The road less traveled...back to good health! They have lice, mites, scale mites, worms, anemia, gl

[Pullet Surprise]

Thats a sig sauer 5.56 nato the holes help keep the barrel cool when firing the end piece on the barrel is a suppresor. Its semi auto so I can kill multiple pigs at a time.

Zombie pigs?????

 

[Beekissed]

Have you posted the details on another thread? I'm interested to know what you found out during the cull.

It's a little gruesome...sure y'all want to hear that kind of stuff here? The rainbow and unicorn crowd will end up curled into a fetal position and whimpering when the tale is told....

 

[off-grid hen]

This is reality. If people are going to learn something, details will need to be shared.

Unless you feel that some will say, "but that one could have been saved!" If that's the case and you dont want to dealwith that, then don't bother, bee. But some of us are really willing to learn.

 

[Pozees]

It's a little gruesome...sure y'all want to hear that kind of stuff here? The rainbow and unicorn crowd will end up curled into a fetal position and whimpering when the tale is told....

Education isn't always easy, but I am interested in hearing what was learned as well.

 

[Beekissed]

Oh, she could have been saved...but to what end? What I found on this Black Star is what Al regularly expounds upon when deriding hatchery stock level genetics on birds. Now, I'm not saying that all birds from hatchery sources have poor genetics because all of my flocks have come from hatcheries and I've found both bad and good genetics there...mostly good. The production breeds, though, seem to be pretty substandard on skin quality, feathering, general body and joint hardiness. By production breeds, I mean sex-link layers...black stars, red stars..and any of the other designer names they use to market them. What it comes down to is a super layer that burns out quickly and lacks general hardiness and strong genetics towards longevity.

I don't know how many of you have ever dislocated a bird's neck but you have probably found, except in very young birds, that this method will show you just how tough these chickens can be. I've rung the necks of old hens~very vigorously, I might add~and they've gotten up and ran off with their heads on crooked. It really takes some finesse and effort to dislocate a normal chicken's neck in an efficient manner. Younger birds and broilers are very tender and haven't developed the tough fascia and connective tissue that older birds have developed and often, when using the dislocation method, their heads will come right off in your hand if you aren't careful.

This spring, instead of using my killing cones, I started killing my CX on the tailgate of our old truck. I found the "V" formed by the tailgate cable and the tailgate itself to be a perfect place to insert a chicken neck into, then by holding the head over the edge of the V and pulling down on the legs, I could actually feel the dislocation happening....so much so that I could exert only enough pressure to dislocate but not pop off the whole head. Then the same V held the knee joint securely while the bird was hung upside down and an artery was opened for bleed out. Neat, quick, efficient and surprisingly very little struggle~a little flapping but not much. The tailgate was also a great work station for evisceration of the birds. Death by pick-up..how much more redneck can ya get, huh?

Now..back to the cull bird. I didn't know the age of this bird but could tell she wasn't exactly young....probably at least 2 years old. Her vent was dry, tight and small. The skin around her vent was yellow and papery...this can either indicate a very old hen long past her prime or a bird with liver/kidney problems...or both. Since this bird did not look like a very old hen, I'd say it was organ difficulties. When her neck was dislocated it not only dislocated but the whole head popped off and only the skin was holding it to the body....came completely off the spinal stem. Not typical in older birds at all, especially when such little torque was placed on the joint.

When she flapped during the death throws, her wing hit the bumper of the truck. No rough surface or any jagged edges sticking out there...but the wing broke and the skin flayed off it in that small amount of flapping. This tells me of poor skin quality and feathering. Even the young CX that I butchered this spring kept their heads on when cervical dislocated and the flapping of the wings didn't yield this level of damage to the bird.

When I picked her up by a leg after her death throws were over, the leg dislocated at the knee...just from the weight of her body during that lifting motion. THAT has never happened to me in all my years of butchering chickens. Those leg joints are tough! The leg just bent sideways and the knuckle popped. This is not normal and I'd venture to say that either genetics or internal illness of some kind had softened and weakened her cartilage to this point. I've even killed 10 year old Leghorns...never in my life have I ever dislocated a leg or a neck so easily on a full grown hen in all these years.

My conclusion? Though she was heavy and well muscled, this was a bird that had poor genetics and poor health. She was never going to lay again and would likely have just dropped off the roost dead one dark night, as this breed tends to do when their heart finally gives out.

End of story.

 

[galanie]

Wow. I've not killed dozens and dozens of them but that was one weak bird!

 

[Beekissed]

When I first identified this bird as my first cull from this flock, I was going on her breed and what I know of it and her irritability towards her flock members. I've never known this breed to be particularly nasty or mean, so this might have stemmed from her overall well-being.

