Turkeys For 2013

[Arielle]

I just got this via 3RiversCHick-- a few pages on the MW, she thinks they forgot to renew the copyright so it is available to us to read. c/ 1950

International poultry guide for flock selection; covering the
more popular breeds and varieties of chickens and turkeys, by Loyal F. Payne and Thomas B. Avery.
by Payne, Loyal Frederick, 1889- Avery, Thomas B.
Published 1950
http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=coo.31924003127564;view=1up;seq=1

 

[Arielle]

T^his comment surprized me--- I was looking thru old posts for variety specific comments.

"The BSW is a good meat heritage turkey but of the 6 varieties we raise I would have to rate them last on the taste scale. It's kind of hard to describe but they don't have that "extra" turkey taste like Bourbon red or Midget.Steve"

I havent eaten these two varieties, but so far all turkeys taste the same to me. How about you?

 

[racinchickins]

Just had to post. I processed 4 turkeys for Thanksgiving. A Bronze tom and three chocolate/bronze hens. Two hens went to friends to use for their Turkey day dinners. The tom and the other hen we kept for our dinner.

They were all hatched in June, and when processed, the hens were 8 lbs each and the tom was 16 lbs. We deep fried the hen and roasted the tom. My friends each roasted their hens too. I was really nervous going in to Thanksgiving since this was my first time raising turkeys, and I was worried that they would not turn out well for everyone.

It turns out I needn't have worried. My family was very happy with them, and My 78 year old MIL pronounced them the best turkey she has ever eaten. I also got good feedback from my friends that their families enjoyed them too!

I have gotten a lot of guidance and feedback from this thread, both directly in answer to questions, and indirectly from reading everyone's posts. I'd like to throw out a big THANK YOU to everyone for all the stories and advice. I'm now totally gung ho to raise more for next year, and to actually try to sell some birds for next Thanksgiving. I've already subscribed to the 2014 Turkey Talk thread and look forward to soaking up even more turkey knowledge over then next year.

 

[Celie]

The Midget White was bred for a smaller family, as the toms should be 12# at full maturity, have a full breast and lay lots of eggs! Beltsville Small White, were also bred to be a small white turkey, but not that small! A mature tom will weigh approx. 20 pounds, but have a single breast and lay much fewer eggs. These 2 breeds have been crossed so much, most of what people call either Very Rare Variety, is in fact a cross breed mutt that will not produce the same identical birds there parents are. It is very hard to find true to breed for both types. I have secured(I think) a source for a pair or trio of each, true to breed. I am hoping to raise both breeds, keeping them separate and see if I cam help recover these 2 almost extinct breeds. If you have a cross and you are happy with it, GREAT, but let people you sell to that since you have a cross, the next generation may be a different shape, size and egg production, as only pure Heritage turkeys will hatch true to their breed. Sounds like most people are selling cross breeds and representing them as a pure breed! Too much dishonest breeders !

 

[chickadoodles]

The Midget White was bred for a smaller family, as the toms should be 12# at full maturity, have a full breast and lay lots of eggs! Beltsville Small White, were also bred to be a small white turkey, but not that small! A mature tom will weigh approx. 20 pounds, but have a single breast and lay much fewer eggs. These 2 breeds have been crossed so much, most of what people call either Very Rare Variety, is in fact a cross breed mutt that will not produce the same identical birds there parents are. It is very hard to find true to breed for both types. I have secured(I think) a source for a pair or trio of each, true to breed. I am hoping to raise both breeds, keeping them separate and see if I cam help recover these 2 almost extinct breeds. If you have a cross and you are happy with it, GREAT, but let people you sell to that since you have a cross, the next generation may be a different shape, size and egg production, as only pure Heritage turkeys will hatch true to their breed. Sounds like most people are selling cross breeds and representing them as a pure breed! Too much dishonest breeders !

Celie, how much do your grown White Hollands weigh?

