We have babies!

[Mixed flock enthusiast]

At work checking out the GuineaCam so thought I’d share a grainy, low-quality image…

The white blob outside the coop is Hamlet, squatting and playing the part of devoted mate and father, instead of the deranged keet killer that he recently showed himself to be. I’ve set up food and water outside the coop for him, so he spends most of the day there. The other guineas visit as well, but not very often. I think we are basically doing a “look don’t touch” method of keet integration here. My plan is to give the keets two weeks, then let them and Welch out under my supervision, to try again with Hamlet and flock acceptance outdoors…

The dark splotch in the coop is Welch, mate to Hamlet and mom to keets. Welch spends much of the day whirling and pacing the fence separating her from Hamlet. However, if I open the door and ask her if she wants to leave for a bit for a dust bath or to stretch her wings, she won’t go as the keets can’t yet get out.

The tiny dots around her in this video capture pic are the keets. They are still so tiny at 5 days old. Sometimes they go to the feeding platforms to eat and drink and watch mom nervously pace. Sometimes they try to follow her pacing. They’ve learned to be very alert when following mom, who whirls on a dime and runs over the keets if they are not sufficiently cautious. Welch seems generally pretty oblivious that the keets hang around her feet.

It’s been a long five days: I’m up at dawn to get the flock out and there at dusk to get them back in again. I’ve also just lost a relative and should be driving 10 hrs to comfort my mom at his funeral. However, I can’t imagine anyone else doing the flock management I’m doing right now, so I told my mom I didn’t think I’d make it…

 

[Sydney65]

At work checking out the GuineaCam so thought I’d share a grainy, low-quality image…

The white blob outside the coop is Hamlet, squatting and playing the part of devoted mate and father, instead of the deranged keet killer that he recently showed himself to be. I’ve set up food and water outside the coop for him, so he spends most of the day there. The other guineas visit as well, but not very often. I think we are basically doing a “look don’t touch” method of keet integration here. My plan is to give the keets two weeks, then let them and Welch out under my supervision, to try again with Hamlet and flock acceptance outdoors…

The dark splotch in the coop is Welch, mate to Hamlet and mom to keets. Welch spends much of the day whirling and pacing the fence separating her from Hamlet. However, if I open the door and ask her if she wants to leave for a bit for a dust bath or to stretch her wings, she won’t go as the keets can’t yet get out.

The tiny dots around her in this video capture pic are the keets. They are still so tiny at 5 days old. Sometimes they go to the feeding platforms to eat and drink and watch mom nervously pace. Sometimes they try to follow her pacing. They’ve learned to be very alert when following mom, who whirls on a dime and runs over the keets if they are not sufficiently cautious. Welch seems generally pretty oblivious that the keets hang around her feet.

It’s been a long five days: I’m up at dawn to get the flock out and there at dusk to get them back in again. I’ve also just lost a relative and should be driving 10 hrs to comfort my mom at his funeral. However, I can’t imagine anyone else doing the flock management I’m doing right now, so I told my mom I didn’t think I’d make it…

Hang in there. The little monsters are going on 5 weeks now. I take her out to the kennel every a.m. and leave the door open to encourage them to follow. Used to I had to go back and force them out, now they fly across the yard to where she is. Working on coaxing them to me w/millet w/o her being right there. Today they very cautiously made their way to the millet at my feet. They'd grab one then hop backwards. They've learned to scan the sky for predators and move into the kennel when they see one, rather than waiting for her to screech for them. Tonight I put her in the coop & let her call them in.

 

[Mixed flock enthusiast]

Hang in there. The little monsters are going on 5 weeks now. I take her out to the kennel every a.m. and leave the door open to encourage them to follow. Used to I had to go back and force them out, now they fly across the yard to where she is. Working on coaxing them to me w/millet w/o her being right there. Today they very cautiously made their way to the millet at my feet. They'd grab one then hop backwards. They've learned to scan the sky for predators and move into the kennel when they see one, rather than waiting for her to screech for them. Tonight I put her in the coop & let her call them in.

Awww, you have a much more orderly confusion than me! This morning when I went to kick all but Welch out of the coop, Hamlet and a few others did not want to go. Hamlet in particular really wanted to stick with Welch, which was sweet… but he’s still trying to peck the babies! Not in as much of a “I’m trying to kill you” way but like “what’s this thing scurrying around my feet - must peck!” I was trying to get behind him to herd him out without stepping on the keets under foot (total chaos) and Hamlet would focus on me and ignore keets, then notice keets and try to peck, then get distracted by me again and stop…

When the keets first hatched, Hamlet was locked in the coop with Welch who was locked down on the nest. Some keets spilled out and were walking around and he just ignored them at that point… Any ideas of what’s going on in his insane little brain??? Also, this is the third coop nest that moms have hatched in the coop, and the first time I’ve had to work so hard to protect keets.

