Theoretical, Science Fiction Question

[3KillerBs]

Quote:
Yes. And as the author I want them to have those problems to overcome.

I know that a lot of breeders keep closed flocks so I figured that someone here would know how many birds would be needed as foundation stock.

I may have to put the animals and the majority of the colonists into cold sleep to get them there, but I don't want an excessive level of bio-engineered miracle-working going on. I prefer the lower-tech challenges of getting the animals to survive on the alien world.

Of course they'll need lots of different breeds from all over the world to ensure maximum genetic diversity to select from as they create strains and breeds that suit their conditions.

 

[3KillerBs]

Quote:
This is really fascinating. I wasn't sure what to expect when I clicked this thread but Amazon got me thinking.

Could hatching eggs be frozen somehow and incubated later? The biggest problem on a ship would be feed and water. Is this what You mean by frozen embryos or is there another way to do it?

Bringing at least frozen sperm should work. I can't see how one could do in-vitro on a chicken since the egg itself has to form.

Maybe one of their challenges could be that you can cold-sleep a chicken but, unlike with the mammals, you can't bring frozen poultry embryos so you end up with too much poultry in proportion and it takes a while to get the farms into balance.

 

[Airilith]

Quote:
This is really fascinating. I wasn't sure what to expect when I clicked this thread but Amazon got me thinking.

Could hatching eggs be frozen somehow and incubated later? The biggest problem on a ship would be feed and water. Is this what You mean by frozen embryos or is there another way to do it?

If you store fertilized eggs at 58-60F they will last for a long time in a state of suspended development. I don't know how long a long time is, but we could keep them for a month or two like that and still hatch at a 80%+ rate.

 

[cybercat]

Ok back to your question. You would need 3 flocks of same breed for rotational breeding which you can do forever. This type of breeding is called rolling matings and you can do as little a 1 roos to 2 hens. But it is suggested to have 3 breeding trios for best results of one breed. The way it works after first batch of chicks the best cockerals go in with the best of the oldest hens from the previuous year. At the end of that season the best young stock gets paired up with the best older stock and so it goes every year. You can do this with larget flocks too.

 

[3KillerBs]

Quote:
For real?

Only 9 birds?

With almost no risk of genetic issues cropping up? No fertility depression?

Remember, I'm going for almost no possibility of adding to the gene pool in the future.

 

[3KillerBs]

On a related question, ...

How many adult chickens would you expect to raise in a season -- say from March to October?

Given ordinary levels of mortality in a healthy flock.

Edit for clarification -- based on the egg-laying abilities of a heritage-type bird.

 

[HeelerDawg]

This is a very interesting topic. The best way of bringing diverse variations in a single species to me would be to bring sperm from as many breeds as possible, likewise eggs from as many as possible, and then the auctual live animals being various breeds consiting of only females (so you would only auctually have female specimens on board). The females that you brought could then be used as surrogate parents for the sperm and embryos you brought and also as auctual biological parents. If I was going to do this I would definitely make sure that I made room for the original breeds of species such as Jungle Fowl in the poultry's case, (Wolves in the dog's case ect...) because these original breeds contain more variation in DNA (unlike breeds that have been created from these and then extensively line bred and inbred) which gives you a better chance of creating new breeds. But, if you are limited to live animals only, I would use these "original breeds" that I just mentioned because of their variation in DNA. Excuse me if it seems that I'm rambling on. Biogenetics is a passion of mine.

Good Luck with your paper!

 

[cybercat]

Quote:
For real?

Only 9 birds?

With almost no risk of genetic issues cropping up? No fertility depression?

Remember, I'm going for almost no possibility of adding to the gene pool in the future.

Yes, that is what is said but one must remember if you have unrelated birds to start it goes a long way. So you would have the most diversity in the flock then and kee it that way. BUT if this is a colony ship figure you would want 100 birds. For 9 would not do anyone any good for it would take too long to get enough to feed everyone.

Figure one chicken will not sit till yhey have at least 8 eggs. Now if incubating you can hatch out alot more. But that take eletricty which a colony starting might not have. So maybe incubat first hatch and then let hens take it from there. You will have to figure in loses so having the 100 helps that way. How many will not make the journey or if they do how many will die in new home from whatever be it disease or predator or stress.

 

[3KillerBs]

Quote:
That's an interesting idea.

Space colonists who need to establish an independent, self-supporting economy before their supplies ran out wouldn't be able to depend on breeding up productive animals over hundreds of generations from the original stock, but somehow including a few would be desirable. If I can find space on the ship somehow.

 

[3KillerBs]

Thanks for being so willing to discuss a purely theoretical topic this way.