what would happen.... ?

[babylady4]

The problem is that WE have allowed ourselves to either 1. Be purchased by foreign countries or 2. Shipped our business abroad. How many American companies are left that still manufacture their goods here in the US and do it well? We have allowed the incentives to move business out become to great a carrot to ignore; and we have allowed the import of goods to supercede the goods that are produced here. Basically we are shooting ourselves in the foot.

I am not saying we should become isolationists, but we should butt out and let people settle their problems without us. This country did attempt a 'watch and see' apporach during WWII (as Dave mentioned France did during the Revolutionary War), but we were attacked anyway for distantly supporting the 'other side'. I do not see how in this day and age we can be 'slightly' involved in events. Either we are involved or we are not. Observe and learn, but let the 'children' settle their aguments themselves.

BTW Just making analogies here, not trying to offend.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I don't see any offense in any of this thread, just a polite discussion.

The problem is that WE have allowed ourselves to either 1. Be purchased by foreign countries

To me our national debt and our balance of payments is extremely disturbing. I believe in being self-sufficient and we are not. When I retired I stopped eating out as much, reduced my travel, and,in general, changed my lifestyle because I could no longer afford my old one. I don't see the will in our country to live within our means. I don't want to turn this into a health care debate. I could use another topic, but I want an example to make my point. Does everyone deserve a certain degree of health care? I think yes. What degree of health care are we willing to pay for and what major changes to the current system are we willing to make? That is the hard part. I do not blame any country that has purchased us. We have offered the bonds and treasury notes they have purchsed to maintain our system of living. (Maybe a better use of words that standard of living).

or 2. Shipped our business abroad.

When I worked in Nigeria (and it has only been a few years) I could hire a person to do hard physical labor for a month for $50 US. In Kazahkstan, the cost was about $200 US a month. And people would line up for those jobs. We actually paid more but you can't go too much higher than prevailing wage without causing political unrest. It gets pretty complicated pretty quickly when you leave theory behind and deal with the actual consequences of what you do. Anyway, I digress. At those wages I'd ship jobs overseas also, especially if the raw products are there. It is almost always more efficient to ship the finished product than it is to ship raw materials. And, as slow as it is happening and with all the local difficulties, at these wages we are improving the local lifestyle, helping educate the population, and creating new markets for our goods and services. The process is slow and people don't like us because the process is slow, but I've noticed a lot of people in this country into instant gratification also. Besides, in how many communities can you actually build a heavy manufacturing plant here in the US? Everyone wants the jobs and the tax base, but Not In My Back Yard. (I'm also a NIMBY.)

 

[babylady4]

But what is the cost of living in those countries? What kind of heavy manufacturing plant are you talking about? There are many foundries and manufacturing plants that do very well here; and as long as all EPA and DNR standards are met there are no complaints. Do the same companies in those countries have the same EPA requirements?

I think in this current economy people who need jobs would not care what is being made in their back yard as long as people had jobs. I think the people in Janesville would LOVE to have any kind of manufacturing facility open up.

Our manufacturing industry is open to foreign takeover due to the incentives offered. There should be a level playing field when a company is available for purchase and as things stand the breaks are given to others and not the citizens of this country. I say that we have allowed ourselves to be purchased due to these conditions. As things stand here, my DH works for Germany and I work for Canada.

 

[Ridgerunner]

But what is the cost of living in those countries?

Excellent point. It is very low. So is what we would call quality of life. Both are rising as jobs, money, and education come in, but it is a slow process. You have a lot of inertia to overcome.

What kind of heavy manufacturing plant are you talking about?

The obvious ones are the smelters, refineries, power plants, land fills, and, in the news here, a quarry. The less obvious ones are the ones that are going to increase traffic and conjestion, reduce property values, or change the character of the neighborhood. An auto assembly plant was one that raised a lot of controversy near my former home. It does depend on what the facility actually is, but I am specifically thinking the really big ones that do change the neighborhood.

There are many foundries and manufacturing plants that do very well here; and as long as all EPA and DNR standards are met there are no complaints.

I respectfully disagree. I will concede that many plants have certain conditions grandfathered in so they don't have to meet current standards which can generate complaints, but I firmly believe any new foundry and many manufacturing plants would meet local opposition.

Do the same companies in those countries have the same EPA requirements?

Surprisingly, it varies quite a bit. In some places, there are very few regulations and enforcement is pretty much nonexistent. In others, they copy our laws and regulations. And I mean they literally copy ours or, often, other developed countries that are as stringent or even more so than ours, such as Great Britain.

I think in this current economy people who need jobs would not care what is being made in their back yard as long as people had jobs. I think the people in Janesville would LOVE to have any kind of manufacturing facility open up.

I cannot speak for the people of Janesville. My understanding is based on what I have read in the newspapers mainly, especially local newspapers wherever I've been. I'm afraid this is one that we will have to respectively disagree about in general, although not in Janesville.

Our manufacturing industry is open to foreign takeover due to the incentives offered. There should be a level playing field when a company is available for purchase and as things stand the breaks are given to others and not the citizens of this country. I say that we have allowed ourselves to be purchased due to these conditions. As things stand here, my DH works for Germany and I work for Canada.

I'm not aware of these incentives that create an uneven playing field so I cannot comment.

Boyd, I hope you don't mind that we have sort of hijacked your thread. Hopefully this still sort of pertains to your intended topic.

 

[rancher hicks]

I just love when people say "We". We doesn't include me, cause "me" don't agree with what some politicians do. Some here seem to think they have the answers but they don't the power to implement them. Further (mods I won't say anymore) it has more to do with religion than finance.

 

[Reinbeau]

Speaking as a person and not as a mod I have to say I disagree, it's all about the money, making money, and keeping the bulk of the wealth by the most powerful and richest.

 

[redhen]

Quote:
i agree..

 

[TM Chickens]

Quote:

 

[Nikki28]

Quote:
i agree..

That's become abundantly clear.
Check out the Bilderbergs

I meant to say I agree with ReinBeau statement but somehow was drawn to quote RedHen's comment.
Edited because post was mistaken by someone who doesn't understand David Bowie

 

[redhen]

Quote:
i agree..

That's become abundantly clear.

Nasty Bowie fan!

I meant i agreed with what ReinBeau said...