Undecided.. appreciate opinions.

[jak2002003]

I have 5 white homing pigeons and need advice.

Had a large flock of fantails and Capuchine pigeons and flew them at my old house about 2 years ago. They were never raced.. only allowed to fly around the coop each day for exercise. Used to sell the surplus birds.

Moved into rented house for 6 months. They escaped from coop in the rented place when strong wind damaged the roof. After a few days all but one came back (had 21 birds then).

They all caught a virus which gave them neurological problem, constant head shaking, sneezing, water droppings, weight loss. Was left with only 5 white homers surviving from my 21 birds!!!!!

Moved into new house nearly one year ago and took the 5 birds with me. 2 pairs and one single male. I wanted to breed the 2 pairs a few young and then allow them to fly free.

However, no youngsters!!! One pair has produced no eggs at all. One pair has have 2 nesting attempts but all the eggs went rotten.

On bird has very watery droppings, and a couple of the others have wet sloppy droppings always. I think this is a result of kidney damage form the virus. I also suspect the virus has make them infertile.

However, they all are in great health. Very fat, sleek and spotless plumage, very active and alert, cooing and dancing etc.

Now I have my dilemma. They are housed a pair in a cage each outside behind my house. I want to let them out as I think now its cruel keeping them confined and they need to loose some weight.

Do I allow them to fly out free and risk them flying away? Or do I clip their wings and allow them to walk about the garden?

My property is predator proof.. all walled in, and no hawks. They could walk about the garden with my silkie chickens. I just wonder if clipping the wings is cruel for them. However, they can't actually fly in the cages as they are not big enough. Have enough space to flap the wings and jump about.

PS. White racing pigeon (or any racing pigeon) is very rare in my country. It took me many years to locate some and they were imported from Bangkok and shipped up the Chiang Mai where in live (in Thailand). I would prefer just to buy new birds and breed them.. but I can not locate any more... and I have been trying since I moved from the old house years ago!!!!

Thanks for any advise, opinions as what to do.

I love them like pets so don't want to give up keeping pigeons as they are so interesting for me.

 

[thinkyesi]

So sorry to hear about your birds you’ve lost.
I would suggest to not let your birds out flying till they are feeling better. Yes they need space to fly, but if you were sick would you like to go running, no right? So first get your birds to be healthy as can be. Don’t over worry about the birds trying to breed. If they are not well, they will not do a well job of sitting on the eggs. You can always incubate the eggs. Maybe build a larger run or area where they can fly a little bit in and walk around in. Let them feel relaxed and gain their full strength. Make sure to be giving them vitamins and apple cider vinegar. If you were treating the birds with a medication, note that meds can strip the birds good bacteria and bad bacteria, so that’s where apple cider vinegar comes in handy, it helps the good bacteria.
Personally I don’t like to cut the birds wings, but that’s just me. You never know if a predator finds them they won’t be able to fly away. That’s there only ‘defense’ they have is to fly away.

Also what color is the droppings, you said you think they have kidney damage? If it’s kidney damage the poop would be very yellow.

 

[LamarshFish]

I am relatively new to pigeons as of a year ago, but my personal opinion is that it is not cruel to clip wings so long as there is no scenario that the pigeons would need to fly to evade danger. If there is any risk of that, then it is my opinion that they are better left in their loft and aviary, and in those circumstances make sure they have a nice amount of room to move about.

Perhaps eventually they might have some success rearing youngsters.

 

[thinkyesi]

Also sounds like your birds may have contracted PMV, did you try giving them any medication like Baytrill?
Signs of PMV are, head shaking, twisted neck, paralysis, very green watery poop, lethargic, dehydrated and weakness. Make sure to be giving them electrolytes!

 

[jak2002003]

Also sounds like your birds may have contracted PMV, did you try giving them any medication like Baytrill?
Signs of PMV are, head shaking, twisted neck, paralysis, very green watery poop, lethargic, dehydrated and weakness. Make sure to be giving them electrolytes!

Yes I suspect they had PMV as they showed all those symptoms... they also got paralysis on their entire body a day or 2 before they died, and paralysis of the wings before that.

The droppings are clear water, with bits of brown in them. Other birds have large sloppy droppings that are mostly brow with no white in them. When they poop they shoot the water stuff out like it's fired from a hose is a large quantity. They don't have any dirty feathers around their bottoms through.

The birds otherwise are 100 percent healthy, very strong and active. Apart form the poops there would be no way to tell something was wrong with them.

Over the months I have treated with a de wormer, anti coci medication, and also 2 kinds of broad spectrum poultry antibiotics. They have had no treatment now for about 6 months.

They get mixed grains, dried peas, peanuts, pigeon grit and minerals, fresh water and are kept spotlessly clean.

The weather here in Thailand is very hot now... been up to 40 degrees this week.

Someone told me that in the heat they drink more water so that might be why the droppings are mostly clear water.

My chickens also sometimes have these same kind of droppings. (they too had anti coci medication a few months back and nothing changed).

Its no fun keeping my pigeon like this in the cages. The attraction of them to me is seeing them flying in a flock (white birds against the blue sky is beautiful).

I think I going to take the risk and let them out if I get brave enough. Our house is distinctive with a big flat white roof... so hopefully they will see that when flying. Also neighbour has some feral pigeons that hang about on his roof... so they could also see the other birds to encourage them to come back.

Maybe the exercise will help them get back to normal. Also they could free range and pick up any minerals or stuff missing from their diet to help them.

