Why compost ?!?

[TOP KNOT]

I'm starting to build a container to use as my compost box to put inside my chicken run. I'm breaking down an old pine crate to reuse for the container. Do you guys know if that's ok to compost with a pine box and use pine shavings in the compost??

My neighbor farms, and he told me he would not spread horse manure with pine shavings in it. (used in stall bedding) He says the pine takes the nitrogen out of the soil and then they have to add it in another way. Plain horse manure is just fine. I never knew this. I compost EVERYTHING It eventually breaks down. I have the horse manure pile and kitchen compost goes there too. I have since bedded with straw, which is good compost. I have two piles, one is old, its like fresh dirt. The other is getting there.

 

[wyoDreamer]

When wood breaks down (composts) it pulls nitrogen from the other components (the green stuff) in the compost pile since it is mainly made of carbon. That is why you use a mix of green and brown ingredients in a compost pile. The organisms that compost require carbon and nitrogen to do their work. Not enough brown (carbon) and the green stuff just gets slimey and stinky.

The farmer is right - the decompostion of the pine shavings will pull the nitrogen out of the soil and actually ties it up. Farmers want alot of free nitrogen available for the crops to take up. The nitrogen is still there, and wood is a great way to tie up excess nitrogen and release the nitrogen back to the environment slowly so it doesn't wash through the soil too fast, but this is not what a farmer wants for good fast crop growth.

 

[lazy gardener]

You want to keep in mind that the minimum size for a compost pile to really cook is 3' x 3' x 3'. Shavings will eventually break down, especially if mixed with a high nitrogen source like chicken manure. (Thus all the folks talking about doing deep litter in their coops) If you want to use shavings, in addition to chicken manure, you can give a big boost of nitrogen to help balance the carbon of the shavings add some urea, or very high nitrogen fertilizer. If you go this route, don't let your chickens in the compost as the high nitrogen would probably not be good for them, (though, when the compost is cooked, it'll be fine.)

 

[bluebirdnanny]

I do not compost meat or fats because of the bears in the area here as well as other wildlife. Don't want to draw them into any vicinity near the chickens.

If you care to make things go faster you can chop everything before composting.

I used to live in the suburbs and my neighbor never had any complaints about my compost. But then I turned it back then and used cheap can of beer (I don't drink it though) as a compost activator over each layer as I built it. They had a pool and entertained quite often. She said they never smelled it.

 

[Dreyadin]

Why compost... because it is one of the best amendments you can add to your garden. It makes soil more friable, acts as a slow release fertilizer, retains nutrients, improves drainage, retains moisture, helps balance soil ph, etc. You could go out and buy topsoil, fertilizers, composts, etc. etc. but it's not something you do once and are done forever.

Gardens are a work in progress. You can (in some areas) keep planting over and over and get decent crops- but you're essentially strip mining the nutrients out. It only works for so long and then it starts to show- lower yields, lower resistence to pests/diseases, less vigor, etc.

If you have clay soils (a very fine particulate)- to break it up & add drainage, you add compost. If you have sandy soils (very large grains)- to retain moisture & nutrients, you add compost.

Compost has different sized particulates which helps water drain through the soil, yet it can hold almost it's weight in water too. It creates bigger pockets of air- many plants roots also need air- but it also makes it easier for the plant to set a bigger root system.

In a garden you are looking to build humus (when you think of good soil.. dark, fluffy, friable-able to break apart easily, rich... that's due to humus content- which is made up from decomposed materials.) Variety of materials added to the compost then offers more balance in nutrients.

Things you shouldn't add...

meat & fats & dairy- different microbes & bugs break that down- but a big thing is it attracts a lot of unwanted critters too (crazy exceptions for some things like Pawpaws- where rotting carcasses can be used to attract flies that pollinate their stinky flowers. Or used in Black Soldier fly composting- which if you are looking for a chicken feed suppliment, this may be something to consider.)

use caution adding salty foods

carnivore feces... yes, some diseases like e. coli & salmonella are an issue (with manures in general- which is why timing & composting of these materials need to be handled with a bit more care).. but also parasites and carnivore feces tends to be higher in heavy metals just due to their diet. (manures in general should be well composted- and keep an eye out for some things like medications as they can also have heavy metals. Application timing also is very important.)

diseased plants- the last thing you want to do is give it a free place to hang out and then a ride to a new location. Identify what disease is nailing your plants (if you have an extension office nearby, they often can help if you aren't sure.) Potatoes for one can be a pain. I know some like to just cut up some from the store- but- keep in mind they build up viruses over time that impact yield & health... and some plant diseases can take many many years to starve out of the soil.