 

[Arielle]

The Midget White was bred for a smaller family, as the toms should be 12# at full maturity, have a full breast and lay lots of eggs! Beltsville Small White, were also bred to be a small white turkey, but not that small! A mature tom will weigh approx. 20 pounds, but have a single breast and lay much fewer eggs. These 2 breeds have been crossed so much, most of what people call either Very Rare Variety, is in fact a cross breed mutt that will not produce the same identical birds there parents are. It is very hard to find true to breed for both types. I have secured(I think) a source for a pair or trio of each, true to breed. I am hoping to raise both breeds, keeping them separate and see if I cam help recover these 2 almost extinct breeds. If you have a cross and you are happy with it, GREAT, but let people you sell to that since you have a cross, the next generation may be a different shape, size and egg production, as only pure Heritage turkeys will hatch true to their breed. Sounds like most people are selling cross breeds and representing them as a pure breed! Too much dishonest breeders !

Go Cellie--

FInding true information seems to be difficult. So far the only info that has good reliability is the MOther Earth article because it was written by the originators of the MW.

I have been running into written comments on other threads here on BYC that says these birds were created for only experimental work. I have a few questions about that theory. WHile a smaller size is certainly valuable when research is expensive and the cost of feeding livestock is the most expensive single line item, why focus on using BBW x palm crosses for meat production. Why not have used the palm?

Karen, a literature recource guru, helped me find a slew of turkey info and studies titles, and muchis focused on the MW as a small meat bird for a small family. I wonder if the AMerican family had changed size by this point and with the availablity of the birth control pill of the 1960's was this an anticipated market?

I suspect at his point, IMO, there needs to be a marketing strategy to get turkey on the AMerican table thruout the year not just at THanksgiving to Christmas. Ironically thattime period is the cheapest pricing on whole turkey. The grocers use it to attrack buyers that also purchase a number of items that go with the bird for a big festive meal. My point is that it makes the prices during the year seem very high ( for a commercially produced bird.-- we all know the cost of feeding our own. lol)

 

[Arielle]

Bare with me as I cannot view all these on my dial up and need to access the links whan at the library.
( THese area ll coutsey of Karen)


=====================

International poultry guide for flock selection; covering the
more popular breeds and varieties of chickens and turkeys, by Loyal F. Payne and Thomas B. Avery.
by Payne, Loyal Frederick, 1889- Avery, Thomas B.
Published 1950
http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=coo.31924003127564;view=1up;seq=1

Database Name: Article Citation Database
Search Request: Keyword Anywhere = beltsville white turkey
Search Results:
Articles:
Displaying 1 through 3 of 3 entries.
http://agricola.nal.usda.gov/cgi-bin/Pwebrecon.cgi?Search_Arg=beltsville+white+turkey&DB=local&CNT=25&Search_Code=GKEY&STARTDB=AGRIDB&x=7&y=9
2 articles:
http://agricola.nal.usda.gov/cgi-bin/Pwebrecon.cgi?Search_Arg=beltsville+turkey&DB=local&CNT=25&Search_Code=GKEY&STARTDB=AGRIDB&x=11&y=15
searching: " small white turkey " , 11 articles, some Beltsville :
http://agricola.nal.usda.gov/cgi-bin/Pwebrecon.cgi?Search_Arg=small+white+turkey&DB=local&CNT=25&Search_Code=GKEY&STARTDB=AGRIDB&x=18&y=13
------------------------------
Book: "small white turkey , it's about beltsville:
http://agricola.nal.usda.gov/cgi-bin/Pwebrecon.cgi?Search_Arg=small+white+turkey&DB=local&CNT=25&Search_Code=GKEY&x=15&y=7
searching Beltsville Turkey as a "subject":
http://agricola.nal.usda.gov/cgi-bin/Pwebrecon.cgi?DB=local&CNT=20&CMD=Beltsville+and+turkey+
That archive coudl be intresting. Was Mr. Brandt of the creators of the BSWT?
Looks like these might be downloadbale. Can also order from your lcoal libarian
thru interlibrary loan. Individuduals cannot order direct from NAL.
I think there may be a lot of info in NAL since the BWT was a prodct of a USDA Lab.
================================

