 4 more pullets to the 2 he already had in with him. The thing is, I did suggest to her that she pin him. But I didn't suggest she pin him for 10 minutes. She was listening to the advice of a good friend of hers and went ahead with that plan without checking with him and I was not out there at the time. I do not feel like I can chastise her for it, after all, I feel like I gave her the go-ahead to deal with his aggression. She went too far, though, IMO.

 

[speckledhen]

Marcy, I honestly think that some birds become attached to some people and some develop attitudes toward others for different reasons. Why, you may never know. What's in a rooster's pea brain? Wish we could ask him. It can be a puzzler.