What exactly does breed for resistance mean?

[kathyinmo]

Quote:
I agree also. I would not keep a sick bird period. Injury is different, but no sick birds .... resistance or not, I do NOT want sick birds! I will, however, treat for worms, cocci, and parasites. I don't see these as diseases or weaknesses to cull for.

I am still learning, and I appreciate everyone's advice and insight on the subject.

 

[gogoalie]

Quote:
Gee, I think I realize that...that's why I suggested, just like a good scientist would do, would be to quartine the sick birds...plus, keep their progeny away from the healthy flock, to see if the pathogen was passed on or not...once you realize that the pathogen HASN'T been passed onto the progeny, then you have yourself a stronger bird, period, not only that, you could also test the progeny for the pathogen to ensure that it hasn't been passed on, this will nullify any fears of pathogen passed to progeny. & no one suggested to Kathy (the OP if I am not mistaken) to sell these birds, she's looking into whether or not she should immunize or not. If she's looking NOT to immunize, then she needs to quarntine her birds

 

[lildinkem]

Many birds can test positive for MG BUT may never show symptoms. And to transmit the disease can only be done by a symptomatic bird or thru the egg. There you can have a bird as a carrier, he/she may never get sick. You still have a bird with MG and you can still infect your flock thru breeding and others by selling them eggs. And those offspring may never show the symptoms either. You MAY think you have one healthy flock, which they are since they never show any symptoms. That is resistance. And I do not hear anyone else saying here they send eggs to Purdue to find out they do not in fact have MG. Then you all only THINK your birds are clean and healthy. Without testing, we are just hypothocating our birds are clean and free of disease. Which is like me saying my birds do not get sick cause they have resistance, not that they do not carry disease. So we cull for our largest, biggest and appearing to be the healthiest birds, cause they have the strength to win over disease, not cause they do not carry disease. That is what I call breeding for resistance.
For those who buy either birds or eggs from another breeder. You will get everything that breeder has in his flock. That is the trade off for buying outside your flock. So, unless I really want someone's else's goods, I don't buy everything out there I may want. I am fully aware of the risk associated with this question.
Which reminds me a classic sayin from Ernest T Bass sayin, "you ask me no questions, I'll tell you no lies".
Purdue will do the MG test for FREE!! Just ship them your eggs IF you think your flock is healthy they will tell you within 2 weeks.

 

[kathyinmo]

Quote:
No, you're missing an important point. When they get sick they're not allowed to "recover or die", they're culled. Even if they were to recover they'd still be genetically predisposed to the particular disease. Obviously other birds in the flock would also have been exposed to the particular pathogen. The ones that don't get sick are the ones you keep to breed from.

Obviously all the birds in a flock are exposed (if you have a disease). This makes the most sense to me .... the ones that don't get sick are the ones to breed from. Why leave sick ones in with the rest?

 

[fowlman01]

Quote:
I have done it this way for years. Fred had the right idea, so did most other old school poultry people. I hardly ever have a bird die unless it is a predator, old age or a car hits it.
If you use the hatchet early on you have birds that are petty resistant to most things.

Walt Leonard

 

[halo]

There are some serious issues going on with Marans. I know of several breeders that have had MG thru their flocks, and are diligently treating with a new antibiotic. It is not new, its been going on for several years now. I wonder if its not from inbreeding, but thats another issue. I had gotten some chicks last year that were not ill, and were growing them out. They all eventually started getting sick after being with me for over a month; I could hear wheezing, and I killed all of them. I was terrified it would go thru the flock, but not a single rock, Ameraucana, or my other stronger Marans (thanks, Katy) got sick. With the Marans being so popular, and pricey, it seems the general modus operendi is to treat treat treat, which to me is a HUGE mistake. I think the breed will suffer for it.

 

[halo]

Quote:
This is the procedure the Marans breeders are using now, the monthly Tylosin. Which is exactly why Im breeding my own birds and not getting any outside sources for now. My egg color may suffer for a while, but I refuse to be a slave to this type procedure.

 

[kathyinmo]

Quote:
This is the procedure the Marans breeders are using now, the monthly Tylosin. Which is exactly why Im breeding my own birds and not getting any outside sources for now. My egg color may suffer for a while, but I refuse to be a slave to this type procedure.

Wait a minute ..... are you saying you have to do this EVERY month? Forever? Then that would mean you can not even eat the eggs, correct? Isn't there a withdrawal time (like 2 weeks?) for antibiotics? If I am interpreting this correctly ..... I really do not see the use in doing this.

 

[()relics]

Quote:
No, you're missing an important point. When they get sick they're not allowed to "recover or die", they're culled. Even if they were to recover they'd still be genetically predisposed to the particular disease. Obviously other birds in the flock would also have been exposed to the particular pathogen. The ones that don't get sick are the ones you keep to breed from.

BINGO....If a bird show any sign of the disease/worm/parasite/infection it is culled. Other birds that exsist it the same enviroment may be dealing with the disease/worm/parasite/infection but they are fighting it "in their own way" but show no apparent symptoms of the "inner battle". These are the birds that you would want to use as your breeding foundation. Potenetially they may have some "genetic sequence" or natural immunity which, you as the breeder want to propogate. There may be nothing special about any particular bird but then again There May Be...Unfortunately this pratice isn't followed by the majority of breeders, all species included. The breeder doesn't want to absorb the cost of losing too many birds so they "over madicate" to hide the symptoms, and selling them or breeding them. Thus inheritantly weakening future birds. Building a foundation stock that is prone towards disease resistence doesn't happen overnight. It requires years of breeding and raising healthy birds and heavy culling....You could almost compare the culling method to culling for a show quality bird....Again foundation stock is important, start with junk end with junk....Start with birds from an SQ program cull, to meet the standards, and you have an SQ line....Start with birds from a Line that is prone to be disease resistant, cull birds that don't seem to be AS resistant , and you have a line that is prone to disease resistance...If you look at other species you will soon see that Purebreed/Fullblood Show Quality animals are not, in most cases, the Most Disease Resistant Animals...Breeders consentrate on SQ animals and then MEDICATE to compensate.....

Just to add...everyone would like to have every one of their birds genetically profiled...BUT due to cost reason, Responsible Breeders breeding for a certain trait must rely on the APPARENT absence or presence of the trait we WANT....So we genetically profile by common sense not scientific proof....IMO

 

[snowbird]

This is for everyone that is preaching no medication and no vaccinating. How many birds on average do you raise on any given year. Number of fowl has a bearing on flock health.