I will keep you all posted as to what happens.

 

[jak2002003]

Update.

Let them out. They flew about a bit, looked like they were settled and going to stay. After 2 hours they all took off.

Next day one male returned. Day after that another male.

Then got a phone call from new owner of old house saying a white pigeon had arrived there and gone in the old chicken coop. (its been 4 years since we lived there! and its about 8 miles away. Collected it and she is back here now.

So have 2 males and one female. The males are happy to go in and out the coop and fly freely. However, they now HATE each other and spend all of their time fighting and wrestling if let out together. So have to let them out one at a time!

Female I have clipped her wing. She is happy to stroll around the place with her mate and have a bath and sunbath on the lawn.

From the 5 birds only 2 have not come back. One of the missing birds was the one with the very liquid watery droppings. The other was the spare male who had no mate. (guess they have joined a local feral flock as there are several in the area).

My remaining birds have normal poops. But I still think the hen is infertile as she has not had eggs for about a year (after she got egg bound once).

So my next step is to get 2 fertile females.

Sadly no chance to get any more white homers. So I have 2 options.

1. Catch a couple of white pigeons from the feral flock in the park.
2. Buy a couple of white fantail pigeons.

I am thinking about number 1 is best. The birds will be the pigeon shape I like. They will be hardy. I would be 'saving' then from being culled and giving them a nice home. However, might be hard to get pure white birds and they might produce coloured offspring. Also they would not be able to be let out for a few weeks incase they flew back to the park.

Number 2 is less desirable. The shops selling the birds are filthy and keep them in poor conditions. Think high chance of bringing in a disease. Also shop not willing to sell 2 females and I don't like the look of fantails. The offspring would be white with black eyes though, but might have big tails and wrong shape to them.

 

[biophiliac]

I am following your story with interest. As you are more experienced with pigeons than I am, I don't really have any advice except to say that fantails don't sound like the right birds for you. If you can capture some white ferals that sounds like a good plan. Personally I like the colored birds that I can tell apart. lol I'm rooting for your success! Please continue the updates.

edit - Is pigeon racing not 'a thing' in Thailand? Why so hard to get homers there?

 

[biophiliac]

If homers are so rare in Thailand and there might be a market for them to you and others ... perhaps someone should import some good stock birds and start a small business?

 

[jak2002003]

If homers are so rare in Thailand and there might be a market for them to you and others ... perhaps someone should import some good stock birds and start a small business?

I did some research and there is pigeon racing in Bangkok. Not many people do it though. Seems to be a few rich people with HUGE lofts of thousands of birds. From the videos I watched all the birds seem to be mostly the blue bar or checkered colours. Could not see a single white bird or even pied bird among them. The rest of the country I can't find any pigeon racing going on.

The people here don't like keeping pigeons as pets.. even the fancy kind. The only breed I see are fantail pigeons and Old Dutch Capuchine. Here most people like to keep chickens... mostly Japanese Bantams and the large Game cocks. I spoke to the owners of the only 2 bird shops that sell pigeons. They said there was only one person breeding the Old Dutch Capuchines (and me) in the entire city. The fantail pigeons were ordered from Bangkok.. and they won't get anymore as they are finding it hard to sell them. Some of the birds been in the shops for years!!!

I know when I used to breed my old Dutch Capuchines here and also fantails, the pet shops did not want them. I stopped breeding them because I could not find a market for the young. One shop still has some of my birds form a year ago!!! Just does not seem fashionable to keep pigeons here. Not like India.. where its big business and MANY fancy breeds too at the bird markets.

Tomorrow I am off to the park so see if there are any suitable birds. You are right to say the fantails are not the right breed for me. The look beautiful, but are too docile and don't fly.

I hope to find white birds with bull eyes (black eyes) as they will be likely to produce white offspring. I remember there was one bird there last time I went with black eyes... but it had feathered legs and feet for some reason (only a very short thin covering, not muffed). But I would live with that.

There was also a pure white bird which had no feet! It was in very good condition though (it was all healed up), but it was really struggling to get to the food. Would be nice to help that one out and it would be helping me too lol.

 

[jak2002003]

Update.

I got lucky finding a female pigeon for the single male. I happened to be buying food for my birds and went into the shop next door to look at the fantail pigeons.

I saw 3 white homer X pigeons in a cage.. one male and the other 2 smaller ones females. The owner said they were my birds and one male had died. I had completely forgotten I had sold him some birds because it was so long ago. He let me have one of my females back for free! So I did not need to go catching feral pigeons or buying a pair of the fantails.

If I remember correctly the bird I got back is a cross between the white utility kings and dutch capuchine pigeons I used to keep.

She is the same size as a female homer should be but has longer wings and less stocky look (she has a long thin neck too) The homer male I am pairing her up to is very stocky and I hope the young will look more like him.

I put them together and the male was so happy to have a new girlfriend. He was really nice to her at first and she settled in straight away. But after a few hours he got a bit too aggressive with here and was pecking her a lot. So I divided the cage in half with some wire. I will let them be together in a few days when he has calmed down.

My other pair has been made a nest.. been mating a lot... but no eggs from the hen as usual. They now seem to have lost interest in breeding, and no longer sit on the nest. But hopefully, in the future I can use that pair to foster chicks from the new pair and get the numbers up quickly.

All the birds now are healthy, and all the poops are normal. Much cleaner and no smell.

Keeping my fingers crossed for the future... looking forward to having a small flock of white birds that can look beautiful flying in circles high in the sky above my house again.