Wood Shavings -- Please Help: Cedar is Bad?, Aspen is Good? and Pine Appears to Have Conflicting Info

[Rob and Sheila]

I have seen conflicting information on the use of Pine Shavings in a Chicken coop and more importantly, for the cardboard box my 9 chicks are in. Please help me clear up this confusion. I have seen Pine listed as preferred shavings in a coop and for use with my new chicks. However, I have also seen the opposite. The following is an example:

Why are pine shavings unsafe for your chickens? Pine bedding is unsafe for chickens due to the damaging effects of abietic acid on the respiratory system, the damaging effects of terpene hydrocarbons and aromatic compounds on liver function, and the carcinogenic nature of pine dust.

I've heard/seen where others have used Pine for up-teen years without problems. I also know a guy who's uncle smoked until he was 83 without issue.... I was hoping to get the specific data so my wife and I can make that decision based on that. Same with Aspen - Good?, Bad?... The specific why/why not data would be great to know.

I have also seen that Cedar is also bad. What about Aspen Shavings? Most data indicates Aspen is Good for chicks/chickens - but that shredded paper is best for chicks. Is this accurate? I haven't seen Aspen Shavings for sale. Are they hard to find? Any idea where I can get them on a recurring basis? Southern States and Tractor Supply don't seem to have them.

Very Respectfully,

[email protected]

 

[5 Points Wingfeather]

I always use pine and I have never had a problem. There are no guarantees you won’t ever have a problem but that goes with anything. Tons of people on here use pine shavings.

 

[rosemarythyme]

Aspen is preferable (for me) vs pine as it usually comes in bigger flakes (so less likely for chicks to eat) and has less odor/aroma than pine. It does cost more though. Big box pet stores should carry it in the rodent section.

Cedar shavings should not be used as they're usually more aromatic than the other two. I do use aged Western cedar chips in my coop and run, which have lost nearly all their aroma and aren't nearly as potent to begin with as the Eastern Red cedar which is used for things like hope chest linings.

I don't have shredded paper to use/compare - probably wouldn't work in my brooder as I brood outdoors on the ground, with ample moisture in the environment.

 

[3KillerBs]

Eastern Red Cedar is a respiratory irritant and shouldn't be used.

Pine is perfectly fine. If it weren't the commercial chicken farmers, whose livelihood depends on their chickens being in optimal health for rapid growth, wouldn't be using it.

People trying to convince you that pine is bad are usually trying to sell you an alternative -- generally a much more expensive alternative.

Tractor Supply carries large flake and fine flake pine shavings. I buy large flake, especially when I have chicks.

 

[BlindLemonChicken]

What @3KillerBs said. I have rarely seen people claim pine shavings are dangerous without advertising an alternative. Chicks will try to eat pine shavings if they're small shavings but most of them figure out they are food pretty quick. Larger shavings solve that problem. As others have said, I have been using pine shavings for years to raise chicks for myself and others and never had a problem.

 

[TooCheep]

Never seen any problems with pine and I use them all the time. Agree with the others that you should only use larger flakes.

Cedar is the only one to worry about with the aromatic oils.

 

[saysfaa]

I have seen conflicting information on the use of Pine Shavings... I also know a guy who's uncle smoked until he was 83 without issue.... I was hoping to get the specific data so my wife and I can make that decision based on that. Same with Aspen - Good?, Bad?... The specific why/why not data would be great to know.

I have also seen that Cedar is also bad. What about Aspen Shavings? Most data indicates Aspen is Good for chicks/chickens - but that shredded paper is best for chicks. Is this accurate? I haven't seen Aspen Shavings for sale. Are they hard to find? Any idea where I can get them on a recurring basis? Southern States and Tractor Supply don't seem to have them....

“All things are poisons and there is nothing that is harmless, the dose alone decides that something is no poison” -Paracelsus (1493–1541).

Given a high enough dose even water is toxic (hyponatremia). So I don't doubt there could be some risk to using pine bedding.

I found a site that, on the surface, makes a good case for pine shavings being toxic. It has lots of citations of published research. However, I read several of the studies the author used and I didn't see the same things in the studies that she did.

For example, she says, "Even so, the most important takeaway of that study is this [quote from the study] 'The present study showed that the extracts of pine shavings of different geographic origin all are both highly toxic and rich in inducers.'..."

She concluded: All pine bedding is highly toxic
I concluded: concentrated extracts can be toxic to cells in a petrie dish.
So I reread the piece with a somewhat more critical eye.

She said, "...I used pine shavings for a full year ...I always suffered the effects of it—itchy nose, irritated sinuses, watery eyes, coughing, phlegm, and uncomfortable inhalation. I am apparently super sensitive to pine—my husband didn’t react like this."

That sounds more like an allergic reaction than a toxicity reaction.

I read enough of the studies she found to not be concerned enough to dig deeper (read the studies that cited these or that these cited, searching their key words, searching for other published work of any of the authors, ect). I use some pine shavings and intend to keep doing that. Although most of my bedding is maple leaves because I don't have to buy them.

If you do want lower risk (or different risks, maybe), I've seen aspen at tractor supply so I think your tractor supply can order it even if they don't normally carry it.

Other alternatives include used coffee grounds, hulls of various kinds, corn cob, and many others

 

[CrystalMosko]

I have seen conflicting information on the use of Pine Shavings in a Chicken coop and more importantly, for the cardboard box my 9 chicks are in. Please help me clear up this confusion. I have seen Pine listed as preferred shavings in a coop and for use with my new chicks. However, I have also seen the opposite. The following is an example:

Why are pine shavings unsafe for your chickens? Pine bedding is unsafe for chickens due to the damaging effects of abietic acid on the respiratory system, the damaging effects of terpene hydrocarbons and aromatic compounds on liver function, and the carcinogenic nature of pine dust.

I've heard/seen where others have used Pine for up-teen years without problems. I also know a guy who's uncle smoked until he was 83 without issue.... I was hoping to get the specific data so my wife and I can make that decision based on that. Same with Aspen - Good?, Bad?... The specific why/why not data would be great to know.

I have also seen that Cedar is also bad. What about Aspen Shavings? Most data indicates Aspen is Good for chicks/chickens - but that shredded paper is best for chicks. Is this accurate? I haven't seen Aspen Shavings for sale. Are they hard to find? Any idea where I can get them on a recurring basis? Southern States and Tractor Supply don't seem to have them.

Very Respectfully,

[email protected]

Hi Rob, I'm a very new chicken owner myself. One of the things I was told is (for chicks) the pine shavings aren't the best. I'm talking the SHAVINGS not the pine flakes. I DID end up using the pine flakes from Tractor Supply. The salesman at my Tractor Supply told me that the shavings are too fine for the little chicks and 'they can eat or inhale them and it's not a great scenario'. I didn't read this, it's just what the guy told me. So that is my penny's worth of information.