Snippets from around the Net. Sometimes these random phrases
have good stuff in them. Even if you can't read the whole article right away.

http://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/009175271?type%5B%5D=title&lookfor%5B%5D=%22Turkey%20topics%22&ft=
Poultry craftsman.
Previous Title:
Pacific poultrycraft and Petaluma poultryman
Turkey topics
Poultry craftsman
===================
Motion pictures of the U.S. Dept. of Agriculture
By United States. Dept. of Agriculture. Motion Picture Service
http://books.google.com/books?id=XvYy5wEho4EC&pg=PA10&dq=beltsville+maryland+agricultural+turkey&hl=en&sa=X&ei=M4mbUvzNCM35oATy_YH4BA&ved=0CFIQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q=turkey&f=false
International poultry guide for flock selection; covering the
more popular breeds and varieties of chickens and turkeys, by Loyal F. Payne and Thomas B. Avery.
by Payne, Loyal Frederick, 1889- Avery, Thomas B.
Published 1950
http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=coo.31924003127564;view=1up;seq=1
====================
Poultry, duck, guinea, geese, pigeon and pheasant raising ... - Page 73
books.google.com/books?id=zTw9AAAAYAAJ
F. W. Risher - 1955 - ‎Snippet view - ‎More editions
The Beltsville Small White turkey was developed at the U. S. D. A.
Agricultural Research Center at Beltsville, Maryland, to fill the
needs of the average family for a small family size turkey.
=============================
Reproduction studies in the turkey hen: egg formation time ... - Page vii
books.google.com/books?id=qs4vAAAAYAAJ
John Henry Wolford - 1963 - ‎Snippet view
Average daily feed consumption of Beltsville Small White (BSW) and Broad Breasted Bronce (BBB) turkey hens (21-43 weeks of age) 29 6. Experiment 2. Average daily feed consumption of Beltsville Small White (BSW) and Broad Breasted ...
============================
Turkey egg hatchability in South Dakota - Page 19
books.google.com/books?id=rksnAQAAMAAJ
F. R. Sampson, ‎W. O. Wilson - 1944 - ‎Snippet view
However, with a 25 percent soybean mash fed to Beltsville White turkeys, the hatchability was 80.80 percent. It would appear that soybean oil meal can be used as the principal source of protein in a turkey breeder mash up to 25 percent.
=========================
Practical turkey raising - Page 6
books.google.com/books?id=6wQ9AAAAYAAJ
British Columbia. Dept. of Agriculture. Poultry Branch - 1953 - ‎Snippet view - ‎More editions
Beltsville Whites. — Beltsville Whites are rapidly becoming more popular, due to the demand for a smaller turkey. They are good breeders and prolific layers. Production records of trap-nested individuals have ranged up to 211 eggs per year.
==============================
Nutrition and Feeding of Organic Poultry
By Robert Blair
http://books.google.com/books?id=9WZ9LJLoCZIC&pg=PA263&dq=beltsville+turkey+subject:%22poultry%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=_nSbUpXYMY6FoQSZ24DQBg&ved=0CCwQ6AEwADgU#v=onepage&q=%20turkey%20subject%3A%22poultry%22&f=false
=================================

 

[Arielle]

Here is info on the palm-- according to Nutrition and Feeding of Organic Poultry by RObert Blair, " the royal palm is one of the smallest turkeys. THey were develeoped as an ornamental. Ryal Palms are active and thrifty, excellent foragers and good flyers.

"Crollweitzer or pied" are other names for the palm.

Also he mentions that these were best used on farms as they do etter in small numbers because of their inherent behavor. ALso makefor good insect control.

Just including this as how it might bear on the MW.

 

[uphilljill]

Wow! You weren't kidding that Karen's a research guru.

Thx!

 

[Arielle]

Wow! You weren't kidding that Karen's a research guru.

Thx!

Yah, she is a pro on finding info on the internet!! Helps that she enjoys heritage breeds and knows how to find the old sources. Of course the copyright dates come into play-- I think the cut off date is 1905 and bothe the beltsville small and MW were developed after this date so info that is free is hard to come by.