Prevention of COCCIDIOSIS and other poultry diseases in chicks~ ACV.

[Beekissed]

The use of ACV~apple cider vinegar, is an oft repeated subject on this forum and the discussion is usually the same each time...no one knows how it works but some really vouch for its good effects on their flocks. I'll be the first to state that I wouldn't raise chickens without it's use anymore. I'm thoroughly convinced of its merits.

Here is a link about making vinegar and it has many interesting facts but the most significant for the subject on this post is on page 34 where it lists the many beneficial bacteria located in natural(not heat processed) vinegar~too many to list here!

http://silvalab.fsnhp.msstate.edu//vinegar_lactic.pdf

***If you look closely you will find on that list at least one bacteria, in particular, that might interest those who are fearful of cocci in new chicks and want to take steps to prevent it.****

Pediococcus acidilactici

, Salmonella, Clostridium difficile and Escherichia coli among small animals.

Pediococcus acidilactici has not been stated in any literature to have toxic effects. Another potential benefit of using them as Probiotics is their use as alternative medicines against infectious parasitic pathogens like Eimeria* in broiler-chicken [6].


Quote:
There is a wealth of information on the net about the beneficial bacterias present in the cultures that produce vinegar and many of the common bacteria that can sicken and kill humans and animals can be prevented from proliferating if vinegar is used. Botulism is one of these organisms, which is why vinegar has been used for many years in home preservation of foods.

Vinegar also has many vitamins and minerals that can provide valuable electrolytes and supplemental nutrition to growing birds, particularly those prone to dehydration like young chicks and the fast growing broiler breeds.


Quote: Minerals: as iron, manganese, calcium, copper, silicon, chlorine, sulphur, sodium, phosphorus and fluorine

amino acids and enzymes



Anyone else have good info about ACV that they would like to add?

 

[Beekissed]

Hi, what is the ratio of ACV to water? Is it 1 tbsp of ACV to 1 gallon water? Thank you.

It doesn't really matter...whatever amount your birds will tolerate. I never measure...I just tip the jug, allow a glug to flow and that's it. One glug for more water, a little glurp for little waterers.

The thing is, it doesn't take much vinegar to make a difference and any is better than none. You don't want to put so much that they won't drink the water or you see their beaks dissolve when they dip for a drink!

Just kiddin.... won't happen.

I'll tell you how I make more unpasteurized ACV right now. Before I had an orchard and could make my own but right now I don't have that, so I just buy regular store bought vinegar and add some of my Bragg's to it, leave the cap off and place it in a dark, room-temp place. Within a week you will see the swirl of the mother starting to build in the new jug. If you don't, add some apple juice to it so that the cultures have some sugar to get a boost and it will happen. I've never had to add the apple juice. When you see a new mother forming, you can cap it and store it somewhere out of the sunlight.

 

[laurenhill11245]

Probiotics build the intestinal flora of the gut, regular use of ACV doesn't. Your lack of reasoning and the realism attributable to prevention of Coccidiosis will eventually cause you to learn the hard way. Don't say I didn't warn you.

I find this debate of such quite interesting and see points on both sides. I wouldn't completely rule out ACV Michael, it contains certain bacteria needed for the fermentation process and health benefits of these bacteria are stated in many scientific journals (I too am at university, in fact I am almost finished, my degree is in biology specialising in microbiology) Here is one of many scientific journal articles- SH Lee, HS Lillehoj, RA Dalloul, DW Park, YH Hong (2007), Influence of Pediococcus- Based Probiotic on Coccidiosis in Broiler Chickens. Poultry Science 86: 63- 66. I can however also understand the point I think Michael is trying to make which is, don't always believe every "natural" cure will work.

However Michael ans any microbiologist can tell you, building up microorganisms in the digestive system can prevent gastrointestinal pathogens attaching to the epithelial cells because there simply isn't enough space, they can also change conditions of the gut so they are less preferable to the pathogen.

 

[liz9910]

Hi, what is the ratio of ACV to water? Is it 1 tbsp of ACV to 1 gallon water? Thank you.

 

[Beekissed]

I am so glad I read about the vinegar. My husband is retiring from the military after 29 years and about a zillion moves. So along with our four beautiful children ages four to eleven year (only one daughter), five cats (one is pregnant) whoops two, almost three dogs, one lizard, one husband and 15 chickens, we are finally, FINALLY!!!! retiring. I am almost afraid to say it too loud for fear the Army will PCS US SOMEWHERE. so long story short(too late) we have returned to my home state NC bought a small piece of land with a rambling 200 year old farm house with four acres of land.
After having been everywhere, i wanted to raise my children in my home state in the country, without the hustle and bustle of a big city. Somewhere you go to the garden for vegetables and the hen house for eggs. Now I can make my eggs (or my chickens will) with less chemicals and stress. My husband and boys built our coop, my daughter and I will can and bake, then head to town to sell our goods.
Thank you for the wonderful tip. Now after serving our country through several deployments, wars and moves, I feel it is time for us to raise our children with a healthy dose of country living. Thank you so much for the tip and please pass along any more you may have.

