Treatment for Peahen with possible infection

[Birdrain92]

Veterinarian books that are written and reviewed by other vets are usually highly credible. It's also good to get at least a second opinion when unsure.

 

[CrazyBirdLady7]

I appreciate everyone's help. I'm getting a bit confused and frustrated with the most recent threads about who's advice we can and cannot trust. If we can just focus on my bird and her specific issue, I think that will be the most helpful for me and others who may run into the same problem. I'll try to respond to the questions that were directed to me. I was advised by a bird expert friend that she had a fungal infection a few months ago cuz she had eaten some dirt from a plant that I had brought in from outside. I noticed after the fact that the dirt had mold on it which she most likely ingested. Plus, she hadn't been outside in a couple months. And yes, Kathy, this is the same bird that was sick last year. She is no where near as sick now as she was back then. I am one of those foolish ppl that mixed the 3 cc safeguard with a gallon of water. Are you saying I can give this to her straight? Do I give to her once a day for 5 days? I have no problem using a syringe to administer meds orally. If I were to purchase a different antibiotic, what should I get and what is the dosing amount and frequency? I would prefer NOT having to inject her with a needle if possible.

 

[KsKingBee]

It really depends on what you are needing to treat for as to what drug and dosage you need to administer.

When treating for round worms or cecal worms with Safeguard a single day dosage of two ml per adult peahen or three ml per adult peacock given orally and repeated in ten days is sufficient. If however you are trying to get all types of worms it is a five-day treatment and repeated in ten days. Documentation is posted on the previous page.

The problem you are facing is that you don't know what you need to treat for. You could rule out a lot of things with a fecal exam.

 

[Birdrain92]

I appreciate everyone's help. I'm getting a bit confused and frustrated with the most recent threads about who's advice we can and cannot trust. If we can just focus on my bird and her specific issue, I think that will be the most helpful for me and others who may run into the same problem. I'll try to respond to the questions that were directed to me. I was advised by a bird expert friend that she had a fungal infection a few months ago cuz she had eaten some dirt from a plant that I had brought in from outside. I noticed after the fact that the dirt had mold on it which she most likely ingested. Plus, she hadn't been outside in a couple months. And yes, Kathy, this is the same bird that was sick last year. She is no where near as sick now as she was back then. I am one of those foolish ppl that mixed the 3 cc safeguard with a gallon of water. Are you saying I can give this to her straight? Do I give to her once a day for 5 days? I have no problem using a syringe to administer meds orally. If I were to purchase a different antibiotic, what should I get and what is the dosing amount and frequency? I would prefer NOT having to inject her with a needle if possible.

Sorry for swaying the thread. Give it directly. If you want to kill all worms then you would worm for 5 days then skip 10 and then worm for another 5 days. You will only need to worm once a day. I would possibly go to a vet for something that can kill a fungus. Antibiotics are used to help fight infections caused by bacteria. I don't think antibiotics kill fungus. I would ask your vet for a fungicide to use in poultry for fungal infections.

 

[Garden Peas]

I appreciate everyone's help. I'm getting a bit confused and frustrated with the most recent threads about who's advice we can and cannot trust. If we can just focus on my bird and her specific issue, I think that will be the most helpful for me and others who may run into the same problem. I'll try to respond to the questions that were directed to me. I was advised by a bird expert friend that she had a fungal infection a few months ago cuz she had eaten some dirt from a plant that I had brought in from outside. I noticed after the fact that the dirt had mold on it which she most likely ingested. Plus, she hadn't been outside in a couple months. And yes, Kathy, this is the same bird that was sick last year. She is no where near as sick now as she was back then. I am one of those foolish ppl that mixed the 3 cc safeguard with a gallon of water. Are you saying I can give this to her straight? Do I give to her once a day for 5 days? I have no problem using a syringe to administer meds orally. If I were to purchase a different antibiotic, what should I get and what is the dosing amount and frequency? I would prefer NOT having to inject her with a needle if possible.

Ok, so the fact is, you don't actually know whether it was a fungal infection last year. There's no lab work, and no vet opinion, and a suspicion the hen ate dirt and got sick from it. Eating dirt (even moldy dirt) is not necessarily going to give a bird a fungal infection -- no idea how your expert came to the conclusion that it was. Peas dig around in the dirt and take sunbaths in the dirt and roll in the dirt to rid themselves of parasites and actually live in pens with dirt floors... and don't routinely get fungal infections. Before I believed a bird had a fungal infection, I'd want vet confirmation and lab work. And a darned good explanation.

Now two things that are much more frequently associated with dirt are coccidia and blackhead. Coccidia can be treated with amprolium or sulmet, blackhead gets treated with metronidazole, which will kill the protozoa that cause blackhead and which live inside earthworms and other icky places. Different illnesses, treated with different meds. Parasitic worms get treated with Safeguard and Valbazen and a few other wormers (some more effective than others), again, DIFFERENT ILLNESSES NEED DIFFERENT MEDS!