No creosote.. wood ashes are fine.. but avoid any of the gunk in the flue which is carcinogenic. (has heavy metals, arsenic, etc.)


~~~~~ From the land of TMI.... ~~~~~~
Many soil amendments are actually made from byproducts from other industries. Bone meal & blood meal.. usually from pigs (it's heated, dried, and pulverized.) Feather meal- by product of poultry processing, feathers are boiled, heat dried, and then pulverized. Fish emulsion.. guts, bones, scales, bycatch fish, etc. are ground up, water added, fermented, heated, bottled up for sale. (Kinda funny when you realize you actually end up paying more for rotted fish guts than you do for the fish fillets.) Municipal biosolids. Yep... processed people poo- found in some bags of compost that sometimes are brazen enough to slap on "organic" and up the price too. (Compost is *not* regulated- so "organic" means carbon based materials.. nothing more.) Shredded wood filler- also added to some bagged compost- great stuff if your goal is sickly looking plants. Mushroom compost.. should be more accurately called *spent* mushroom compost, this is the soil medium after it has been used to grow mushrooms (it's not bad.. it's just not much nitrogen left, but it will add loft to soil and a few trace elements.)

I guess that would be another reason... lol.. I think it is weird to pay someone else to take compostable materials away only to then buy someone else's waste.

 

[Earl-Ray]

any food waste. just dont water it with chlorine water. i accidentally found out about composting. short version:
i grow chile pequin peppers. i bought a bunch of beans and brown rice once with extra money i fell into. got bugs in beans and rice. mulched pepper garden with rice layer then beans. then for a week and a half afterwards it rained everyday. i pulled bean sprouts and layed on top. beans and rice formed a crust. if broke crust steam came out just like mushroom compost "steams" . i planted pepper plants far enough they wouldnt touch... now they grew into one single bush like hedges do, several plants but pleached together. chlorine kills good bacteria. also is good to add fresh mushroom compost or manure compost for the good bacteria to get it kicked off. red wiggler worms also do wonders. google vermicomposting to learn more about worm castings which is by m,y experience, hands down the best compost for plants period. have fun.

 

[Earl-Ray]

i know this thread is a little out of date and i already posted but i got to thinking about this thread and it kept buggin me so i had to return to add more that will hopefully help someone out. it helped me.
essentially composting or making a composting pile/bin/however you do it, is nothing more than growing bacteria. bacteria is a life form and all life needs FOOD and WATER. and in everything there is a happy medium, to much or to little is bad. Bacteria is what breaks down food waste into compost. I live in texas and a couple years back we had a awful drought that led to many wildfires. it was during this time people scrambled to find an answer.(me too) the answer was found in north africa where every year they have four months like our one month of august, super hot and no rain. there they have no stores. their gardening isnt a hobby, its a survival tactic. this tactic has been commercialized here in the states and is called "keyhole gardening". what these african people do is put sticks in the ground verticaly making a circle, next they make a hill around these sticks(6-10 foot or so) and they shade the mound. they throw all their food waste and probably add manure as well down into this hole. they water the hole everyday, with non chlorine water. this water and food combo kicks it off. they say only water the plants during extreme drought as to make the plants roots dive deep after the water and nutrients. this keyhole gardening is what taught me about bacteria but the info can be utilized in countless methods.
this bacteria likes it damp but not drenched. very similar to what worms like. depending on where you are in the world worms may just show up in your compost pile. i get them big fat white worms every spring. i get so many worms when you walk up they feel vibrations and get quiet. wait n be still and you can hear them chewing, sounds like something out of a sci fi movie. worms are a good sign because they eat this good bacteria i am talking about. if your gonna buy some worms to throw in dont get nightcrawlers, get red wigglers. you dont have to tho. two good tips is never remove all your compost, leave a bit so that bacteria is there still and you dont have to start over. and never use any animal waste (meat fat etc) animal waste has tendency to culture bad bacteria which kills good bacteria. oh yeah, one bad bacteria that is in compost piles is staph. if i spelled that right. you get a cut and it makes you swell up. always wash up real good after.
what i add to my pile is: coffee n tea grounds, any plant waste i.e. fruit n veggie, crushed and dried egg shells, rabbit/chicken/horse/cow manure, and mushroom compost. i have a mushroom plant not to far from me so i get the good mushroom compost.
here is a link to the keyhole gardening if you are interested:
http://www.texascooppower.com/texas-stories/nature-outdoors/keyhole-gardening

 

[Dreyadin]

Earl-Ray.. you might find "greening of the desert" by Geoff Lawton interesting. Permaculture desert design.

 

[Earl-Ray]

Earl-Ray.. you might find "greening of the desert" by Geoff Lawton interesting. Permaculture desert design.

that does sound interesting. from my understanding most deserts soil is dormant and cannot release its nutrients and is void of bacteria. thanks Dreyadin, i will give it a looksee.

 

[Dreyadin]

Arid locations are a challenge.. the soil is more alkaline and it starts locking up nutrients. Or when the rain finally does fall- the soil has become hydrophobic- everything just runs off and doesn't get a chance to soak up. Frustrating, isn't it?

There are some ancient agriculture designs (particularly in arid locations) that used land contouring. The same concept works in the backyard garden. It can be as simple as sinking your plants in (where as in wetter areas you could use the opposite- hilling up to help with drainage.) Makes what watering you do more effective to as it stays around the plant- and mulch slows the evaporation.

A lot of those techniques for growing in dry zones are helpful in places that get more water but don't have means of irrigation.

Geoff Lawton.. really rather amazing. I mean I get liking a challenge... but wow... what they are contending with is just.. wow. Compacted, life-less soil, scorching summers, a location that gets less than 6 inches of rain a year- and as if that wasn't enough - the ground is salty too!