*Update - Unsuccessful Spay. Anyone have experience with Suprelorin implant and/or spay? Egg yolk pe

[kculbert]

Luv, if this happens again I will take your advice and ask my vet to do some more blood work. This was all so overwhelming because it happened so quickly and Zelda appeared to be healthy. Thank you for your kind words and the support.

 

[Luvmy9hens]

Yes, it seems that when there are reproductive issues, my hens show symptoms almost immediately because they are either in pain due to excessive swelling (internal laying) or have difficulty passing the egg. I, too, learned quite a bit from this ordeal as I have never nursed a hen who had been so sick. I was taught how to check for abdominal swelling and the warning signs associated with it, how to assess the quality of droppings due to the overall content / color/ consistency and how to ensure that she was properly hydrated and nourished.

The last week had been awful as I rarely got more than a few hours of sleep. I was so afraid that Ellie was going to die overnight. I kept her in her little box right next to the bed and would wake up any time that I heard her move. I was so afraid that I was going to cause her to aspirate every time that I did a feeding. I was also afraid to give her antibiotics before leaving for work. I made sure that I gave her a dose in the middle of the night so that I could monitor her for any type of reaction. When I brought her in on Thursday May 7, she weighed 19.2 ounces. On her return visit on Monday, May 11, she was down to 16 ounces.

I will definitely keep more items on hand as a preventive measure as vet bills get steep. So far, this little gal has cost at least 800.00 but I feel that she is worth every cent. If I had to do it over, I would choose the vet over allowing her to languish in pain only to die days later. I'd rather have spent 800.00 on my hen than a meaningless trinket. Can't take it with you, right? Besides, Ellie may have 7 years ahead of her as I have had hens live to the double digits!

The full blood panel cost about 95.00 and gave the vet (and me) more insight as to what was going on internally. I am praying along with you that Big Fatty's implant is successful and that she stops laying. Is this something that gets done every 6 months or repeated if she should begin laying again?

I am trying to figure out why so many hens are having reproductive issues and am curious if the commercial feed is behind many of these disorders. When my hens free-ranged and ate NO commercial feed, there was never a problem with soft-shelled, internally laid or shell-less eggs. Since they have been confined to a run and given commercially prepared feed, I notice that there are more problems with egg quality. I have switched to Manna Pro Organic GMO free layer pellets (really crumbles) and hope that I see a difference. Your girls look as though they free range. What is their diet like?

- Marianne

 

[4xcharmd]

Awww so sorry for Zelda
You're a good chicken momma. They aren't disposable birds, they're family and friends... I totally get it.

Your girls are beautiful!

 

[kculbert]

Marianne,

Sound like you have really been through the ringer with Ellie! She sounds like a real sweetie and is so lucky to have someone like you caring for her! We kept our little silkie inside after something attacked her and she would have been a perfect house chicken but she is happier bossing around all the big girls outside and pecking the dogs.

Here is everything I can think of about my chickens:

My girls free-range in our 1/2 acre backyard. I am an organic gardener so no pesticides or chemicals, though the city sends trucks through here frequently to spray for mosquitoes. I feed them H&H non-GMO soy free layer because it's fresh milled, they like it and it looks and smells like something I would eat. They have always had access to crushed oyster shell but I rarely see them touch it. On occasion I would add Mannapro Omega Egg Maker to their feed. I hope that didn't cause any of their issues! I give them berries, boss, some scratch and mealworms as treats. I even have my own mealworm farm but sometimes supplement with Happy Hen dried mealworms. I do think I used to overfeed them treats but after Big Fatty had a health scare last year, I have cut back significantly. Casportpony was a huge help to me then. Much more so than the vet I was using at that time. Here are the links to Big Fatty's issues last year:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...loss-laying-issues-broken-egg-etc-shes-a-mess
https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/922251/black-fleshy-scab-picture

Ella, the buff orpington in the picture with Zelda in the post above, is the same age as Big Fatty and Zelda and has just started to lay some unusual eggs. It is hard to tell from the pictures but they are misshapen. Not sure if this is just a fluke or the start of something else. She is a consistent layer and has never had any health problems. I do have two other hens that want to lay in the exact spot as Ella (under the nesting boxes) and complain loudly until she's done so hopefully it's just that they are rushing her through the process. I do not supplement their lighting in winter so had very few eggs during an unseasonably dreary winter in Houston.

 

[kculbert]

Thank you for your kind words, 4xcharmd!

 

[Luvmy9hens]

I am hoping that Big Fatty continues to do well with the new implant.Your hens have are definitely eating well. Free-ranging is the best ( I miss having them loose in the yard) - and you farm your own mealworms? Those hens must worship you!

