Watch out for Cedar Shavings!

[jubylives]

I've never used cedar with chicks but I do use it in my main coop with no apparent problems. I don't use it in the winter months as the coop is closed up tight but I do use it regularly in the summer.

I've only heard hersay on the dangerous of cedar chips. Cedar chips sell very fast around here so I do not believe they are as dangerous to all animals as is expressed. Of course that is only my opinion and I will continue to use cedar as I have had no problems.


jeremy

 

[Tweeza]

FYI - I once purchased a bag of pine shavings. When I got home I realized it had moisture in it, not a lot but enough that in the sun I could see condensation in the bag. Come to find out the bags had been outside and had gotten wet. I would think a bag like that could have mold growing in it and would be bad for baby chicks. I was thankful I had left the bag in the back of my pickup for quite a few hours because I might not have noticed the excess moisture. I had my first baby chicks at the time. I returned the bag for a full refund.

And I agree with Al. Why buy a book when we have ya'll. When I have a question I just search the site. I have learned so much from all of you. The wealth of information here is just amazing. I'm much more relaxed with the whole chicken raising thing.

To all the newbies out there. If you search you will get the answer to your question 10 times faster. Just about any question you might have has been answered here many times before. Searching takes out the waiting time for someone to responsed to your question. I say this because in my searching I have noticed alot of repeat questions, sometimes the same question in one week.

 

[Akane]

Cedar chips sell very fast around here so I do not believe they are as dangerous to all animals as is expressed.

Why use something if there is any risk? Animals have definitely died from cedar. Plenty have seen it first hand including myself. Plenty of vets have seen it. Just try to find a vet that advocates cedar shavings. None of the research labs will use it around their animals because of the impact to health and therefore damage to their studies. There is really tons of research and first hand accounts out there not just hearsay. Personally I think it's a dumb risk to take when you can just buy pine and be much safer for hardly any increased cost. It's not like it's the only bedding in existence with those properties. There's all sorts of safer softwood shavings and sawdust for dirt cheap that are just as absorbent. Along with dozens of other safer products that repel pests. It's pointless to risk it.​

 

[jubylives]

Quote:
Why use something if there is any risk? Animals have definitely died from cedar. Plenty have seen it first hand including myself. Plenty of vets have seen it. Just try to find a vet that advocates cedar shavings. None of the research labs will use it around their animals because of the impact to health and therefore damage to their studies. There is really tons of research and first hand accounts out there not just hearsay. Personally I think it's a dumb risk to take when you can just buy pine and be much safer for hardly any increased cost. It's not like it's the only bedding in existence with those properties. There's all sorts of safer softwood shavings and sawdust for dirt cheap that are just as absorbent. Along with dozens of other safer products that repel pests. It's pointless to risk it.

I would agree if I saw it as a risk. Which I really have no facts to make me think it is hazardous. For me, I hear pros and cons on it's use and find there to be an even split. Just as with adding heat to a coop. Same even split and I choose to add heat to my coop. To me I do not see a risk that is big enough for me to stop using cedar. Which I said I really only use during the warm months. It makes the coop more pleasnt to be in and costs the same as pine shavings. There are two sides to every issue and why not explore the other side. In this case, no real proof that it is harmful and if so I need facts and figures showing how much is too much and why. All I hear is speculation and no real facts.



Jeremy

 

[monarc23]

I'm sorry for your loss of the first batch!!!

At the worst i've used Pine bedding (which isnt no where near as bad as cedar) when i cannot find Aspen bedding.

I now use a mixture of aspen bedding and Stall Dry works wonders!

 

[luvmygirlsinAK]

Quote:
Well, we were right!!! It was an issue with ventilation/humidity. We just put a dehumidifier in the coop and what an amazing difference it makes!! No coughing, runny nose for us-and here we we thought it was the pungent smell of the pine shavings!! It might have been a combined issue, though-the humidity causing the pine shavings to give off more fumes than they should!! Wonder if this wouldn't work for cedar shavings as well, and why it would explain that some people can and do use them and others might not have enough ventilation and can't use it? Just a thought, since this was such an instant cure!!!!

 

[Bear Foot Farm]

I would agree if I saw it as a risk. Which I really have no facts to make me think it is hazardous.

http://www.kindplanet.org/scifacts.pdf


http://www.pesticideinfo.org/Detail_Chemical.jsp?Rec_Id=PC34301

Toxicity to humans, including carcinogenicity, reproductive and developmental toxicity, neurotoxicity, and acute toxicity.

Now you do​

 

[jubylives]

Quote:
http://www.kindplanet.org/scifacts.pdf


http://www.pesticideinfo.org/Detail_Chemical.jsp?Rec_Id=PC34301

Toxicity to humans, including carcinogenicity, reproductive and developmental toxicity, neurotoxicity, and acute toxicity.

Now you do​

Nope. This is not a study done on chickens. I understand that most respitory systems are similar but all critters are not made equally. I've seen nothing to convince me that it is hazardous to chickens and if so in what quantities. I understand that cedar can give off an irritant as is the reason they make chests to protect clothing out of it. Plus I do not know how the studies were implemented. Did they use a set amount of cedar in the studies or did they fit a mask stuffed with cedar shavings on the heads to see the effects.

Nothing here to convince me that this is a "risk".

jeremy

 

[Tailfeathers]

Hi Bearfoot,

I looked at the site you listed. Read the whole page. I must be missing something because there is not one single thing listed on the pesticide site that shows cedar is harmful to humans, chickens, or any other animals.

In fact, if you open this link http://www.epa.gov/oppsrrd1/REDs/factsheets/3150fact.pdf you will see this comment "natural cedar products which consist totally of cedar wood, are not combined or impregnated with other substances, and are intended only to repel arthropods other than ticks and/or to retard mildew. EPA believes it is unnecessary to regulate these products because they pose little or no risk to human health or the environment. Consumers are not likely to be exposed to significant amounts of cedarwood dust or oil, either dermally or by inhalation, when using these products. EPA is not aware of any evidence of injury to human health or the environment due to their use."

The "Kind Planet" link is simply a list of publications written by a whole bunch of people but there is no way to tell what those publications even say. Moreover, if one goes to www.kindplanet.org they will get a better idea of what the organization is about.

Here is just a small portion of their home page: "Holism is the foundation of our approach to Humane Education. Kindness and compassion will become the foundation of mankind's consciousness and will govern choices. As we evolve towards that state of awareness, we will find that all life must be honored."

I don't know about y'all but that's not exactly an organizational mission statement that would lend me to putting a whole lot of stock into anything they have to say! I didn't spend a whole lot of time on their website but from what I can see, they are just another one of those folks that think animals have all the same rights as we do.

So, with all due respect Bearfoot, neither of the sources that you listed persuade me at all that cedar shavings are harmful to birds. In fact, the EPA statement on the one site would lead me to believe just the opposite.

Taken in its natural state, used appropriately with plenty of ventilation, and I would say used in the proper amount, I still think cedar shavings are safe. Like I said before, I haven't lost a single chick or bird yet and I use them.

God Bless,

 

[luvmygirlsinAK]

Quote:
Looks like a site that worships nature, with no regards to whom we were put on this earth to worship.

The dehumidifier is still working great this morning and afternoon, no strong smells eminating from the pine shavings like there has been in the past, and no instant watering of the eyes and nose from the oils in the pine shavings!

Now we know that the whole issue of the pine shavings causing us distress was in reality just an issue of frozen ventilation areas, not allowing us to ventilate the coop enough!!

They don't call us the "frozen chozen" for nothing now, do they?!!