Thank your husband for all his years of fine service for our defense and give yourself a big hug for supporting him as the unsung hero, a military wife! I'm glad you finally get to settle down to a home life. You really might enjoy this thread:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...l-up-a-rockin-chair-and-lay-some-wisdom-on-us

 

[allieszoo]

Awesome post and thank you SO MUCH for posting this!!

I <3 ACV!!! I have been drinking it daily for YEARS so I always have some braggs ACV in the house. Will absolutely be putting some in the water this evening for the chicks.


on a side note -- if you mix about 1 tablespoon with 4 oz of water and a little bit of honey you have the *best* cough medicine (this is for humans BTW not chicks). I can't take most cold medications due to interactions with medication I take daily and someone told me about this remedy years ago and it works AMAZING. It has saved my sanity every cold season/allergy season. It will knock the cough out of you for a good 4 hours.

 

[Beekissed]

The misinformation never stops. If common disinfectants won't neutralize coccidiosis, what makes anyone think ACV will? The truth is it won't. Preventing the build-up of the protozoans in the intestinal tract is the only way a chicken can build immunity. Even then, an overwhelming number of protozoans will destroy a chickens digestive system. They don't have to be on soil to come in contact with it:

"Coccidial organisms survive in the environment because of their exceptional reproductive ability and because of the composition of the walls of their oocysts, which provides extraordinary survival abilities for significant periods of time. Oocysts are disseminated via the feces and litter but may also be disseminated in an airborne fashion, such as by movement of dust, and by vector organisms such as earthworms, beetles, flies, and other pests. Because it is standard practice in the poultry industry, for example, to reuse litter, coccidia in litter from previous infected flocks serves as a reservoir for future infections."
http://osdir.com/patents/Drug-compositions/Methods-compositions-control-coccidiosis-07048937.html

More information here:
http://www.thepoultrysite.com/articles/1138/coccidiosis-control

If anyone thinks they are being harmonious with nature by playing mother hen, I suggest you let your hens hatch your chicks and see what the mortality rate is. Those that are rearing chicks in a brooder to prevent a higher percentage of mortality, I suggest using Probiotic supplements regularly in the water to help build a strong and resistant digestive system. And for preventing and eliminating Coccidiosis, the only two effective substances for prevention of, and treatment for Coccidiosis are:
1. Amprolium
2. Sulfa drugs

Any doubts? Consult with any University that maintains a Poultry department.

Yes...because we know that the federally funded science(i.e. drug company funded) for poultry is soooooooo like a backyard environment in the controlled studies.

Any University? Please....just because it's supposed to be an institution on education, does not automatically follow that they have all the knowledge on the subject. No studies are being done on the efficacy of ACV because it is cheap and easily obtainable...nothing that will generate any money from those who would donate funds to ag science programs at universities so that their drugs can be constantly touted as the way to go in the agricultural world.

Please, peddle the drugs elsewhere....many people are finding the preventative properties of ACV, both for animals and for humans, and the proof is right in the back yard for many of us. Not in controlled studies done in a university ag lab. Be sorry? I've never had any cases of cocci overgrowth in my flocks, nor have I had any chick deaths from broody hatch or foster broody management. I've never been sorry about using ACV in my animal husbandry and I've had the healthiest flocks one could ever have...it's not just luck, it's called preventative management.

Save it for the college kids who don't know a real chicken from a chicken McNugget.

Let us "suffer the consequences" of our poor ignorant actions as we gaze upon our healthy livestock in the back yard.....

 

[Beekissed]

Quote:
Actually...it is. Why do you think so many people are trying to raise their own chickens on this site? Many are trying to escape the poisonous food system that you pharm based ag proponents have created over the years. Those who are interested in using ACV as a preventative..not as a treatment...are those who would like to get away from adding more chemicals in our foods.

No one's making you use the ACV, so why are you crying about it all? There are other threads about using drugs on your birds which you could frequent but you came here to argue and show all us country bumpkins how enlightened you are.

You've accomplished that...I, for one, am duly impressed by the ag/science education you have gotten and am quite satisfied that you will bring another generation of food into the market place full of the appropriate chemicals for everyone's consumption.

 

[Bogtown Chick]

How are you raising your chickens? Pets? Food source? Eggs only? or Dual purpose (meat and eggs?)
How is your set up and impact on the environment they are being raised on? . Many birds confined to a run long term? or short term? Free ranging over several acres with only a few birds?
If you are seeing them as a food source: do you mind chemicals, pharmacology treatments for them? Do you want them raised chemical free and when you see one going wayward your intention is to harvest?

These are all questions you need to ask yourself and take what you will from these excellent links. I think both sides prove themselves for whatever you want out of raising your chickens. As every chicken is it's own individual with it's own predisposition for illness...I guess the best we can do is to make our own choices for what works best for us and what we want to ingest or not to ingest.

Pharmacology has saved many a pet, and saved money to some extent raising mass numbers of birds in small places making them "affordable" to the general public. It's worked but with some cost. MRSA resistant bacteria etc as a bad side affect. Personally this is scary to me. The politics surround the food industry is scary to me. Our government has too much control on what we're eating.

I chose a more natural approach myself.

 

[Beekissed]

I'm glad you like it! You are the first!