trying to add to our tiny flock

[Fluffy&Cutie]

i don't know how to explain this well. sorry for the long winded questions.
our city allows a 5 chicken maximum, hens only. We have 2. We want 2 more. Because it is such a small limit, I want different breeds. We have an Austra & a leghorn (they are awesome and loving and best friends). I want a legbar and a silkie.
1.Will the legbar and silkie get along?
I was trying my hardest to get them from the same breeder. However, the breeder has 2 legbars avaiable, but the silkies are not ready yet...and the breeder only sells in pairs.
2. If i get the pair of legbars now, and ONE silkie later (from a different place), will the silkie be alone? Odd chick out?
I was hoping to pick up the chicks as oppose to shipping to protect the chickens and this limits where i can go. In addition, I can only get a small number if chicks so many on-line hatcheries are not available, plus, if any die...
And, california has ncv, so it must be from a certified breeder to best ensure the health of the chickens. may be i should wait until the stars align better for the chickens and my wants.
3. Do you have any thoughts on this? I'm overwhelmed in my hunt. Thanks for your support. Love this community. Happy day to all.

 

[sourland]

If you get chicks, there is always the possibility of getting cockerels. Silkies raised with large fowl tend to do fine, but when introduced to established flocks they are generally picked on. I would go with just adding two Legbars.

 

[Grits&Eggs]

I dont' think it is possible to figure out if two chickens will get along, I thought that if I had a buff another buff would be their friend and no way, they fought worse than the others!

 

[50-45-1]

Intrigating new chickens to an existing flock can be difficult sometimes.
First concern is do you have sufficent room for 2 additional birds? Crowding them will make it harder.
I like silkies too, but i notice when i had them in the past they had trouble as they are smaller than the standard breeds and usually more timid.
I just looked up legbar as i did not know what they were, and i think they a quite beautiful.
If it were me i would just get 2 of those.
Your decision though. Good luck with your new birds!

 

[Fluffy&Cutie]

Intrigating new chickens to an existing flock can be difficult sometimes.
First concern is do you have sufficent room for 2 additional birds? Crowding them will make it harder.
I like silkies too, but i notice when i had them in the past they had trouble as they are smaller than the standard breeds and usually more timid.
I just looked up legbar as i did not know what they were, and i think they a quite beautiful.
If it were me i would just get 2 of those.
Your decision though. Good luck with your new birds!

thanks all for your input! yes, i love those beautiful legbars.
we are actually building a larger coop especially for the addition of the new birds. the coop is 21 square feet with an 80 square foot run. and its warm here year round so they'll only use the coop to sleep. the chickens "are" my 9 year old son's. he wants silkies. i want blue eggs! (in my dreams i would hatch those silkies that lay blue eggs!) i was just trying to figure out a win-win scenario. thanks so much for allowing me the space to explore my options. happy weekend!

 

[Mrs. K]

I too would be leary of adding silkies to an established flock of bigger birds. Wishes with chickens often times don't work, and can be brutal.

 

[aart]

Integration of new birds can be tricky indeed, especially with low flock numbers and small spaces. The new 'larger coop' of 21sqft is still pretty darn small.
Do you have a smaller coop now?
You might be able to use right inside the 80sqft run that to start integration of your new birds.

Here's some tips on ....
Integration Basics:
It's all about territory and resources(space/food/water).
Existing birds will almost always attack new ones to defend their resources.
Understanding chicken behaviors is essential to integrating new birds into your flock.

Confine new birds within sight but physically segregated from older/existing birds for several weeks, so they can see and get used to each other but not physically interact.

In adjacent runs, spread scratch grains along the dividing mesh, best if mesh is just big enough for birds to stick their head thru, so they get used to eating together.

The more space, the better. Birds will peck to establish dominance, the pecked bird needs space to get away. As long as there's no copious blood drawn and/or new bird is not trapped/pinned down and beaten unmercilessly, let them work it out. Every time you interfere or remove new birds, they'll have to start the pecking order thing all over again.

Multiple feed/water stations. Dominance issues are most often carried out over sustenance, more stations lessens the frequency of that issue.

Places for the new birds to hide 'out of line of sight'(but not a dead end trap) and/or up and away from any bully birds. Roosts, pallets or boards leaned up against walls or up on concrete blocks, old chairs tables, branches, logs, stumps out in the run can really help. Lots of diversion and places to 'hide' instead of bare wide open run.

This used to be a better search, new format has reduced it's efficacy, but still:
Read up on integration..... BYC advanced search>titles only>integration
This is good place to start reading, BUT some info is outdated IMO:
http://www.backyardchickens.com/a/adding-to-your-flock

 

[Ridgerunner]

1.Will the legbar and silkie get along?

