The same thing happens every time...

[dlolato]

I personally think that you have too many birds in your cardboard box at one time. By looking into the box, it seems that there is alot of available space, but the main problem is that when they huddle in the light source, the stronger chicks will climb to the top and the weaker ones will be on the bottom and literally get trampled. This will make them look lethargic and wobble weakly around and then refuse to eat or drink. I don't even like to have twenty-five at one time in the same area because you will have the same thing occur. The smaller the group, the less chance of smothering. You might try to separate the box into sections and put twenty in each section.

Several years ago I visited poultry houses that raised for Tyson Foods and there were chicks dead everywhere that were trampled. My friend who owned these facilities said they they expect to loose 10%. Measure your losses based on those percentages and see how far off you are, if any. I think everything else you are doing is in line with successful expectations.

I myself, recently got a shipment of 30 chicks in and have lost 5, but they were on the road for three days........I received them on the 4th day which was too long. The longer in transit, the more losses can be expected.

Best of success!

 

[redrocketrooster]

Quote:
Additional information relative to RedRocketRooster's comment: My 26 birds had 12 cuft .5 cuft per chick for one month then, I opened the brooder into the chicken tractor (outdoors) in September, this gave the birds 27 cuft or 3 cuft per bird plus they were able to sleep in the brooder with appropriate heat. This continued until the birds were two months old when the brooder was removed. The birds were living in the tractor free ranging daily; at three months they were too large for the tractor and were moved into their permanent coop. I had no losses do to environment, lost one bird to a neighbors cat.

The point being, I agree with RedRocketRooster who hit the nail on the head - too little space and not enough airflow. I made a similar mistake with the coop in the winter. There was an overwhelming smell of ammonia(which is a lethal gas) even with 4" deep bedding; I added another 2" of wood shavings and there was no change in the level of ammonia.

A great member of this forum kept telling me I had too little ventilation, so I swallowed my pride and opened two 1'x 4' screened windows in late December. The smell is gone, the birds are happy and as I was told, "The cold is nothing more than an inconvenience, ventilate, ventilate, ventilate". The birds survived a brutal winter here in Pennsylvania without a frostbitten comb. There was 24" of snow on the ground for over 2 months - the ventilated birds were laying 19-22 eggs per day without fail.

Hope this revelation helps you along your way!

Oh haha. Yeah, thats my thoughts too but I didn't write that. XD;;
Though I admit i have seen much more is less space and most survived so it has to be the airflow.

 

[NewChickieMommy]

We can certainly try to split the group not in "sick bay" into another area so that they have more space and air flow. We had one that we thought for sure was going to die last night. Pulled him from the healthy group due to lethargy and hei just laid back with his eyes closed. Then he would sit in sick bay and loll backwards with his eyes shut. I thought "Oh yeah...that one is a a goner." Gave him a few drops of the elderberry juice...he is alive this morning. Still wobbling as are the others...all look like they are doing disco or something...but all are eating and drinking and none have died..surprisingly.

We will work on splitting them up tomorrow when my husband gets in from work in the morning.

 

[Katy]

I think splitting them up into more than one group is a good thing. What would be even better would be if you could put them into a brooder that had some wire sides to get more air flow to the bottom of the container.

 

[Minniechickmama]

Good luck. I can only imagine the frustration you keep going through. I know I would be. It still doesn't sound like you have the culprit to me if you have separated them out and they still act all weirded out. I hope that something gives. Sounds like you deserve to have some chickens grow up for you.
Let us all know how it goes from here.

 

[lemurchaser]

So I read all the posts and here are some thoughts (I've never had a huge number of chicks, but here are some ideas from having lots of small batches of chicks):

You said you lost some to trampling initially, which suggests maybe another heat lamp is needed. Even though by age they may only need 85 degrees, I would give them access to one lamp that is warmer. I find my chicks self-regulate well, as long as there is a spot they can really warm up. I always have one spot that's around 95-100 that they can go get warm fast if they need to. They move away as soon as they are warm enough. Also even 20 chicks per heat lamp is a lot! Especially as they get bigger.

I don't know that the lack of space is your problem, but I'd sure spread them out if possible.

I would also put the sick ones on medicated crumbles. Coccidia is a major problem for them and it usually hits around 2-3 weeks old. It takes time for the coccidia to replicate in the gut and then they tend to die or get really weak at a couple weeks old. I understand that you may be against that, but just recognize then that by not treating for coccidia, that could be your cause. The medication slows the coccidia replication giving the birds time to make a natural immunity to it, so they only need to be on it for the first 6 weeks.

You could always get one necropsied if it dies and see if there is actually anything going on. They'd be able to tell whether its something like AE or mareks or coccidia or something else. I'd really recommend this actually.

When raising birds as natural as possible you have to be much more careful about stocking densities, hygiene, temperature etc. Having 60-80 chicks housed together is kind of intense stocking, without using chemicals. I would try to keep them in groups of 20 or less, ideally small groups, the way a hen would do it. That way chicks don't have to compete for resources, can sleep better (with 80 chicks they won't all be sleeping at once, like they do in small groups), and have less exposure to germs at a fragile age.

I hope you can figure out what's going on, it sounds really frustrating.