She could have been in some level of pain or discomfort all the time from these joint and cartilage weaknesses, though I never saw her limping or showing pain. She could have just had a general feeling of discomfort that didn't center on any one place...but just enough to make this bird cranky and mean.

 

[binders]

Oh, she could have been saved...but to what end? What I found on this Black Star is what Al regularly expounds upon when deriding hatchery stock level genetics on birds. Now, I'm not saying that all birds from hatchery sources have poor genetics because all of my flocks have come from hatcheries and I've found both bad and good genetics there...mostly good. The production breeds, though, seem to be pretty substandard on skin quality, feathering, general body and joint hardiness. By production breeds, I mean sex-link layers...black stars, red stars..and any of the other designer names they use to market them. What it comes down to is a super layer that burns out quickly and lacks general hardiness and strong genetics towards longevity.

I don't know how many of you have ever dislocated a bird's neck but you have probably found, except in very young birds, that this method will show you just how tough these chickens can be. I've rung the necks of old hens~very vigorously, I might add~and they've gotten up and ran off with their heads on crooked. It really takes some finesse and effort to dislocate a normal chicken's neck in an efficient manner. Younger birds and broilers are very tender and haven't developed the tough fascia and connective tissue that older birds have developed and often, when using the dislocation method, their heads will come right off in your hand if you aren't careful.

This spring, instead of using my killing cones, I started killing my CX on the tailgate of our old truck. I found the "V" formed by the tailgate cable and the tailgate itself to be a perfect place to insert a chicken neck into, then by holding the head over the edge of the V and pulling down on the legs, I could actually feel the dislocation happening....so much so that I could exert only enough pressure to dislocate but not pop off the whole head. Then the same V held the knee joint securely while the bird was hung upside down and an artery was opened for bleed out. Neat, quick, efficient and surprisingly very little struggle~a little flapping but not much. The tailgate was also a great work station for evisceration of the birds. Death by pick-up..how much more redneck can ya get, huh?

Now..back to the cull bird. I didn't know the age of this bird but could tell she wasn't exactly young....probably at least 2 years old. Her vent was dry, tight and small. The skin around her vent was yellow and papery...this can either indicate a very old hen long past her prime or a bird with liver problems...or both. Since this bird did not look like a very old hen, I'd say it was organ difficulties. When her neck was dislocated it not only dislocated but the whole head popped off and only the skin was holding it to the body....came completely off the spinal stem. Not typical in older birds at all, especially when such little torque was placed on the joint.

When she flapped during the death throws, her wing hit the bumper of the truck. No rough surface or any jagged edges sticking out there...but the wing broke and the skin flayed off it in that small amount of flapping. This tells me of poor skin quality and feathering. Even the young CX that I butchered this spring kept their heads on when cervical dislocated and the flapping of the wings didn't yield this level of damage to the bird.

When I picked her up by a leg after her death throws were over, the leg dislocated at the knee...just from the weight of her body during that lifting motion. THAT has never happened to me in all my years of butchering chickens. Those leg joints are tough! The leg just bent sideways and the knuckle popped. This is not normal and I'd venture to say that either genetics or internal illness of some kind had softened and weakened her cartilage to this point. I've even killed 10 year old Leghorns...never in my life have I ever dislocated a leg or a neck so easily on a full grown hen in all these years.

My conclusion? Though she was heavy and well muscled, this was a bird that had poor genetics and poor health. She was never going to lay again and would likely have just dropped off the roost dead one dark night, as this breed tends to do when their heart finally gives out.

End of story.

Thanks for the details. Did you find anything unusual about the organs as you thought you might when looking at the vent?

 

[Beekissed]

I didn't do a autopsy on this bird. Now, if this had been a good bird and it died suddenly, I'd open her up and look around...have done so in the past on birds that dropped off the roost dead.

This visual and physical assessment of skin, joints, and disposition was enough to convince me that something was wrong....never knowing what it was doesn't bother me. I didn't have a hand in raising this particular bird and I have no knowledge of her upbringing. If I had hand raised her, I would have been looking more closely into her reasons for being so fragile.

 

[galanie]

When I first identified this bird as my first cull from this flock, I was going on her breed and what I know of it and her irritability towards her flock members.  I've never known this breed to be particularly nasty or mean, so this might have stemmed from her overall well-being. 

She could have been in some level of pain or discomfort all the time from these joint and cartilage weaknesses, though I never saw her limping or showing pain.  She could have just had a general feeling of discomfort that didn't center on any one place...but just enough to make this bird cranky and mean. 

 

That was my exact thought. I know I'm cranky when I am hurting! Genes removed: Win.