No one can tell you if any two chickens will get along or if they will not. They are living animals, life just does not work that way. Each chicken is an individual with its own personality. Some things I consider much more important than breed, other than individual personalities, are levels of maturity, how much room you have and the quality of that room, and your integration techniques.

2. If i get the pair of legbars now, and ONE silkie later (from a different place), will the silkie be alone? Odd chick out?

That would not be unusual regardless of breeds, especially if there is a maturity difference. Age and maturity are related but some mature at different rates than others. Age is a general guideline but maturity level is what I think really counts. Obviously you cannot tell maturity by looking so age is your best guide. In general a more mature bird will outrank a more immature bird in the pecking order and are often not afraid to enforce those differences. Even if there is not a maturity difference they can form bonds or exclude others. Most of the time when they all reach maturity they work out the pecking order and merge into one flock but not always. They can form sub-flocks. Until the immature actually mature they tend to form sub-flocks and avoid the others. That's why room is important.

3. Do you have any thoughts on this?

I can't tell how old your current two are or what age you are planing to add. I get the feeling the two you have may not be all that old but may be old enough to lay. You mention chicks when talking about the new ones. I realize I'm rambling on about maturity but I find that very important when you decide how you are going to go about integrating them.

I also get the feeling that you have read that you need 4 square feet per bird in the coop and 10 square feet per bird in the run. I'm glad you have that additional room in the run, that gives you more options. With your climate that run room can help year around. That 4 + 10 or larger is not that bad for a small backyard flock when they are all mature, but when you integrate you need more room, especially if there is a maturity difference. It's not a square feet per bird number, the quality of that room makes a big difference. A lot of us integrate younger birds all the time without serious issues, you can do it. If you can tell us the age of your birds, old and new, we can give more specific suggestions on how to go about it. Photos of what you have to work with (coops/runs) can help.

Your expectations play a part. To me a successful integration does not mean they are all sitting around a campfire toasting marshmallows for s'mores an singing Cum Ba Ya. A successful integration is when no one gets injured. It's that simple and usually achievable.

I'm not sure why that breeder would only sell a pair of pullets together. Legbar are auto-sexing, you can tell sex at hatch. Are you sure that is not supposed to be a breeding pair where one is a male? I know nothing about that breeder. Are they breeding to the SOP for show or is it someone that got hatchery birds and selling whatever hatches? There are a lot of different varieties of breeders. I'm not sure how important the "show quality" of those birds are to you.

Each time you integrate you upset the pecking order. If you can at all I'd suggest you try to do that only once, but that may not be possible and reach your goals, especially if the two come from different sources or are at different levels of maturity. We are all unique in our goals and set-ups, that's part of why there is no clear cut answer to this.

You might be able to find your state thread in the "Where am I! Where are you!" section if this forum and chat with your neighbors. Some of them may be able to help you. Someone may know of a local source for what you want or they may be willing to split an order with you so you can avoid the shipping minimums. Most hatcheries do not sex bantams and Silkies are normally bantams so you may get a male if you go that route. MyPetChicken does try to sex bantams, there may be more. Just something to be aware of.

We all need to chase our dreams. Yours are achievable but may have a few challenges in them. Good luck!

 

[Fluffy&Cutie]

Integration of new birds can be tricky indeed, especially with low flock numbers and small spaces. The new 'larger coop' of 21sqft is still pretty darn small.
Do you have a smaller coop now?
You might be able to use right inside the 80sqft run that to start integration of your new birds.

Here's some tips on ....
Integration Basics:
It's all about territory and resources(space/food/water).
Existing birds will almost always attack new ones to defend their resources.
Understanding chicken behaviors is essential to integrating new birds into your flock.

Confine new birds within sight but physically segregated from older/existing birds for several weeks, so they can see and get used to each other but not physically interact.

In adjacent runs, spread scratch grains along the dividing mesh, best if mesh is just big enough for birds to stick their head thru, so they get used to eating together.

The more space, the better. Birds will peck to establish dominance, the pecked bird needs space to get away. As long as there's no copious blood drawn and/or new bird is not trapped/pinned down and beaten unmercilessly, let them work it out. Every time you interfere or remove new birds, they'll have to start the pecking order thing all over again.

Multiple feed/water stations. Dominance issues are most often carried out over sustenance, more stations lessens the frequency of that issue.

Places for the new birds to hide 'out of line of sight'(but not a dead end trap) and/or up and away from any bully birds. Roosts, pallets or boards leaned up against walls or up on concrete blocks, old chairs tables, branches, logs, stumps out in the run can really help. Lots of diversion and places to 'hide' instead of bare wide open run.