I strongly suggest that you have a vet look at this bird, that you run fecal samples (which can pick up various parasites) and you not just randomly treat hoping to "hit" whatever it is. The multiple doses per day oregano oil & garlic stuff could make the bird sick or cause organ damage -- herbal remedies are NOT always safe, and it is quite possible to overdo them. All the normal probiotics in the bird's system may have been knocked out with the garlic/oregano cocktail, which can lead to watery or loose poo all by itself, as well as interfere with digestion.

I'm still worrying about whether this bird has been getting actual grit in her diet or not? It sounds as though she may only have gotten oyster shell, which is not adequate for grinding and digesting food. Those totally undigested "wax worms" (whatever the heck those are???) convinced me that there is not proper digestion going on. The range of conditions which can cause that is enormous, from no longer having any gut bacteria to not enough grit in the diet, to damaged gut function from parasites or protozoa. I'm not sure whether the bird is even sick, or whether the treatments are making the bird sick. I'm still wondering if she's getting herself into laying condition and looks "sick" because it's a different posture.

It's all very well and good to worm the bird -- Safeguard is generally safe. She can have 2 ml of Safeguard liquid spread on bits of bread, once a day for 5 days, repeated (as explained by earlier folks). But at this point, if you believe the bird is ill, take it to the vet and explain the whole story AND be sure to tell the vet about ALL the remedies, including the herbal ones, so the vet can give you his or her best advice.

Good luck.

 

[Garden Peas]

Sorry for swaying the thread. Give it directly. If you want to kill all worms then you would worm for 5 days then skip 10 and then worm for another 5 days. You will only need to worm once a day. I would possibly go to a vet for something that can kill a fungus. Antibiotics are used to help fight infections caused by bacteria. I don't think antibiotics kill fungus. I would ask your vet for a fungicide to use in poultry for fungal infections.

Not only do antibiotics NOT kill fungal & yeast infections, they can create or facilitate conditions which are perfectly suited to yeast & fungal infections. Antibiotics are notorious for setting up conditions which lead to fungi and/or yeast overgrowth. That's one of the numerous issues with random use or not clinically indicated use of antibiotics, and can occur even if antibiotics are used correctly.

Antifungal meds can be pretty hard on the system too -- best to know specifically what the problem is before throwing lots of different treatments at an unidentified illness.

 

[Garden Peas]

It really depends on what you are needing to treat for as to what drug and dosage you need to administer.

When treating for round worms or cecal worms with Safeguard a single day dosage of two ml per adult peahen or three ml per adult peacock given orally and repeated in ten days is sufficient. If however you are trying to get all types of worms it is a five-day treatment and repeated in ten days. Documentation is posted on the previous page.

The problem you are facing is that you don't know what you need to treat for. You could rule out a lot of things with a fecal exam.

I would click "thumbs up" on this if I could, but I wore out my clicker on the home parasitology thread this morning.

I totally, 100%, completely agree with @KsKingBee here.

 

[Trefoil]

As Cathy has pointed out, the way to tell if an animal is sick is to keep track of its weight.
oil of oregano is a potent anti fungal, as well as an antibiotic, and anti bacterial and is usually used in conjunction with probiotics. Unless she is still losing or not gaining weight I would concentrate on giving her enough of the proper diet and continue to monitor her weight/condition. I personally prefer to feed the higher protein (28%) gamebird because I also feed fermented feed and tend to add everything but the kitchen sink to it and this allows me not to worry about lowering the protein too much. Because wormers are notorious for becoming ineffective over time,what works great for me this year may not work for you (in a different location or dosage) at all. That makes it imperative that you check your results via a fecal done after worming every year or two. The best would be to check before and a week or two after, but if you can only do it once, then do it to make sure the wormer you are using is working. If you are dosing with ivermectin on the skin, it MUST be applied on the skin, not the feathers.

 

[thndrdancr]

Ok I would rule out cocci and probably blackhead. The oregano oil kills cocci, that much is confirmed by studies. I would stop with it though right now, it CAN deplete magnesium and she might need to rebuild gut flore/good bacteria. I have had luck with it with keeping blackhead at bay too, with multiple doses so that is also unlikely. Even if it was fungal it should have taken care of that. I use it too, for a lot of things.

I would be worried about getting more magnesium and calcium in her system, ok? Make sure she has grit AND oyster shell available. You might crush some TUMS up in her food, it will give her a calcium boost. I believe calcium and magnesium go hand in hand, any ideas on boosting magnesium levels people?

 

[Birdrain92]

Ok I would rule out cocci and probably blackhead. The oregano oil kills cocci, that much is confirmed by studies. I would stop with it though right now, it CAN deplete magnesium and she might need to rebuild gut flore/good bacteria. I have had luck with it with keeping blackhead at bay too, with multiple doses so that is also unlikely. Even if it was fungal it should have taken care of that. I use it too, for a lot of things.

I would be worried about getting more magnesium and calcium in her system, ok? Make sure she has grit AND oyster shell available. You might crush some TUMS up in her food, it will give her a calcium boost. I believe calcium and magnesium go hand in hand, any ideas on boosting magnesium levels people?

Magnesium helps absorb calcium as well as vitamin D. Vitamin D can be from being in the sunlight, magnesium can be found in your leafy greens, seeds, and legumes like alfalfa and clover. Plants need magnesium so it would also make sense that plants will have it but some plants, as the ones I listed are higher in magnesium as well as others.