 

[Sydney65]

Awww, you have a much more orderly confusion than me! This morning when I went to kick all but Welch out of the coop, Hamlet and a few others did not want to go. Hamlet in particular really wanted to stick with Welch, which was sweet… but he’s still trying to peck the babies! Not in as much of a “I’m trying to kill you” way but like “what’s this thing scurrying around my feet - must peck!” I was trying to get behind him to herd him out without stepping on the keets under foot (total chaos) and Hamlet would focus on me and ignore keets, then notice keets and try to peck, then get distracted by me again and stop…

When the keets first hatched, Hamlet was locked in the coop with Welch who was locked down on the nest. Some keets spilled out and were walking around and he just ignored them at that point… Any ideas of what’s going on in his insane little brain??? Also, this is the third coop nest that moms have hatched in the coop, and the first time I’ve had to work so hard to protect keets.

PJ was always a pecker, whether they were his keets or not. When I started taking Mouse & Bella out to the kennel, my boys took up posts in a triangle outside of the kennel. Blue and Nug wld watch & follow when the keets slipped between the wires & got out. PJ would thunk them on the head. They learned not to come out.
This yr when I took the keets out, there was no point using the kennel bc they went straight from my arm to the big bird that had been watching them through the patio door every day & followed him. If anyone got too rambunctious, trying to go ahead of him, they got thunked. They learned to stay behind him.
I'm sure it wasn't pleasant & they did yelp- but no blood or repetitive pecking. I never interfered w/that, as I took it as part of parenting.
I was nervous abt moving Rosie back to the coop w/hers. The only time I saw HER hesitate was the 1st time they all came out of the coop. Some went to her, some to each of the boys, all of the incubates went to the boys. The look was as if she started to protest.. & then decided to see how it went.
You know your birds to judge. I hope for you that it turns out to like mine, & that you get many opportunities to just sit & watch. For the bad rap they get regarding parenting, mine could probably have taught some humans a few lessons, except that whole run to the cornfield when it rains thing.

 

[Mixed flock enthusiast]

PJ was always a pecker, whether they were his keets or not. When I started taking Mouse & Bella out to the kennel, my boys took up posts in a triangle outside of the kennel. Blue and Nug wld watch & follow when the keets slipped between the wires & got out. PJ would thunk them on the head. They learned not to come out.
This yr when I took the keets out, there was no point using the kennel bc they went straight from my arm to the big bird that had been watching them through the patio door every day & followed him. If anyone got too rambunctious, trying to go ahead of him, they got thunked. They learned to stay behind him.
I'm sure it wasn't pleasant & they did yelp- but no blood or repetitive pecking. I never interfered w/that, as I took it as part of parenting.
I was nervous abt moving Rosie back to the coop w/hers. The only time I saw HER hesitate was the 1st time they all came out of the coop. Some went to her, some to each of the boys, all of the incubates went to the boys. The look was as if she started to protest.. & then decided to see how it went.
You know your birds to judge. I hope for you that it turns out to like mine, & that you get many opportunities to just sit & watch. For the bad rap they get regarding parenting, mine could probably have taught some humans a few lessons, except that whole run to the cornfield when it rains thing.

It’s just strikes me as such odd behavior from this cock to act so interested in and devoted to his nesting hen and then to peck and kill the keets! I’m just continuing on with the “look do t touch” approach for awhile, but it’s going to be a pain if I have to get after him to get out every morning! The worst injured keet is doing ok at least. I ended up tying its legs together as I do for spraddle leg. It’s in with the brooder keets that I need to sell. I have an interested buyer, but I feel like I need to get the injured keet over the hump before selling, and I can’t see returning it to mom when it doesn’t walk amd run normally!

 

[Sydney65]

It’s just strikes me as such odd behavior from this cock to act so interested in and devoted to his nesting hen and then to peck and kill the keets! I’m just continuing on with the “look do t touch” approach for awhile, but it’s going to be a pain if I have to get after him to get out every morning! The worst injured keet is doing ok at least. I ended up tying its legs together as I do for spraddle leg. It’s in with the brooder keets that I need to sell. I have an interested buyer, but I feel like I need to get the injured keet over the hump before selling, and I can’t see returning it to mom when it doesn’t

Well, @R2elk always says isolate the bully.. But this has left me wondering lots of things with no way of finding answers.
Does a bird's age affect maturity? All of mine were 3, & as described, worked together w/keets.
Was the attack focused on these 2 specific birds or random? Research does indicate they will single out ill or weaker birds bc they're seen as a threat to the wellbeing of the flock
You mentioned moving eggs around, so some or none of the keets are(n't) theirs? That made me wonder if he cld somehow know they weren't his/theirs. It's not by smell though, bc they have lousy sense of smell. Their strengths are site & hearing.
Some birds recognize and cast off cowbird eggs, ostrich routinely deposit one egg in someone else's nest even though they have a nest- and the receiver will move that egg to the edge of the nest. Chicken mamas swear hens know a quitter & get rid of it, & I read other birds likewise will move a suspect egg to the bottom of the pile.
or, Hamlet is a jealous bully.