This used to be a better search, new format has reduced it's efficacy, but still:
Read up on integration..... BYC advanced search>titles only>integration
This is good place to start reading, BUT some info is outdated IMO:
http://www.backyardchickens.com/a/adding-to-your-flock

i guess i should clarify. i only have 2 chickens. two. and everyone says 4 feet per chicken in a coop. so the 21 feet is 10.5 feet per chicken. ummm...not enough space still? with 4 chickens that should 5 feet per chicken. and again, it will may be get to 40 degrees f at night this winter- so they will always be "outside" except to sleep.
aart, thanks for your input. i saw your name and quickly ran to read your great info. i have researched at byc many ways to make a successful run. thanks again for the info.

 

[Fluffy&Cutie]

1.Will the legbar and silkie get along?

No one can tell you if any two chickens will get along or if they will not. They are living animals, life just does not work that way. Each chicken is an individual with its own personality. Some things I consider much more important than breed, other than individual personalities, are levels of maturity, how much room you have and the quality of that room, and your integration techniques.

2. If i get the pair of legbars now, and ONE silkie later (from a different place), will the silkie be alone? Odd chick out?

That would not be unusual regardless of breeds, especially if there is a maturity difference. Age and maturity are related but some mature at different rates than others. Age is a general guideline but maturity level is what I think really counts. Obviously you cannot tell maturity by looking so age is your best guide. In general a more mature bird will outrank a more immature bird in the pecking order and are often not afraid to enforce those differences. Even if there is not a maturity difference they can form bonds or exclude others. Most of the time when they all reach maturity they work out the pecking order and merge into one flock but not always. They can form sub-flocks. Until the immature actually mature they tend to form sub-flocks and avoid the others. That's why room is important.

3. Do you have any thoughts on this?

I can't tell how old your current two are or what age you are planing to add. I get the feeling the two you have may not be all that old but may be old enough to lay. You mention chicks when talking about the new ones. I realize I'm rambling on about maturity but I find that very important when you decide how you are going to go about integrating them.

I also get the feeling that you have read that you need 4 square feet per bird in the coop and 10 square feet per bird in the run. I'm glad you have that additional room in the run, that gives you more options. With your climate that run room can help year around. That 4 + 10 or larger is not that bad for a small backyard flock when they are all mature, but when you integrate you need more room, especially if there is a maturity difference. It's not a square feet per bird number, the quality of that room makes a big difference. A lot of us integrate younger birds all the time without serious issues, you can do it. If you can tell us the age of your birds, old and new, we can give more specific suggestions on how to go about it. Photos of what you have to work with (coops/runs) can help.

Your expectations play a part. To me a successful integration does not mean they are all sitting around a campfire toasting marshmallows for s'mores an singing Cum Ba Ya. A successful integration is when no one gets injured. It's that simple and usually achievable.

I'm not sure why that breeder would only sell a pair of pullets together. Legbar are auto-sexing, you can tell sex at hatch. Are you sure that is not supposed to be a breeding pair where one is a male? I know nothing about that breeder. Are they breeding to the SOP for show or is it someone that got hatchery birds and selling whatever hatches? There are a lot of different varieties of breeders. I'm not sure how important the "show quality" of those birds are to you.

Each time you integrate you upset the pecking order. If you can at all I'd suggest you try to do that only once, but that may not be possible and reach your goals, especially if the two come from different sources or are at different levels of maturity. We are all unique in our goals and set-ups, that's part of why there is no clear cut answer to this.

You might be able to find your state thread in the "Where am I! Where are you!" section if this forum and chat with your neighbors. Some of them may be able to help you. Someone may know of a local source for what you want or they may be willing to split an order with you so you can avoid the shipping minimums. Most hatcheries do not sex bantams and Silkies are normally bantams so you may get a male if you go that route. MyPetChicken does try to sex bantams, there may be more. Just something to be aware of.

We all need to chase our dreams. Yours are achievable but may have a few challenges in them. Good luck!

THANK YOU for your thoughtful reply. you spoke to my heart, thank you.

my 2 girls are 22 weeks. one is laying, one not yet. they were rescues that my son wanted to save. so breed choice was not an option. we are lucky, they are awesome ladies! i did not know that integration needed more room, thanks for that info. i have researched for 2 months how to do this best. that was not something i saw. i knew about the pecking order, but i didn't know it was based on maturity.
thanks for the time and information you shared so respectfully.

going forward, our decision is that we will get 2 dna sexed silkies locally to ensure females. (and no stress or deaths from shipping). i will just have to dream of blue eggs! perhaps one day!!!
thank you all for your input! hugs to you!