My hens also avoid the oyster shell. I have never seen them eat it as the chunks are rather large for such little hens.
I am guilty of feeding them cheese and yogurt as snacks (to boost calcium intake) but will be buying powdered bonemeal to sprinkle on their food as the vet suggested.

The mis-shapen eggs do look odd. I have never seen that before. May be just a fluke as you said. During formation, the egg may have either sped up or slowed down a bit in the process which resulted in a less than perfect egg shape. Did the yolk and albumen appear normal when it was broken open?

I wish there was an easy answer to all of this. I can't understand why so many hens are having difficulty with shell formation. I would like to investigate this more thoroughly and post my findings.

PS Ellie has not laid an egg since last week and I am hoping that she does not lay again for quite some time. I will take a picture of the twisted membrane that was excreted 6 days after the ordeal began and post later on tonight. Love your girls! They are stunning!

 

[Luvmy9hens]

This is the egg membrane that Ellie finally excreted 6 days after she laid the shell-less egg.




It is dried out now but measures 1.5 inches long. She must have been in pain as it was a partial blockage.

 

[kculbert]

Ella's eggs are perfect other than the shape.

Interesting Ellie egg picture. Big Fatty has had something like that twice but it was partially expelled and I was able to remove it. I know my husband was overjoyed to come home and find a giant chicken in the kitchen sink soaking. Both times she stopped laying for a while.

Big Fatty has been in good health, other than what I think was an accumulation of issues (molting, rubber eggs and giardia) last fall. She has always laid strange eggs, which is why I went with the implant. It should last for six months and then I will play it by ear.

Good luck with Ellie. I can tell you adore her! Please keep me updated on your findings on the egg laying issues. You have been a wealth of information for me and I love that you have had long-lived chickens. It gives me hope that I will have the rest of my girls for a while. I would love to see a picture of Ellie if you can. She sounds adorable and very special!

 

[Luvmy9hens]

Here are some pictures of Ellie while she was sick last week. My avatar is Ellie as a baby chick a few weeks old. She is VERY small. She weighs about a pound. My husband is used to seeing the chickens in the sink by now

This is how her problems began. She had not laid any eggs since last November. May 5th was her first egg since she stopped laying last fall - very small but perfectly shaped.



May 6th was a bad day for her. I came home from work and noticed that Ellie was looking a bit run down. She laid an shell-less egg in a dark corner under the kitchen cabinets some time during the day. I did not find it until after 5pm. My husband called her regular vet the next morning only to find out that she had left the practice and there were no longer any avian veterinarians on staff. Lucky for us, we found another vet about 8 miles from home. They scheduled Ellie's appointment for the next morning. I came home from work and noticed that Ellie had gotten much worse. I called the vet and scheduled an emergency visit for that afternoon (May 7th). At the time of her appointment she weighed 19.2 ounces. I knew that just as the last time, there was a membrane that had not been expelled and I was worried about the possibility of a systemic infection.

Throughout her illness, as tired and as sick as she felt, she wanted to be near us. She would walk over and fly up on our laps and settle down to sleep. In the next picture (May 8th), I had brought her into the bedroom where my husband was resting after working outside. I placed a towel on the bed before placing Ellie on the floor next to the bed. Ellie jumped up, snuggled up next to my husband (who was taking a break after working outside), and fell asleep. This day, and the next were the two most difficult days of treatment as Ellie refused both food and water. It was up to me to keep her hydrated. That meant waking up every few hours to ensure that she was getting enough nutritional support. I relied on her crop to guide me as to the volume that she was ingesting. At the time, mostly thickened liquids (baby bird formula Emer-Aid mixed with Rooster Booster).




May 9th - I expected to arrive home from work and find her dead. I kept bracing myself all day for what may have happened and tried to remain optimistic. Ellie was still refusing to either drink or eat on her own Her comb is NEVER this floppy. It was in fact, hanging over her left eye and obscuring her vision.



Sunday morning I called the vet and asked that she be seen. It was as though the antibiotics were not working and she was losing weight. The vet prescribed new medication, but the pharmacies in my area did not have it on hand. I asked that she receive a calcium booster and I would keep her on the same antibiotic. We were met at the office and Ellie was given a calcium injection. Cost - 13.00. THAT was a big surprise! Since Thursday, she had lost 1.6 ounces. I was worried as her keel was becoming a little more prominent. The big breakthrough came on Sunday evening when she took her first sip of water on her own!

