The Rhodebar thread!

[nicalandia]

How about Red Sussex instead of Red Orpington

Red sussex are just like RIR, the have the columbian restrictor Co and Co cant restrict E or ER birds, thats whay when you cross RIR x Barred Rock you will get mostly black Barred birds.. on the other hand Red or Buff orps have Many Columbian Restrictors one of them is the most powerful restrictor of them all, Db(Darkbrown) they can also have Co to help them out

Red Orps are just too expensive and rare at this point in the US. Thanks again

you can use buff orps instead of red ones, the have powerful restrictors, a F1xF1 should give you very nice autosexing birds(using the ER allele ofcourse not the eWh wheaten).

Your roo is similar to mine this is Benji he is a cross between a Buff Orpington Rooster and a Black Australorp hen.

from this site..https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...-whether-these-are-hens-or-cocks#post_9049724

keep in mind Buff orps have Mahogany in them(its also a columbian restrictor) so the F1s will come out looking darker than the buff parents...

here is my own Buff Cochin x ER brown red chick... he was ER/eWh Db/db+

Buff hen and Brown red game roo(ER birchen allele just like golden cuckoo maran)


Mother and son







Edit..

now that I think about it I may verywell do this cross myself, I just need to look for a barred/cuckoo barred Brown Red rooster and mate him to my Buff hen... instant Sexlinks....! and if I do it right I may end up with BuffBars...or CochBars..?

 

[tadkerson]

Is not autosexing part of the Rhodebar breed? If we breed to get Rhodebars that can't be autosexed have we really created true Rhodebars or just chickens that look like Rhodebars?

I guess I am just confused at how RIR and BPR were used to create the Rhodebar breed in the first place but now the RIR can't be used. Makes no sense to me, lol, but I am easily confused when it comes to genetics.

Rhodebar are autosexing when you have males with two barring genes and females with one barring gene. The males will have a lighter red color down than the darker down color on females. The auto-sexing is not as good with birds that are wheaten down. If a person worked a while with the down colors, they could improve the accuracy through selective breeding. Wild type is the best auto-sexing down color with very high accuracy.

Male rhode island red x female barred rock= F1 male

F1 male x female rhode island red= BC1F1 poorly barred red male and poorly barred red females + other birds the reds will be smutty and barred

BC1F1 male X female rhode island red = BC2F2 much better reds, barred males and females plus others

Cross the best BC2F2 male with the best BC2F2 females= males with two barring genes will be produced. Females will only have one barring gene. Females can only have one barring gene.

 

[nicalandia]

Wild type is the best auto-sexing down color with very high accuracy.

I would say, eb and ER are as good as wildtype,

 

[nicalandia]

Rhodebar are autosexing when you have males with two barring genes and females with one barring gene. The males will have a lighter red color down than the darker down color on females. The auto-sexing is not as good with birds that are wheaten down.

can we clear a few points for our friends Tim,

First point

1.Rhodebars are wildtype e+ not wheaten eWh

2. the effect of homozygous Barring on normal(none red enhanced) Wheaten birds is NONE existent, example: Delawares, Euskal Oiloa

3. the effect of Homozygous Barring on a Red enhanced birds(Mahogany) have not been documentated enough to make a case for using Wheaten as autosexing e locus in the presence of mahogany.


did you hatch any chick(out of your Red Barring project) that was homozygous for barring? I would love to see pics of your project birds when they were chicks, homozygous and heterozygous ones..

 

[melroseladi]

Rhodebar are autosexing when you have males with two barring genes and females with one barring gene. The males will have a lighter red color down than the darker down color on females. The auto-sexing is not as good with birds that are wheaten down. If a person worked a while with the down colors, they could improve the accuracy through selective breeding. Wild type is the best auto-sexing down color with very high accuracy.

Male rhode island red x female barred rock= F1 male

F1 male x female rhode island red= BC1F1 poorly barred red male and poorly barred red females + other birds the reds will be smutty and barred

BC1F1 male X female rhode island red = BC2F2 much better reds, barred males and females plus others

Cross the best BC2F2 male with the best BC2F2 females= males with two barring genes will be produced. Females will only have one barring gene. Females can only have one barring gene.

So I shouldn't take my annoying F1 cockerel to auction and just move forward on this project?

You say through selective breeding we could improve the accuracy. How would we do that? Once we have our double barred males and our single barred females, what coloring should we use to improve accuracy. A darker male over a lighter hen, or vice versa or something else? Hope that makes sense.

 

[nicalandia]

So I shouldn't take my annoying F1 cockerel to auction and just move forward on this project?

You say through selective breeding we could improve the accuracy. How would we do that? Once we have our double barred males and our single barred females, what coloring should we use to improve accuracy. A darker male over a lighter hen, or vice versa or something else? Hope that makes sense.

well there are many other genes that can lighten or dilute chick down, making sexing quite difficult, so far tim has already stated that his goal was not autosexing birds, this should tell you something, 1. he never intended his birds to be sexable at hatch, 2. he was not able to sex them at hatch.



Edit..
genes that can lighten chick down color on your project birds

a male chick Heterozygous for Mahogany will look like a female chick
a male chick Heterozygou for sex linked Barring will look like Female chick

other gene that could alter chick down(not related to this project)

Dominant white alleles, I/I^D/I^S

 

[tadkerson]

So I shouldn't take my annoying F1 cockerel to auction and just move forward on this project?

You say through selective breeding we could improve the accuracy. How would we do that? Once we have our double barred males and our single barred females, what coloring should we use to improve accuracy. A darker male over a lighter hen, or vice versa or something else? Hope that makes sense.

Its the down color that is important. I have hatched a bunch of rhode island red and the down color was different among the chicks. I can not tell you how to breed for the down color. You want to breed birds so that when you cross a male with a female the down color is sensitive to the barring gene. Two baring genes will be a diluted red while one baring gene will be a darker down color.

Tim

 

[15littlem]

Are all Crele colored birds auto-sexing? If not, then what breeds?

 

[Papa Brooder]

wow, I was gone for a few days and this thread blew up! if only I could understand half of what is being written. sounds like I need to do some extracurricular reading. guess I will be very content for now with my GFF rhodebars. first hatch is next week, chicks look great so far and developing well when I candle.

 

[melroseladi]

wow, I was gone for a few days and this thread blew up! if only I could understand half of what is being written. sounds like I need to do some extracurricular reading. guess I will be very content for now with my GFF rhodebars. first hatch is next week, chicks look great so far and developing well when I candle.

The more extracurricular reading and researching I do the more confused I get, lol.

Please take pics of the hatchlings so the rest of us will know just what Rhodebar chicks should look like.