 

[Sydney65]

Well, @R2elk always says isolate the bully.. But this has left me wondering lots of things with no way of finding answers.
Does a bird's age affect maturity? All of mine were 3, & as described, worked together w/keets.
Was the attack focused on these 2 specific birds or random? Research does indicate they will single out ill or weaker birds bc they're seen as a threat to the wellbeing of the flock
You mentioned moving eggs around, so some or none of the keets are(n't) theirs? That made me wonder if he cld somehow know they weren't his/theirs. It's not by smell though, bc they have lousy sense of smell. Their strengths are site & hearing.
Some birds recognize and cast off cowbird eggs, ostrich routinely deposit one egg in someone else's nest even though they have a nest- and the receiver will move that egg to the edge of the nest. Chicken mamas swear hens know a quitter & get rid of it, & I read other birds likewise will move a suspect egg to the bottom of the pile.
or, Hamlet is a jealous bully.

@R2elk hopefully you're laughing at the jealous bully part, bc I'm interested in your opinion.

 

[R2elk]

@R2elk hopefully you're laughing at the jealous bully part, bc I'm interested in your opinion.

I was laughing at the part about whether the offspring were theirs or not. I seriously doubt that this thought enters their minds.

Who knows what goes on in a guinea's mind? I try not to anthropomorphize them. I do know that their attitudes do change with age and other conditions.

It definitely does help more to isolate a bully rather than the one being picked on.

 

[Sydney65]

Rosie shunned the twins the second she returned to the coop, and they moved in at the same time. They were 2 wks older but standard to her jumbo, so the size diff has never been great. Hers are growing so fast that some are the same size now, and they all look alike. If she was dumb, you'd expect her to think they were one of the 3 that died.After the storm, the remaining one became the only help she has with her brood. It lets them climb on it, cuddle next to it it, helps keep them rounded up- and still she chases it from the food, out of the coop and pecks it if it gets close to her.- that's not fanciful, that's an accurate relay of what I see every day.
But that's the female. The flaw in the idea is how he would know the difference. They rely on their eyesight and hearing, & birds recognize each other by voice. But unless he's smart enough to know the coloring is genetically off, did a DNA test, or could hear the keets in the egg, how would he know?
NOW I'm being fanciful.
She's probably going stroll in here around 1230 or 0100 and make this moot by saying they were their eggs. But if they weren't, mb that's why she isn't protective?

 

[Mixed flock enthusiast]

Well, @R2elk always says isolate the bully.. But this has left me wondering lots of things with no way of finding answers.
Does a bird's age affect maturity? All of mine were 3, & as described, worked together w/keets.
Was the attack focused on these 2 specific birds or random? Research does indicate they will single out ill or weaker birds bc they're seen as a threat to the wellbeing of the flock
You mentioned moving eggs around, so some or none of the keets are(n't) theirs? That made me wonder if he cld somehow know they weren't his/theirs. It's not by smell though, bc they have lousy sense of smell. Their strengths are site & hearing.
Some birds recognize and cast off cowbird eggs, ostrich routinely deposit one egg in someone else's nest even though they have a nest- and the receiver will move that egg to the edge of the nest. Chicken mamas swear hens know a quitter & get rid of it, & I read other birds likewise will move a suspect egg to the bottom of the pile.
or, Hamlet is a jealous bully.

Thanks for all of the thought you put into this, Sydney! I’m going to bed but will ponder tomorrow…

Hamlet is young (1 yr) and was hatched by Welch last year. I had another cock that was one year old that was much better with the keets though (he ignored them), my first year breeding them.

These are not their keets, but I just can’t believe they know or care. Welch was mostly sitting on another hen’s eggs anyway, and after they hatched I could see that probably three hens had contributed to their nest, which is typical of my community nests. When I replaced the eggs, Welch seemed perfectly happy to sit on the new eggs and Hamlet had, at that point, taken up with another hen! Plus, last year, Welch’s keets, Hamlet included, were also not her own (more swapped eggs).

I wasn’t there so I can’t swear that it was even Hamlet that killed/injured the keets. However, all signs point to him. He still seems pretty stabby with whatever keets are under foot. Have you seen a parrot that is thinking about biting you? Their eyes kind of whirl and dilate as they focus intently on you. Today, that’s what Hamlet reminded me of. He would focus on a keet underfoot and become very intent and focused; I could tell he was about to peck it and saw him peck several keets (semi-rough). So I’d make noise or distract him while I was trying to separate them. It’s like he’d “wake up” and lose his focus on the keet to pay attention to me. Then he’d look like his usual, slightly spacey self and look around the coop for a moment. Then he’d see a keet underfoot again, and once again get that focused deadly look. It was weird and unnerving. Hamlet has been one of my favorite birds for awhile, so I’m pretty disappointed in him (anthropomorphizing, I know!)