On Monday Ellie returned to the vet for a checkup. She lost even more weight - another 1.6 ounces in 24 hours. Ellie had her blood taken that morning for a full blood panel. I was given 3 syringes of Cal-Nate (one to be given each day orally) until the results of her blood test came back. I was supposed to drive down to Albany (NY) that night about 3 hours away (work-related) and asked if I should take Ellie to Albany with me. It was possible being that she is so tiny and was so quiet and docile. It would be in an office setting and I would have been able to keep her close by feed her during the day as all she did was sit and sleep. The vet advised me to keep her at home in the event that emergency intervention was needed.

Ellie was fighting the feedings yet had no interest in eating on her own. I was worried that Ellie had forgotten HOW to eat solid food! She ignored her favorite foods and only nibbled at what was offered before discarding each piece on the floor. She continued to walk over to us and fly up to sit on our laps and wanted CLOSE proximity. I decided to wake up early the next morning (3am) for the 3 hour trip. In the meantime, I would show my husband how to feed and care for her while I was gone. The big breakthrough came very late that night when Ellie nibbled on a few soft spinach leaves! Since becoming sick, Ellie had completely stopped all vocalizations. As I held her before putting her in her box, I felt her her sides moving as they do when she "talks" but no sound was coming out.

I left in the morning after kissing Ellie good bye not sure if she would be there when I returned. I wanted to hold her one last time and as I did, out came the faintest of sounds. Almost like a contented purr. Now it was up to my husband to feed and medicate her as well as check up on her during the day. I was a pain in the butt constantly asking about her and how she was tolerating food, her meds, her progress...

I did not arrive home until Wednesday afternoon. As I pulled into the driveway, I noticed that my husband was not home. When we had last spoken earlier that afternoon, he told me that she was a little better than she had been. It was such a surprise when I opened the door to see her come running and "talking" a mile a minute! What a greeting! She pecked and pawed at my foot (she does this when she wants food). She looked wonderful and was back to her sassy self again! I was as happy as could be! As each day passes she continues to improve. We stopped the antibiotics after 10 days and have continued with the Cal-Nate. After one week, the Cal-nate will be administered 1x a week (more if needed).

Here are pictures of Ellie from 2013:










If Ellie's problems continue, I would like to get the implant for her as well. She has not laid an egg since this episode began last week and I want it to stay that way! I have also learned a wealth of information from you and I thank you for keeping the conversation going!

PS - I went out and bought some more organic Manna-pro layer feed. I will keep you up to date as to how she does with that.

 

[kculbert]

Ellie is BEAUTIFUL! You are lucky to have such a loving and affectionate little chicken and she is so lucky to have a mom who would do anything for her. I think both of you are lucky that you have a sweet husband who would take such good care of her while you were away. My husband would do about anything for me, our children and our dogs and cats but I'm not sure he would be that thrilled with helping with the chickens. He likes to look at them but not touch them. Of course, the closest thing we have to a loving chicken is Big Fatty and when she jumps into your lap, it like being attacked by a dinosaur.

I think it's sweet that you kiss your chicken. One of the things that has bothered me the most is that I didn't kiss or show any affection to Zelda before shoving her in a carrier on the day of her surgery. I was in such a hurry because it was pouring rain and I had a long drive in morning traffic. I guess I didn't think that she wasn't coming home because she was so healthy. I will never assume that again.

Something has changed in the flock. I'm not sure if it's because Zelda's passing has shifted the dynamic or because Big Fatty seems different. I read that the implant might cause some hens to become more docile and it seems like Big Fatty is very quiet and subdued. It could be the heat or even my imagination. They've always come running when I open the back door, begging for treats, and now I have to go looking for them. Very strange. Yesterday I was sitting on the ground holding my crazy frizzle EE, Phyllis Diller. She has been going through a hideous molt and might be coming down with dry pox too so I was giving her a once over. She was screaming in protest and Big Fatty came thundering out of the bushes and launched herself up on top of Phyllis and started ripping out her feathers. Big Fatty has always been at the top of the pecking order and Phyllis is at the bottom but I have NEVER seen anything like this. I am just hoping that the implant is not affecting her personality too much. I would still do it anyway but I hope she stays the same. It should start to wear off in about 5-6 months and that point I'll weigh out the options.

I am hoping that Ellie's story has a happy ending. She is obviously a very special girl and you are clearly trying your best to keep her healthy. It sounds like she is doing so much better and that the implant might help her once she gets her full strength back. I will keep you updated with any side effects I see in Big Fatty. It's nice to have support. I am so glad to have this forum as an outlet and to know that there are other people who really love their chickens. Let's stay in touch and please keep me updated as pretty Ellie continues to improve.

BTW...$13? That must have been a shock!