"Treats" definition, and amounts

[Penpal]

I don't give treats. I don't think chickens have an understanding of what a treat is and they just take the food. They know it comes from me. I call the chickens and they come. Marvelous recall. What I want to give them, I give them. I would not give them anything that isn't good for them. They get sunflower seeds everyday, how much depends on the time of year, more in the winter. I can still use their normal rations (whole wheat, whole oats, etc) as a bribe to get them to move to a specific spot.

 

[Perris]

Thanks @saysfaa for trying to provide some support for the '10% treat rule' - and I know you do proper research, and you do not repeat things without thinking, and you've invested time and energy in your reply - but this one really doesn't work. Why? Because 1. it's about feeding broilers in a factory farm, so chicks up to six weeks old full stop. Deficiencies in a diet have to be really bad to show up on that sort of timeframe. 2. the 10% treat rule is nowhere mentioned in it, but is a construction (the so-called 'results in a logical conclusion') based on the protein figures in the commercial feed given in this paper (which is focussed on lowering the protein levels), plus pure guesswork as to how much protein may be in any - let's call it 'supplement' to avoid the 'treat' red herring - given.

Of course the real problem is this:

If the main diet of the chickens is a commercial feed then adding grass and veggies scraps (or anything else low in protein) will lower the protein of the diet as a whole.

This appears in other guises in other threads as 'dilution' of the protein. The problem here is that it ignores what the extra food actually is - it could be leftover beef-burger, tinned sardines in olive oil, banana, milk-soaked bread, for example, all of which have completely different nutritional profiles - and simply assumes that whatever it is, it will have less protein (proportionately, per unit) than does the commercial feed. Ignoring what the supplement actually is, is not OK.

Ten percent has a chance of actually being okay because, as the above source puts nicely enough, "...[amino acid] minimums can vary based on dietary protein status, bird strain, bird environment..."* and, I'd add, other things. So, they have to add some margin. I doubt it is ten percent but combined with the chance that a given flock needs the lower end of the range and with the chance the treats might be varied gives at least a theoretical hope for it.

Ten percent is easy to remember, sort of easy to measure, big enough that most people feel like they have given a treat (defined here as something out of the ordinary that gives pleasure), small enough to not cause too much damage even if it isn't actually okay.

These look like sensible reasons for suggesting a figure like 10% when someone asks about giving 'treats'. But for those of us who have read the literature on chickens self-selecting a good or even better diet for themselves than what they are typically given even by well-meaning keepers, the number should be dispensed with; let each chicken decide for themselves how much of anything they want to eat. In any case, what you describe is a management protocol for the keeper's convenience more than a dietary recommendation for the chicken.

 

[FrannyNZooey]

Hi all,

Thanks so much for taking the time for a thoughtful discussion. I'm very impressed, although not at all surprised, with all of your knowledge and experience. I can very much appreciate that I raised a contentious topic, which is by no means a criticism of the discussion, just an observation of how passionate respondents are. We're new to urban chicken keeping this year so all perspectives are helpful.

I think I had heard of the 10% "treat" suggestion, but was unclear if it was caloric in take or volume, thus my question. While I likely won't be measuring either volume or calories, my takeaway is to be VERY conservative since they are small beasts. I certainly don't want to cause harm, but I like the idea of trying to incorporate variety and interest into their diet.

Primarily we give our three girls a bit of left over tomato that would get gross refrigerated, cucumber, leafy greens, water melon rinds, rose petals, or a handful of grubs we find in the compost while turning (we discovered over the summer that black soldier fly larvae we're liking that space). I'm sure the fresh items will change as we get into winter.

I've also moved some large potted herbs (basil, mint, rosemary, clover bed for now) into their run so hopefully provide them with browsing opportunities.

Cheers, and hope your week is starting off well!

 

[Morrigan]

I understand the 10% treat guideline to refer to caloric intake, not volume. A handful of lettuce is less impactful than a handful of dried meal worms.

It looks you have have a reasonable approach for your small flock. Live BSFL out of the compost is a great treat.

 

[thecatumbrella]

My chickens will eat unthinkable things that in no way constitute food. They also seem to have this weird sixth sense of knowing what they need nutritionally (how do they know to eat the oyster shell?!)

I stick to 2 tablespoons per bird as "treats", which includes scratch and BSFL. I ease up a lot more when it comes to greens (sprouts, weeds, herbs, etc). The cucumber question is a good one. I also consider that a treat, as it's mostly water and fiber. They'll happily eat that and ignore their feed for the day.

A great suggestion I saw on here was to hold off on treats until late afternoon. That gives them the day to forage or eat from their feeder.

 

[Baker1181]

My chickens will eat unthinkable things that in no way constitute food. They also seem to have this weird sixth sense of knowing what they need nutritionally (how do they know to eat the oyster shell?!)

I stick to 2 tablespoons per bird as "treats", which includes scratch and BSFL. I ease up a lot more when it comes to greens (sprouts, weeds, herbs, etc). The cucumber question is a good one. I also consider that a treat, as it's mostly water and fiber. They'll happily eat that and ignore their feed for the day.

A great suggestion I saw on here was to hold off on treats until late afternoon. That gives them the day to forage or eat from their feeder.

How many times a week do you do the table spoon method? Curious on how others do it

 

[thecatumbrella]

How many times a week do you do the table spoon method? Curious on how others do it

Sorry, I should have clarified! That's 2 tablespoons per bird, per day.

 

[FrannyNZooey]

I have to share that I found it interesting that as the temps cooled, the chicks were less interested in watermelon peel. Made perfect sense for them to dive in to it in the 80s and 90s, but their interest waned in more manageable temps. Gave me confidence that they know to an extent what they need.

 

[FrannyNZooey]

Anywho, stuff they didn’t care about went straight into the compost each evening.

 

[fuzzi]

Moderation.

When I get home from work I bring some non-commercial food to the coop residents. It may consist of leftover salad (no dressing), fruit cores, overripe tomato ends, crushed egg shells, thinned carrot seedling tops, a few insects I saw in the compost pile, etc.

The flock seems to be doing well, so I am not going to worry about strictly adhering to a random percentage.